Republican Lies Begin

reply to post by PayMeh


This does seem to be the gripe of many. They tend to lump in the cost of health care with the quality of it. They are NOT, the same and that is the hardest part for someone to grasp, I think...

The quality of the United States Health Care System if unsurpassed. We are the leader in: Innovations and care. Hands down. I can't get anyone to tell me who innovates more for the medical field!

Putting Health Care in the hands of our Gummint, is economic suicide! Let us keep in mind that this is the same gummint that has run Social Security into the ground, bankrupt the Federal Reserve, tanked on Medicaid/care, folded Amtrakk and all other public transit systems!

To me, it makes simple sense to keep their grimy mits off of my body!

reply to post by jrod


Sorry. Wrong again.
In 2003, of the roughly 3,900 nonfederal, short-term, acute care general hospitals in the United States, the majority—about 62 percent—were nonprofit.

Source

Have you ever stepped foot in a hospital in the United States? Do you not know how the triage system works? I'm dead serious. I would like to know.

Steps:
- Walk into ER and tell the receptionist you need to be seen. She briefly asks you whats wrong. Return to seat.
- Triage Nurse calls you back to take your blood pressure and vitals. Again asks you what's wrong. SHE HAS NO RECORD, of if you have insurance or not. That is admissions that handles that.
- You are called back into the ER and given a room or bed.m Still, NO RECORD, if you are insured or not.

In short, your insurance records are not handled by the doctors and nurses. It is the Admissions and financial office that handles it.

You are arguing facts my friend. I also have first hand experience, on going, with our GREAT Health Care system. I was diagnosed with Testicular and Pelvic Cancer in March 2008.

reply to post by PayMeh


Yeah, that is why I said you have to be rich to afford it lol. The prices are outrageous, and even just a doctor's visit costs a bluecollar like me a whole days pay. Dentists are even worse, I have blown over a weeks pay in under an hour, it is insanity. I spent over 5 grand on my mouth, and still need more work done.

Originally posted by NeverApologize
reply to post by TKDRL

 

You have to be rich to walk into an ER and be treated?
You have to be rich to use a Mayo Clinic?
You have to be rich to use an Urgent Care Clinic?

Sorry. You can not be turned away because of inability to pay. Also, 90% of specialists offer a payment plan.

No you do not have to be rich to be treated, but you do have to be rich to be treated in a timely fashion and get really good solid care.

Here in the state of Louisiana, they have a "free" health care system. You prove your income and if you can not pay, you don't, but you will still get care. Due to an issue I am having that will require surgery, I went to the local hospital. This has been an ongoing issue for years, so of course I brought all my medical records with me that concerned the issue including MRI reports, various specialist, etc etc.

This happened 2 years ago and to this day I am not any closer to having the surgery I need, and I can pay. I put myself on a payment plan and refused to even apply for any "free" care. Meanwhile, the hospital has found every reason they can to put off the procedure. Every excuse you can imagine, from the MRI is too old, we need more test, if you can think of it they have said it. Even the Doctor who is seeing me is trying to find ways to cut corners and get this thing done.

If you asked me if the US has the best health care in the world, I would have nothing to compare it to from personal experience, but I know my good friend in South Korea (and he is from the USA and only been overseas for 2 years) would take South Korea's health care over the US without a second thought. In my opinion, paying through the nose for years and years and still not being able to get the procedure done....well just about anything has to be better.

Even non-profit hospitals turn a profit.

Last time I went to the ER I had insurance, there was a waiting full of people with minor injuries as was mine and I was seen almost immediately, I asked the nurse why that was and she told me it was because I was insured.

Health care in the US is falling behind the curve, we might have some of the most advanced medical procedures and treatments available but due to costs that level of care is not an option to the average citizen.

reply to post by TKDRL


These are all terrible things. It sounds like you too have been beaten with the unlucky stick! (I'm looking in the mirror too).

Quick question is this though: Your Sig says you don't want helped by the Government. However, upon reading some of your comments I would beg to differ. Who do you think should be paying for YOUR, health care costs?

Signing off for the night. Not throwing in the towel. I will continue to debate this matter tomorrow evening! G'night guys!

reply to post by TKDRL


I feel ya there. One doctor visit I got bounced around to 2 specialist plus the initial GP visit. Total cost? ~400 bucks with no diagnosis. A few months ago 1 wisdom tooth 500 bucks. I'm 29 take good care of myself and yet my enamel is falling off. Thanks Mt. Dew! So I need to get them all yanked. There's another 1500 bucks for that and dentures. The whole cost is absurd. I will contest though, if you got the money to shell out, the level of care is top notch.

reply to post by inforeal


You do realize that most of Asia has socialized health care - and most Asian nations are ranked lower than the U.S. despite having those programs and being centers of medical research? They have had it before most western cultures.

Additionally, life expectancy and infant mortality are, in no way, direct metrics of health care quality. The U.S. has higher homicide rates (not much health care can do about that), higher incidents of traffic accidents (on-scene deaths have no relevance to health care - though casualties taken to hospitals do reflect on health care quality).

American lifestyle and culture is considerably different from a number of nations - a high percentage of the population drives rather than walks (this is considerable even in nations with effective mass transit systems that still rely on walking), diets are more varied (and destructive), and the average rates of injury are somewhat higher for the U.S. in general. www.driveandstayalive.com...

You're more than welcome to believe that life expectancy and infant mortality are direct measures of the health care system. However, all one has to do in America is drive down to Martin Luther King Park (present in every major city) and take a gander. Then, drive down to the local trailer park in any rural area and have a gander. Look at how many parents are single and feed their kids garbage, are mentally ill, abusing drugs/alcohol, etc. Then wonder why infant mortality is so high.

reply to post by NeverApologize


My sig says I don't want to be "protected", as in giving up liberty for protection. I never suggested that anyone pay for my healthcare, even in canada I pay for my "free healthcare" with taxes up the ass lol. I have experienced both capital us healthcare, and now socialist healthcare. And quite frankly, they both suck bigtime for the blue collar class. As far as quality, yeah US quality is better, but that doesn't help any when you can't afford it lol. Here it is "free" but you have a long long line to wait for specialists. Unless you can get a "family doctor" to accept you, you have to go to clinics for non emergency stuff. They only make appointments on wednesdays between 11AM and 1PM, so if you can't call at the right time you have to go to the ER and wait in line for hours.

You cite life expectancy to prove that our healthcare sucks? That isn't even close to being the only factor. I think when you take into account the fact that america has the highest obesity rate in the world, and a very sedentary lifestyle, and the ridiculous american diet, 49th in the world isn't really that bad.

Originally posted by NeverApologize
Another: Let's bash the Republicans! Thread.
Come on guys. Are you serious? They are the worst liars since the Nazis? You do understand that the Nazis were a FAR LEFT Socialist movement right?

So Republicans lie? Yes they do. Democraps like too... To a FAR greater extent!

Examples of lying "Lefties"
- Mussolini
- Hitler
- Pol Pot
- Hugo Chavez
- WHOOPI
- Obama
- Pelosi
- Reid
- Schumer
- Biden
- Stalin
- Mao

Shall I continue? Is this really the only bit of ammunition you guys have right now? "But Bush was/is a liar! He's the Devil maaaaan!" Get over it. He is no longer in office. Half of who I listed is still SELF serving in one way or another...

Oh and I would far prefer our current health care to that of Cuba, Russia, England and the NHS, or China. Let me know how that goes if you ever travel to get health care over seas. I don't think you realize how good we truly do have it! Despite the lies, deceit, and shenanigans; the United States and it's people have THE HIGHEST standard of living compared to anywhere in the World! Hey, right over there, you see that? That's the door!

edit on 10-11-2010 by NeverApologize because: Additional topic info

Well let's get something straight here, nobody who studies political science would ever call the Nazis a far-left party. They are far-right authoritarian and totalitarian. The only reason that people in the US think otherwise now is because pundits like Glenn Beck have tried to paint them as something different in order to advance their own agenda. There's no truth to the matter, the entire term "socialist" that they applied to themselves was a perversion of the term, and they fought real socialists to get to power.

Now that we have history back on its proper footing, in regards to the language after the midterm elections in the United States, the thing that has struck me most is that the Republicans seem to feel that the have won a lot more than they really did.

Yes, there has been a shift in power, but even on historical contexts, while the numbers were bigger than any time in recent history the power shift is much smaller. The Republicans failed to re-take the US Senate, loosing in key races such as Delaware, Nevada and West Virginia. Their "Tea Party" candidates split the vote, doing better in the House but not delivering as they would hope in the Senate.

If things continue along partisan lines, as they surely will, then health care reform cannot be overturned, tax cuts to the wealthy cannot be re-instated and gridlock will ensue unless compromise is undertaken. This is purely a matter of numbers, and is indisputable.

For Republican pundits and commentators then, such as those at World Net Daily and Fox News Channel to wildly speculate that this congress will be Christmas, Easter and a slew of birthdays all rolled into one is lunacy.

In the end myself and most other overseas journalists are getting ready for two years of partisan bickering and nothing of value being accomplished. The past two years are record, as much as the Republicans do not like this, and they have failed to attain the amount of power they need to really do anything about that except act as a spoiler opposition party to any further actions by the Democrats.

Above all their most fevered and wild fantasy of impeaching President Obama will not come to pass for anything that he is known to have done yet. Terribly sorry lads but really, it's not like the world changed overnight.

Originally posted by NeverApologize
reply to post by buni11687

 

Do you realize that Michael Moore is a liar? Since, you know, we are on the topics of liars and all...
Sicko!; has been debunked and ripped apart. He is a self full filling lunatic with about as much cred as Daniel Tosh.

I knew it wouldn't take long for someone to bring up MooROn...

If that's the case, then in America's litigatinous society he would have been sued into submission, right? Hasn't happened since 'Roger and Me'.

Your point seems to fail you.

Originally posted by PayMeh
reply to post by inforeal

 

Greatest healthcare + worst lifestyle due to the fact we're not allowed to grow/produce/butcher/sell without the FDA's gold seal. Honestly, this is the best you guys got?

Really, how can Italians who eat fresh meats from local free range herders, processed by the same people, then sold in a market be healthier than us!! They have local bakeries with brick bread ovens, produce markets instead of super Wal-Marts!! I don't see how on earth they're healthier than us!! It MUST be the healthcare and not the lifestyle.

You, my friend are in between the 'angry' stage and the 'bargaining' stage. =)

BTW: We have the best HC in the world because we have House!!!!!

edit on 9-11-2010 by PayMeh because: (no reason given)

Greatest healthcare? Well I haven't had healthcare for 6 years now, not one damn doctors visit in that time. And my family isn't exactly poor, so I can only imagine what impoverished Americans deal with. I can't tell if your being sarcastic bout the healthcare, but you are definitely correct about Italian eats, best damn food I've ever had at a little place by lake Como.

reply to post by inforeal


Seriously...comparing them to be as deceptive as the Nazis? Wow why do I get the feeling your are a democrat...you could have just said that they are lying like most other folks in congress. I'm sure their are a good deal of republicans who will take offense to that..lets all just calm down before this reaches 300 replies with nothing but complaints about both sides...just be objective..

reply to post by inforeal


Seriously...comparing them to be as deceptive as the Nazis? Wow why do I get the feeling your are a democrat...you could have just said that they are lying like most other folks in congress. I'm sure their are a good deal of republicans who will take offense to that..lets all just calm down before this reaches 300 replies with nothing but complaints about both sides...just be objective..

reply to post by inforeal


Seriously...comparing them to be as deceptive as the Nazis? Wow why do I get the feeling your are a democrat...you could have just said that they are lying like most other folks in congress. I'm sure their are a good deal of republicans who will take offense to that..lets all just calm down before this reaches 300 replies with nothing but complaints about both sides...just be objective..

You can't evaluate the quality of health care with life expectancy. Americans are fat, eat garbage, don't excersize enough etc. etc. etc. I'm sure there are isolated villages with virtually no health care system at all which have a higher life expectancy than the U.S.

Try to think more logically.

reply to post by inforeal


Life expectancy and level of health care are not necessarily related. And there's this. I'm not interested in paying for your healthcare. I think the reason liberals want free gummint healthcare is so they can file lawsuits against doctors with greater frequency. Also, they need quicker access to the whaaaaaaaaambulance!

reply to post by inforeal


The days of one party having the majority in the congress are over. The democrats are still under the mistaken idea that they know best, and if anything that this midterm election proved, a sitting representative can be removed just as fast as his replacement can be found. The democrats are just as guilty and as deceitful as any politicians. Is it the Republicans that is the root of all evil or the problem with the country? Probably not, as for the past 60 years since the 1950, the Democrats have held the majority in congress. For 46 of those 60 years, they have been in control of the House of Representatives, for 40 of those 60, they have been the majority in the senate, and often with the clear cut majority in both cases. During that time frame they could have passed at any given time, any number of laws to get approved by the President.
Though the question that comes to mind what are the root problems of what is causing the health problems in the first place. Most of them are caused by person choices. Heart disease, well if you look at the diet, they ate what they wanted to eat. Skin Cancer, well chances are they are out in the sun tanning every day. Well now how about hearing loss, after all you go into most neighborhoods and listen to what the teens listen and the music and base is turned way up. It starts with actually caring for your health. The medical system is not flawed, We the People are flawed, by our own actions and choices.
We do have the best health care in the world. Why is it that the leading research for many of the diseases are occurring in the US? If our health care was so bad, then the research and innovations would not be there, and there would be far more deaths. If you are concerned about the cost of healthcare, you might want to ask a doctor one thing: What their insurance rates are? Many doctors have to carry malpractice insurance, and the current average rate is: between 4000 to 17000 per year, and the insurance covers up to close to a half a million dollars in damages if not more. The doctors would love to charge less, but they can not due to the laws that state they have to have this kind of coverage and that is part of the cost for seeing a doctor, along with all of the equipment, and his medical degree.
So there you have it, the doctors have to cover the cost of the insurance, as it is mandated by law that they have it.