The death of faith in the ultimate victory of good over evil.

I knew that power oriented people are currently dominating the halls of power on Earth.

But I never knew that it was possible that the forces of evil-power might be predominate in the universe, and not just this physical plane. I'm not frightened by this possibility, just very sad that it might be true.

I would like to ask people that are proponents of conventional religions to not reply to this question. Has your research and your personal experiences left you doubting that good is sure to win out over the forces of power-evil?

reply to post by droid56


There is no war between good and evil. Mostly because the idea of a "good in opposition to an evil" is a mistake. There is a reason God didnt want us to have the "knowledge of good and evil." And the word "sin" originally meant "to miss the mark" or to err. Its because dualism, or that splitting of "what is" into pieces is problematic for us. It causes us no end of emotional upset, hate, and other unpleasant feelings.

When you "fight for the light" or the "forces of good," just by naming "good" you create its opposite, "evil." By picking part of what is, and calling it "this" you make the rest of it "that." You make what is whole and perfect, divided and separate. So, in that way, all you fighters for the light are the source of all evil. Everything just "is." We need not be at war with anything.

God? I see no signs of this being-force.

reply to post by droid56


He's right there next to the pile of "evil force."

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by droid56

 

There is no war between good and evil. Mostly because the idea of a "good in opposition to an evil" is a mistake. There is a reason God didnt want us to have the "knowledge of good and evil." And the word "sin" originally meant "to miss the mark" or to err. Its because dualism, or that splitting of "what is" into pieces is problematic for us. It causes us no end of emotional upset, hate, and other unpleasant feelings.

When you "fight for the light" or the "forces of good," just by naming "good" you create its opposite, "evil." By picking part of what is, and calling it "this" you make the rest of it "that." You make what is whole and perfect, divided and separate. So, in that way, all you fighters for the light are the source of all evil. Everything just "is." We need not be at war with anything.

Dang mad props there.

Was going to say something similar, but do not think I could put it in better words than that.

reply to post by droid56


Without a doubt,,,rest assured my friend.

Keep it up, and I will eradicate your evil philosophy and kick you in the rear for your lack of faith.

Cheers from the "Ways and Means" Committee.

So you see, there's nothing to fear but fear itself. If you acknowledge all being as it should be, and have faith in all that is as being perfect and right (i.e., as it should be), then you should have no trouble holding onto that faith and weathering whatever conditions befall us during this most interesting time in this experience. It will be bumpy at times, but have faith that it is illusion, as it is, and know that things are not as they seem but that they are, again, as they should be.

Get the point?

reply to post by CosmicEgg


That was a very good way to explain it.

But because of this rule ..."TextNo 1-Liners: Please do not create minimal "me too," "I agree," or similar very-short replies. (Adding "second line" to short comments doesn't count.)"...

i will add my opinoin; Everything after this comment is useless.

well there is more then good and evil, but neither good or evil will acknowledge that.

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander
reply to post by droid56 There is no war between good and evil. Mostly because the idea of a "good in opposition to an evil" is a mistake. There is a reason God didnt want us to have the "knowledge of good and evil."

The consciousness of the 'thinker', which is what is in operation in the above quote, is, not surprisingly, misinterpreting the symbolism of the Revelation of Genesis 3.

The "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" refers to the consciousness of the "self", which originates in the "primeval serpent, the great dragon, the devil or Satan which deceived the whole world" 'movement' of self-reflection. This is the origin of the duality. Once that duality originates, it cannot simply be ignored or disregarded. That is an illusion.

And, in opposition to the "tree of the knowledge of good and evil" there is the "Tree of Life" (Genesis 3:24) which consists of the Revelation of Knowledge through the Vision of the "Son of man" or the "Vision of Knowledge" in the Thanksgiving Hymns of the Dead Sea Scrolls and refers to a completely different dimension of consciousness than the consciousness of the "self"; that is, a consciousness which has been Created 'by and in the image of God'.

Strictly speaking, then, the conflict is not so much between "good and evil" as occurring at the level of consciousness itself: between the consciousness Created 'by and in the image of God' and the 'fallen' consciousness of the "self" and the 'thinker'.

And, for those who are offended at the theological terminology, this very same conflict is described in the non-theistic Eastern esoteric traditions such as Buddhism and the writings of J. Krishnamurti as a conflict between the non-dualistic consciousness and the dualistic or phenomenal consciousness.

This, by the way, is what is being manifested in the space-time reality at this very moment as the conflict over Jerusalem; which is, fundamentally, a conflict between these dimensions of consciousness; a conflict 'clothed with the fig leaves' (Genesis 3:7) of both theological doctrines and political ideologies.

Mi cha el

The problem with the theory of duality explained here is that it's basic philosophy plain and simple.

Things can exist without other things. Squares can exist without circles, blue can exist without red, etc. etc.

If you have a room which is perfectly illuminated in all points, then there is no darkness in the room. This is infallible logic therefore if everything is illuminated. Apply this logic on a universal scale, darkness wouldn't exist just because light did.

The same can be said of good and evil, if people were only ever good, it doesn't make evil automatically exist. There are Laotian tribes who do not understand the concept of a lie, they only speak the truth. Truth doesn't make lies real.

If the concept of dualism is properly understood it is about the splitting of the divine and then the reconstitution of the individual parts into a whole again, with the dominant part becoming the head of the whole. God understanding God as it were.

So yes, technically 'evil' could be stronger than 'good' but these again are very hard to define.

There is no such thing as karma, and the ptb do what ever they want and know it does not matter. These people are pure evil, and shows you in gaza.

The anglo american empire is behind what happens in gaza, and the problem is not as hard as you think for them to fix, as they create the problems.

Just pure evil exists,a nd anyone with a good heart gets called retarded or something, and do peopel want to destroy anyone with goodness in them, of course they do. Just turn on the tv,a nd you will see all the rubbish on there mesmerising you lot.

We live in a world where priests are not taught that evil exists anymore, and where did they get that idea, oh yep tv as well. Do you not think priests also watch tv and get mesmerised by it also, like you people?

Just the fact that gaza exists and is there and the anglo american empire is behind it shows, that true evil exists. But of course you lot will watch the daily show, and laugh at peopel being tortured, lol, and killed, like its some sort of fiction, when the daily show deals in transmtting news as laughter.

When did the news become entertainment?

Always remember i was at school in 1991 and the gulf war was on tv and we could watch the good old anglo american empire smash who ever they want to bits, for entertainment. The first time news became entertainment in uk. People actually applauded the fact that america could send missiles down chimneys, lol, there still killing people, but peopel are just so detached from it. Amazing.

These people know karma does not exist, and all of them will do what ever it takes to make sure they get where they are going. Imagine all those peopel in india, who believe in positive thinking and karma, where just duped, as pure evil runs this world period.

I think some times good and what everyone percieves to be good comes out on top, but very rarely. Peopel really love to destroy, and they seem to get a lust for it, and an energy from it.

You ask people of conventional religions to not reply, then frame your question in terms of good and evil. How can you frame it as such with out some belief, some faith that defines good and defines evil?

Even if you do not believe in God or Buddha or Allah or whomever, if you see someone beat a defenseless old woamn and take her money...is the attacker good or evil? I say evil, but what do you say?

Many of the guidelines we use to define good and evil are found in the conventional religions. What we do not have without religion,... what we do not have without faith... is HOPE.

Be it faith in your fellow man, or faith in God, or a god, or gods. Hope is what sees you to the end. Without hope, we have no tommorow, and no real drive to face tommorow, or to face oppression, or tyrrany, or hunger, or pain....

This is what frames your post and question, you have no hope that good will conquer evil. I believe that good does conquer evil...even when outnumbered, encircled, and surrounded... evil may have the upper hand temporarily, BUT good will when in the end.

Now, there are those "enlightened and free minded" individuals that will poo-poo such notions, but if you read their posts...you will find an underlying cynacism and anger and resentment...even jealousy of those that have faith and therefore have hope.

My faith is established on faith, hope, and love...my faith tells me that there will be dark times, even when it looks like evil will win...but to be patient and long suffering, for good will triumph in the end.

All I ask is that you do not give up on the good in men's hearts nor a faith based on a God in heaven.

The potency of the Light and all it represents - Love, Warmth, Peace - is more powerful than the potency of the Dark and all it represents - Hate, Coldness, War. This is because the former's qualities lead to Production and Development; whereas the latter qualities lead to Division and Destruction. If one goes by empirical evidence then I would say Evil triumphs over Good because the world around me currently confirms that statement. But deep within my Soul I know that even the most evil of beings have at minimum a tiny shred of goodness inside them. The question is: can you help them see this truth?

Originally posted by droid56
Has your research and your personal experiences left you doubting that good is sure to win out over the forces of power-evil?

No not at all because this universe is the location of the Fallen 1z (the 1/3) rebellious Angels who left the Heavens to rule their own kingdoms. This is why the universe is overwhelmed with what you call evil but I consider energy. Because this is their "home" to rule under Satan who rules the fallen 1/3 Angels and their creations (some evil aliens). Now 1 could feel some type of way like well where is GOD at and 1 has to remember their was a period when we were within EDIN SAFE ABLE TO COMMUNICATE DIRECTLY WITH THE GOD, but we failed genetically and allowed the evil as you call it to take over our minds. By defying GOD and his plans for humanity mankind has become residents within this kingdom for a period of time under the EYE of the creator. So yes it seems any species within this realm will be overwelmed by what you call evil if the species developes a humble approach to its way of existing.

1 must not forget there are 2/3 Angels remaining in the HEAVENS who are more powerful then these who govern this lil universe, lol where is that drain at. Anyway and these 2/3 may have been given the ok to spawn/create within the EYE of the creator within perfection and their creations may be more of what you may consider "GOOD" THEY ARE NOT FROM WITHIN THIS DARK REALM THEY ARE FROM OUTSIDE THIS LIL UNIVERSE. So dont lose FAITH and stay strong hey what can be the worst to go wrong they kill you (free you)and they get tagged for later destruction as they continue to exist and rule. SEE WEAK EVIL SATANS EVIL IS POWER DRIVEN-EGOTISTICAL-ATTENTION WHORISH. So yes Satan is evil, but also has an agenda and that is to rule within this lil universe BUILT UNDER THE CREATOR. So Satan wants to EXIST in the minds and hearts and souls of many to feel how should 1 say IMPORTANT LOL and thats its weakness (non to rule then 1 become = to all satan doesnt like being = to anything he wants to be powerfull (BETTER). For true EVIL/GOOD has no agenda just does what comes natually. Like existing within both energy forms in peace mode until weak evil is detected then in destruction mode THIS ENERGY GOES. Satan you wanna build and create??? evil/good energies (BALANCE) hmm WHY? Are you the creator of EXISTANCE, no satan your not so when your kingdoms are located WHY should they exist at all WHY SHOULD BALANCE CARE FOR YOUR CREATIONS THEY ARE FLAWED. PURE EVIL/GOOD HAS NO AGENDA TO RULE MAKING THIS MORE POWERFULL THEN THE WHO WISHES TO HAVE ETERNAL FAME.

So my friend GOD BLESS ALL MEN, AMEN AND DONT LOSE FAITH. Remember the story of Pandoras box and how much negativity came out and what was last HOPE. It is just the way of the creator to allow them to do their negative deeds because the creator created the negative fallenz and doesnt want to see them casted and has given them time AND YET THEY STILL SEEK POWER and ignore his Earth warnings to BOW DOWN. So be patient if the DEMONS show, WAR WITH THEM TILL THE LAST OF THEIR ESSENCE IS GONE. Dont allow fear to have your conscious to think about death think about their destruction and move on it LITE YOUR FLAME INTERNALLY AND STAY PREPARED.. YOU WILL ALL SEE THEY ARE NOT THAT POWERFULL BECAUSE THE POWER SEEKING IN THEM WAS AN EMBEDDED WEAKNESS

Peace my friend and dont mind them lol they are snacks to Dragons

S&F

Another way to look at it;

Evil is destruction, death, repulsion, hate.

Good is construction, life, attraction, love.

This entire universe would not exist if good didn't prevail constantly. The only reason the universe exists is because good (construction) is more powerful than evil (destruction). If evil (destruction) was more powerful than good (construction), this entire universe would not have been constructed.

Humans, birds, fish, dogs, cows, insects, trees, plants, ALL life in the universe are all parts of this universe. They are all parts of the whole. All life IS the universe. YOU are the universe. Now notice how all life on Earth is born to survive. Life adapts to different environments, and evolves, and learns, and fights to survive. This universe as a whole is fighting to survive, and it is winning over death. It is obviously in the universe's best interest to stay alive. Anything which tries to destroy the life of this universe is going to be over powered and over come by life, because life will adapt. Life always prevails as seen throughout Earth.

This all is because of attraction. Attraction is the preferred state. Take two magnets and put both north poles together and they will repel from each other. Then one of the two magnets will want to flip over so they can attract each other. The magnets prefer to attract, not to repel. ALL atoms and molecules are tiny magnets, even the atoms and molecules that make up your body, and all the physical universe. Light itself is magnetic. All of it prefers attraction over repulsion.

That is why love always prevails over hate. Love is preferred over hate. Hate feels wrong, it's repulsive. But everyone loves love. Who doesn't love love? Love is attractive, everyone wants to be loved. People seek love. Life seeks love. The universe seeks love. Without love (good, construction, attraction), nothing would exist.

Good always prevails. No doubt about it.

Originally posted by gift0fpr0phecy
Another way to look at it;

Evil is destruction, death, repulsion, hate.

Good is construction, life, attraction, love.

This entire universe would not exist if good didn't prevail constantly. The only reason the universe exists is because good (construction) is more powerful than evil (destruction). If evil (destruction) was more powerful than good (construction), this entire universe would not have been constructed.

This is an interesting position. I say this because of what many cosmologists see as the endgame for the Universe. A Big Crunch, a Heat Death, a Big Rip, etc.

Assuming you accept one of these theories, and your own definitions of good and evil, one is forced logically to concede that while good prevails constantly in a young universe, eventually evil gets the upper hand and prevails.

Unless of course you're Frank Tipler.

Originally posted by ShadowScholar The problem with the theory of duality explained here is that it's basic philosophy plain and simple.

Of course, there is a philosophical duality.

But the origin of that duality must be recognized as occurring prior to thought altogether.

That origin--the 'movement' of self-reflection which occurs, thus creating the "self"/"not self"--is the fundamental reason why the philosophical duality is so intensely tenacious.

It is hard-wired into the very structure of the individual consciousness; so much so that, when people assert that there are, in fact, three different perspectives on any issue, it causes a sensation of pain at the psychological level because it threatens the very structure of the dualistic consciousness itself. People thus become seduced to a liberal/conservative paradigm, or a Republican/Democrat paradigm, or a theist/atheist paradigm, or a Sadducee/ Pharisee paradigm, etc. etc. etc.

The approach of the Buddhists is to assert that there is a non-dualistic frame of reference or dimension of consciousness which is outside of and prior to the dualistic consciousness altogether.

Mi cha el

Originally posted by Michael Cecil

The approach of the Buddhists is to assert that there is a non-dualistic frame of reference or dimension of consciousness which is outside of and prior to the dualistic consciousness altogether.

Mi cha el

It certainly isnt limited to Buddhists, though their writings are perhaps clearer than some, but there is a way "out" of dualism, despite your earlier argument. (Jesus tries to get you there too, by imploring you to blur the lines by not judging, by seeing enemy and neighbor as self, etc.) And it is essentially what you are saying, you let yourself "Be" the awareness in the immediate, the experiencer before judging it, elaborating upon it, etc. mentally, rather identify with the "self reflection" you are talking about. The whole magic of Tolle's "Now," which is his very worthwhile contribution to elaborating the unspeakable.

And in reference to your earlier reply, all posts, including yours, are written by the thinker. Getting huffy about it is pointless. Nothing that can be said about the "Truth" with a capital T is in fact the whole non dualistic truth. This is because thought, speech, writing, are dualistic. Plato refused to even try to elaborate these truths directly. Others do it in poems, or other evocative language, allegory, etc. to try to get around the dualistic nature of language.

Originally posted by Illusionsaregrander And in reference to your earlier reply, all posts, including yours, are written by the thinker.

This is what the consciousness of the 'thinker' assumes.

It assumes that, whenever it is reading words, those words were written by a consciousness of a 'thinker'.

Why?

Because, to the consciousness of the 'thinker', there is no other dimension of consciousness.

It is of the very essence of the consciousness of the 'thinker' to deny that there is any other dimension of consciousness. This is necessary for its own self-preservation.

What I am saying is that much of what Krishnamurti said and wrote is not said or written by the consciousness of the 'thinker' at all. And, if you necessarily assume that it is, you are missing the entire point.

Similarly for Genesis, which was not written by a consciousness of a 'thinker' at all; but by another dimension of consciousness altogether: a dimension of consciousness which has received Revelations from God.

Nothing that can be said about the "Truth" with a capital T is in fact the whole non dualistic truth. This is because thought, speech, writing, are dualistic.

Let me suggest that you at least try to read to some of the teaching of Krishnamurti.

He explains the difference between thought and observation.

The term "Truth" is not used, because that raises the issue of "Falsehood".

The differentiation is made on the basis of what can be actually observed vs. what cannot be observed.

Plato refused to even try to elaborate these truths directly. Others do it in poems, or other evocative language, allegory, etc. to try to get around the dualistic nature of language.

Precisely my point.

If I were writing poetry here, you could not say that that was being written by a 'thinker'. It would be written by a "self" rather than a 'thinker'.

And it is possible for there to be writings by a non-dualistic consciousness as well.

Mi cha el