Wat is freedom

I wonder if we can explore together what freedom is and what it really means to be free.
Being free intrinsically, is that possible?

reply to post by godddd


For me personaly its freedom of mind and spirit. I live by the philosophy of, people can do what they want with the world around me, and can even do what they will with my body should they so choose. They can never have any control over my mind and spirit. Unless i let them which is something im never going to do.

Once you truely master your mind, you realise that there more than this reality that we share. Theres places you can go where no one can reach. So to me that is the ultimate freedom.

reply to post by KrypticCriminal


My question to you then is, why should one need a philosophy to live in freedom?
I mean conformity to any philosophy or authority means to follow and therefore not free

Also i don't think it is a question of mastering my mind as it really means that i am seperating myself from others.

reply to post by godddd


To follow your own philosophy sets you free. If it was someone elses then yes i would be allowing myself to be controled but im not. My philosophy is my own. I dont force it on anyone and i dont allow anyone else to influence it.

Controling your own mind does'nt seperate you from anyone. Your mind is yours and it has no bearing on anybody else life. You are essentialy controlling yourself, not other people. Nobody else even comes in to the equation.

Originally posted by KrypticCriminal
reply to post by godddd

 

To follow your own philosophy sets you free. If it was someone elses then yes i would be allowing myself to be controled but im not. My philosophy is my own. I dont force it on anyone and i dont allow anyone else to influence it.

Controling your own mind does'nt seperate you from anyone. Your mind is yours and it has no bearing on anybody else life. You are essentialy controlling yourself, not other people. Nobody else even comes in to the equation.

I know what you mean, but problem is this.
We live in an unfree world, a world in which people fight kill and die for there flags or gods or political issues, in which people are economical slaves and or have no food for there children or them selfes.
A world regulated by a elite and politics, we vote for them and think they will bring order which they cant.
The only order they bring is an outer order upon us.
So thats why i started this thread, to find out if there is freedom at all and if it is possible to be completely free.
Not only you or me, but the whole of mankind.




Gonna go into it more indept this weekend

I think that "freedom" is the freedom to be fully self expressed (even to the degree of mispelling the word "what" if need be ) and to realize our true potential as a human being, without any limitation, constraint, or hindrance, so that we might discover that which really INSPIRES us as a starting point towards a path or a beam which, if followed, might allow us the possibility of getting to follow our bliss (to paraphrase Joseph Campbell), whatever that might be for each person, since each person's experience of life is unique.

In other words, freedom is the recognition that we at "at cause" in our universe and have been all along, sometimes without even realizing it, however difficult that idea may be for some people to understand who've maybe had a bit of a rough go in life, so far or to date ie: it is never too late!

reply to post by godddd

Freedom?
Isn't it that word American politicians mention every time they send loads of young men to die in order to create a new dictatorship?

Being free should be, free in mind and free to decide your own life, as long as you harm no one else.

But in the west that does not exist anymore, i have to listen to what is in fact real life murderers force me to live a life they want. What right did anyone have to tell me how to live, while they are what accounts to be real life murderers, working in gov and police.

I am not interested in living in this society until i get freedom of mind, and its me that decided not to do anything wrong in my life, not them, the watchers.

Originally posted by andy1033
Being free should be, free in mind and free to decide your own life, as long as you harm no one else.

But in the west that does not exist anymore, i have to listen to what is in fact real life murderers force me to live a life they want. What right did anyone have to tell me how to live, while they are what accounts to be real life murderers, working in gov and police.

I am not interested in living in this society until i get freedom of mind, and its me that decided not to do anything wrong in my life, not them, the watchers.

Here's a really good documentary on what freedom of mind is NOT.

reply to post by godddd


Unfortunately were born in to captivity really, So you can either be a willing participant, follow the rules and codes laid out by the powers that be and hope that they've got everybodys best interests at heart. Or you can identify the devices of control and try to free yourself from them.

Building your own hut, in the middle of a rainforest, being a hunter gatherer, not relying on money or medicine. Things like that. The problem is the world is far too crowded for people to do this so you'd be better off just playing the game and hoping you get some kind peace through out it.

Thats why i talk of freedom of mind and spirit. I know that my body will never be free, it will be used as collateral, sold to the highest bidder and used and abused untill its of no use to the system anymore. Freedom of mind and soul is all ive got really.

reply to post by godddd


Freedom to me is living with out restrictions from any outside powers.

Cheers
Brady

@ NewAgeMan.
To realise our true potential as a human being is a great way of putting it, burdens have fallen away and it puts it all into a whole new perspective.

@Halfoldman.
We all are brought up with the idea of outer freedom, freedom to choose, to believe, to express ourself, to suceed, to aquire, to inquire and so on.
We see freedom as a great gift and so we defend our freedom.
Now soldiers from all over the world fight and die for what we think is freedom, but all across the web it can be found that we are there for another purpose.
But that is another subject which i am sure is already being discussed on ATS

@Andy1033
The first line you wrote was taught to me by priest from witchcraft
But then the question arose, how do i know that i do not harm anyone?
I understand your reply, and this is one of the reasons i started to enquire to find answers, why do we live this way, what lies behind it and so on.

@NewAgeMan.
Thx for this doc

@KrypticCriminal
But that does not mean we have to live in captivity
Also hope is the second soul of human, if they feel powerless, they hope.
truth is that we are not powerless, but we need to educate ourselfs in order to be free.

@GetRadNZ.
Without restrictions, but is being free to do what you want freedom, i mean if no laws and rules are aplied, we would live in the wild west i think because it is just an outer freedom.
But maybe i am not reading it right because of the language barrier




fact is that the outer freedom does not take away our burden, it leaves us in separation which means we must unite, come together and find a way to live together.
But we never will, our division in nationality, in religion, in politics, in culture, in tradition stil exists and therefore there will always be conflict and violence.
Nomatter how many rules or laws we make, they are broken easely and they mean conformity which is not freedom.
So this is why i think we should explore freedom and what it means to be free intrinsically.
Because if we don't our past is our future, if we don't change inside the outer will remain the same.
But this is the difficult part, how to take away the division in us.
Therefore we must understand them, how they come about.
What is religion, what is god, what is the reality in it and why do we label ourself a christian or buddhist.
What is nationalism? it really means division, a seperation between us.
One can see it clearly, every country has its army for defence, the security against the others.
While if we are not divided into nationality, there would be no need to secure ourself against other nations.
What is politics, do we need a leader? follow the leader means conformity and again no freedom.
Why do we feel so irresponsible and follow a person who we like and make that someone responsible by electing him as our leader?
They are incapable of bringing order, they themselfs are the very essence of disorder, running for elections, power and position, they are as ignorance as we are, living in separation seeking succes.
Do we need a government or banks, economic slavery to live happily? or is it the source of our slavery, work work work for 50 years and die in the end of it.
One can have his own peace of mind, but the separation is there, so conflict and violence are garanteed.
If not towards one of us, there is another who is robbed or abused or even tortured and killed.
We seem to see the world as something to operate on, which we do.
We have created and are sustaining a religious political and economical movement which is corrupting and destroying ourself and the earth.
Governments all over the world are busy altering the structure of society thinking that it gonna help make things better.
Truth is, the problem is inside of us, not out there.

enough to discuss

WELL, If you wanna know what ISNT freedom, come on over to the U.S. where if you are LUCKY you have a job, but in order to actually succeed, you MUST have at least 2 or 3 jobs while getting about 2-4 hours of sleep a night and repeat for 6 days a week. This is the minimum requirement to have a modest (small size 3 bedroom) home of your own and put food on the table for yourself a spouse and a couple kids.

NOW, I wont have any money for retirement due to working paycheck to paycheck (so much for me having a 4-year college degree, eh?) especially being that our CRUEL evil republican party wants to eliminate our Social Security altogether, but thats OK being that I will most likely DROP DEAD by age 50 anyways.

How about your country? I Betcha that you have MORE freedom over there than the "good ol" USA. Ya know, the USA, the "home of the free", eh?

American dream is DEAD unless you work until TOTAL exhaustion, sleep a couple hours dreaming only nightmares, and then wake up to then LIVE the nightmares in reality. Doing this all over again without even witnessing your kids growing up.

Thats our freedom since you asked. Whatcha' think about the "Home of the free"? Ya know, America and liberty and stuff, and freedom and stuff...

reply to post by ra.ra3


Not only America, home of the free, system is worldwide.

reply to post by ra.ra3


Last time i did not had much time to react so i kept it short.
Here also people have to work long days in order to pay their bills, it is everywhere.
And yes pension funds are down, just like in the states.
People get less, or pensions are frozen, meaning it won't be equaled with the inflation which results in lower buyingpower.
Nope not more freedom for us
I was told that one must be asleep to believe in the american dream.

Like you many people will feel this way, my friends and family are in debt.
Me to, but i got lucky to have a decent job.
But before i got this job, i had lost everything and nowhere to go, even had to leave my house.
I don't know how or why but during that time i had great insight on things.
Being alone with nothing to hold on to was the greatest gift on earth for me.

To not be coerced by the masses. That is freedom to me in one of its higher forms.

I hate to say it, but in our modern age of everybody trying to impose their will on everybody else, freedom means loneliness.

Someday I'll find people whose interest in me stems beyond what I can do for their egos. To be fair there are some, but it seems to be getting harder and harder to find. Until then loneliness seems the only way to maintain some meager semblance of integrity.

If you are moved by Green Day's "Boulevard", you're about as free as you'll ever be in modern times.

reply to post by NewlyAwakened


I am moved by passion, passion in the sence of surrender, the letting go of the me.
Through seeing, being attentive the movement is revealed.

Originally posted by ra.ra3
WELL, If you wanna know what ISNT freedom, come on over to the U.S. where if you are LUCKY you have a job, but in order to actually succeed, you MUST have at least 2 or 3 jobs while getting about 2-4 hours of sleep a night and repeat for 6 days a week. This is the minimum requirement to have a modest (small size 3 bedroom) home of your own and put food on the table for yourself a spouse and a couple kids.

NOW, I wont have any money for retirement due to working paycheck to paycheck (so much for me having a 4-year college degree, eh?) especially being that our CRUEL evil republican party wants to eliminate our Social Security altogether, but thats OK being that I will most likely DROP DEAD by age 50 anyways.

How about your country? I Betcha that you have MORE freedom over there than the "good ol" USA. Ya know, the USA, the "home of the free", eh?

American dream is DEAD unless you work until TOTAL exhaustion, sleep a couple hours dreaming only nightmares, and then wake up to then LIVE the nightmares in reality. Doing this all over again without even witnessing your kids growing up.

Thats our freedom since you asked. Whatcha' think about the "Home of the free"? Ya know, America and liberty and stuff, and freedom and stuff...

edit on 15-11-2010 by ra.ra3 because: (no reason given)

You gotta live in the wrong place or are doing something wrong.
Americans are not poor... buy buy buy.

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