TSA, does it have the right?

Too many posts to reply to individually when my message to the majority is the same, please stop over dramatising and exaggerating; a pat down isn't the same as some random man on the street sticking his hands down your wifes pants and the simple fact that people even try to make the comparision is a massive sign of ignorance and blighted perception.

Arguments such as "a random person touching you on the street" are also redundant, the TSA staff or any other police/security/military personel are doing their job to protect you.

Once again, what do you narrow minded wimps suggest? We don't put into place any security measures because we may offend prudes and thus risk a terrorist attack happening? Seriously.....

reply to post by Death_Kron


What are the body scanner and invasive pat down doing in terms of security that metal detectors and wands aren't doing? If they are broken, then why are those security measures still in use and people are only "randomly" selected for the additional measures?

reply to post by Death_Kron


How about less governmental interference in commerce and leave security up to the individual?

Whats it like to willingly bend over whenever the government tells you to?

Originally posted by Death_Kron


Once again, what do you narrow minded wimps suggest? We don't put into place any security measures because we may offend prudes and thus risk a terrorist attack happening? Seriously.....

Wimp? Who's the one crying for protection?

There has not been an incident on a domestic USA flight since 9-11 where a terroist smuggled something on to a plane...and that was before the groping and fondling started....the wands seemed to work fine.

Both the shoe bomber and underwear bomber boarded over seas flighst in rout to the USA so it was over seas security that failed...But amazingly here in the USA after the shoe bomber we now all have to take of our shoes and now with the underwear bomber we now get groped and fondled or have a naked picture taken of us.

What the TSA needs to be do is profiling for terrorist like the Israeli's do it...instead they are just trying to find STUFF on people that could be used in a terrorist act. The terrorist will always be one step ahead if the TSA is always looking for stuff and not terrorist.

I haven't followed this "disaster" closely, so please forgive my ignorance.

Am I understanding that you only get patted down if you refuse to go through one
of the x-ray machines?

reply to post by elevatedone


As I understand it - yes - if one "opts-out" of the body scanners, than a mandatory pat-down is the next step. The mandatory pat-down is now "enhanced" and thus, more intrusive than before (as of Oct. 2010, I believe) hence the public outcry...

I don't get it. Why not just walk through the "machine" then.
It's not going to hurt you, is it?

I think people are just wanting something to complain about and a majority have
chosen this.

I'll be flying this spring, possibly before, heck, bring on the x-ray, I don't care.

reply to post by elevatedone


Yes they "randomly" choose passengers and ask them to go through the body scanner. If someone refuses, then they are allowed to opt for a pat down. If they refuse that, they are threatened with a $10,000 fine and are told they cannot leave the airport until they have passed through security. Everyone that isn't selected, goes through the metal detector as usual.

I have heard anecdotal stories of certain women that most would consider as good looking being chosen more often than not.

Once again, I'll answer three posts in one reply.

Metal detectors do not detect ceramic weapons, and that's just for starters...

People are not being "randomly" targetted...

Just because a terror attack hasn't happened since *insert date here* is that justification that because it hasn't happened we don't need to protect against the possibility?

Get a grip please, a pat down is a pat down. It's ridiculous to see people making the comparision to essentially sexually abusing their spouse...

Originally posted by elevatedone
I don't get it. Why not just walk through the "machine" then.
It's not going to hurt you, is it?

I think people are just wanting something to complain about and a majority have
chosen this.

I'll be flying this spring, possibly before, heck, bring on the x-ray, I don't care.

Exactly!

reply to post by janon


Simply.... Why would you refuse?

Originally posted by BigTimeCheater
reply to post by Death_Kron

 

How about less governmental interference in commerce and leave security up to the individual?

leave security up to the individual?
there are some things ONLY government can do, and security is one of them.
leaving security up to airlines or individual airports would be a joke as we'd have literally hundreds of varied levels of security; the bad guys would identify the weak ones and use them to access the big flights.
the idea is to have uniform HIGH security. as has been pointed out, we've had no major incidences since 9/11.

reply to post by elevatedone


Yes basically right now you have the opportunity to "Opt out" of the backscatter imaging machine and submit to a very invasive pat down where they swipe the outsides and insides of your extremities, feel inside the waste band of your pants and for lack of better words fondle your genitals and private areas in the search of objects that do not belong on the body. If you're not comfortable with this too bad you've already started the process and are subject to a $11,000.00 fine if you refuse, also you don't get to fly, or get a refund on your ticket.

There are no disclaimers anywhere on the ticket, verbally spoken or at the security booth. The TSA agents are lower wage personnel that are NOT trained properly in security methods and are not professional in most instances.

The DHS Secretary Janet Napolitano has said in press conferences that if you don't like it don't fly. They believe that the 4th amendment does not apply because it is the government keeping you safe. The machines and pat downs have been PROVEN INEFFECTIVE by testers with fake bomb parts getting through. They claim that the images in the scanners are deleted immediately and not saved which has been PROVEN FALSE with 35,000 naked body images showing up in some airports. There has been a multitude of backlash where they basically make you submit to this with bully tactics of if you don't do it you'll be criminalized in the court of law.

reply to post by Stryker Ops


Then don't "opt out" of the scanner if you feel that strongly about the incredibly invasive pat down search that will be performed on you as a result

I presume the majority of people who share your "argument" have never been searched by the police...

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by janon

 

Simply.... Why would you refuse?

You completely failed to answer my question.

Originally posted by janon

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by janon

 

Simply.... Why would you refuse?

You completely failed to answer my question.

Touche

Nothing to hide then nothing to fear, it's not difficult is it really?

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by janon

 

Simply.... Why would you refuse?

Really now?

Lets see...is it maybe because the machines take naked pictures of you and some people on religious or moral grounds object? Or maybe because there has not been thorough testing on the machines to know exactly how much radiation they expose us to?

They say that the low level beam does deliver a small dose of radiation to the body but because the beam concentrates on the skin - one of the most radiation-sensitive organs of the human body - that dose may be up to 20 times higher than first estimated.

Source

Hmmm....radiation exposure 20 times higher than first estimated....Dont you think they need to be tested a little more thoroughly?

reply to post by Death_Kron


The betterment of your false sense of security is not worth the reality of my rights being infringed upon. If being safe from terrorists means we have to be summarily stripped of our rights to privacy (in regards to our own bodies, of all things... the one freaking thing on this planet we own outright!), then exactly what are we keeping safe from "them?" Wasn't the entire point of Islamofascist terrorism the attack on America's freedom? Seems like any attack on freedom which leads to the attacked taking away freedoms is a victory for terrorists.

Given a choice between the slight chance of a plane full of people getting blown out of the sky and the surety of some sick perverted creep that works for the government feeling up my wife or kids, I'm gonna have to choose to play the odds game and keep my fingers crossed while keeping my family safe from TSA predators. And, just to nip something in the bud, my family and I no longer fly nor will we until this outrage ends.

Originally posted by Death_Kron
Nothing to hide then nothing to fear, it's not difficult is it really?

I can't even begin to explain how much statements like that sicken me to the core.