If you don't like it here....

Yes it all depends, upon how bad it gets. The accelerated rate of anti-social change under the color of authority is an indicator that if such persists, any reasonable person would consider leaving the country.

It appears that the design of this country is currently oriented towards values contrary to its origins, history, and any sense of destiny consistent.

Contraindications have been present in the past, abrogation of basic rights, propaganda, and other adverse things. Today we have high technology that threatens to make irreversible current anti-social changes, and illusory monetary gains. The old question "what does it profit," shows that a commodity based currency and economy is willing to erode and debase itself well into the future by decree and force.

If you have to leave the country, take a good copy of the Constitution with you, keep it close to your heart, and pray daily to return to a nation restored.
Current trends and daily usurpations from powerful people who have forgotten they are our servants are distressing to say the least. We can only hope there is a critical mass of honest people willing to make a difference, but if all is lost, think about taking a hike and pulling the plug for your part on these powerful people.

[edit on 29-6-2004 by SkipShipman]

Originally posted by DirkPitt2004
Get the hell out if you want to be an america basher.

either that, or 1) vote, 2) when the guy you voted for loses, do not cry foul, and 3) have the tact to not bash the war effort while our soldiers are fighting for the very freedom you are employing by saying they do not need to there.

Such utter �rap! You are saying blindly follow and support no matter what because the government ORDERS our troops to war. It's got nothing to do with tact, as an example most ppl would consider the Nazi'z evil (and I do) but using your logic then really they did nothing wrong because they were just tactfully supporting their government no matter what.
It's just a psychological way to scare disenters into not acting on that disent and the sheeple enforce this by buying into and parating that sort of crap without thinking about it.
And where does voting get us, well it got us Bush, twice. Can't you see it really doesn't change anything. Ppl who voted for Bush thought they were gonna make a difference, a change, did they get what they bargained for?
We don't have a democracy we have a dictatorship in sheeps clothing...

Some food for thought,
www.takver.com...
www.spaz.org...
www.lightscion.com...
www.uow.edu.au...

[edit on 29-6-2004 by ANOK]

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback

Originally posted by Jakomo
Diamondback:

This is the problem when morons jump in discussion with out reading into the background first. I responded to someone who said dissent was patriotic, or something to that effect.

Hahahaha, or something to that effect.

I was already in the process of responding to your idiocy, i wasn't about hit "back" on my browser just to see exactly what she said. Go back and check for yourself. I stand by my statement.

For the record;
1) I said, "Dissent is a patriots duty."
2) I'm a guy.

Our fast-paced American culture thrives on conformity. In the "fringe" of our society we have the "few" who choose to either not accept or ignore what is presented as fact. Those people then go off to form their own unique beliefs. This process can result in a positive (Galileo) or a negative (David Koresh).

What does that have to do with anything? Well, lucky for us, not everyone is an extremist on their respective totem poles, but everyone has their own ideas, motivations and desires which tilt one way or the other. Add to this the fact that certain acts cannot be deemed as "bad" unless they have already occured and the will of the people is against it.

With modern business requiring international travel and exchange, people of our country have suddenly had an ethnic revitalization...just look at the food business and the new things that you can find every day in your local grocery store.

People like this, and they want more - greed. But our government can only take so much foreignization until we reach the point that we lose our American....ness. "We should have this countries tax policies", "I want that kind of fuel-efficient car", essentially it becomes "I like this more than that." And then you hve your average steak and potato, "honey I'm home" Americans...nuff said on them.

So suddenly conformity becomes repulsive. You've taken one too many cruises to Aruba and you like their way of life better than those back in the good 'ol US, mindlessly chewing on their gums thinking it's steak and wondering when the next episode of Friends will come on so they can record it on TIVO and go watch a movie about the end of the world. This is the moment it rings loud and clear in their minds that home is somewhere else, and acknowledging that you hate this country becomes a daily ritual.

The truth is that this happens all over the world and your screwed...that's when the people who make shotguns and ropes give a silent nod to the powers that be.

I think if I were to move it would be for a change of scenery. I'm tired of looking at the swamps and rolling "hills" of Florida...I've had to much fun in my past just staring at landscapes America only wishes they had. You see the world through your eyes so why not keep them happy. So you see, in conclusion, if you are a non-conformist, your primary objective is to satisfy your visions. Of course, most of them are blind and live right next door to you

For the record;
1) I said, "Dissent is a patriots duty."
2) I'm a guy.

I think I subconciously had that Victoria's Secret model in mind when I typed that. Sorry.

Interesting Discussion

Here are my thoughts

I am 20 years of age, so I have not had a chance to vote yet.

I have been complaining about our government/bush admin for the past few years but no one (friends/coworkers) agree with me. I live in Texas so Republicans are abundant around here.

The thing with the people in my area is they don't think for themselves. As long as the govt/churches/etc tell them what they should think then its okay.

I'm talking to a coworker and I say "I don't think we should go in Iraq, they werent posing an immediate threat to us"

Her reply shocked me "Oh i dont know... I think 3000 people dying is a good enough reason"

I then said "Iraq had nothing to do with that"

I cant remember her reply but it was somewhere long the lines that all middle-easteners were responsible and because they go around blowing themselves up they all deserve to be killed....

I go to a friends house and they are watching the war footage and cheering it on as bombs are exploding... ITS SICKENING

The people around here dont seem to get it.

How am I going to change it? I can't. Im only 20 years old, I live in a trailer and make $13,000 a year. My opinions don't matter to anyone.

But I can and will go vote. Now, some of Kerrys ideas are little out there, but I would rather have him on the throne than Bush.

Btw, anyone get those Bush-Cheney things in the mail? With a "personalized" letter, with Dear Friend scratched out replaced with Dear YOUR NAME, and then a picture of George and Luara Bush?

If not I will find my copy ( I got two of them since I get mail at two different addresses) and will copy it verbatim.

NM, I cant find them I think I threw them away

[edit on 29-6-2004 by Thatoneguy]

I go to a friends house and they are watching the war footage and cheering it on as bombs are exploding... ITS SICKENING

I know what you mean man...To a lesser degree my dad is kind of the same way - we'll be watching the news and they'll show some third world country with natives detesting American ideals and all he can think is "what are they...stupid?" In a way this is kind of tied to the same feeling that we are providing freedom and justice to a lesser peoples and those who oppose us publically are ignorant and have no valid excuse for living.

It's sad that a large majority of people in our country have this attitude. As an anthropoligist, it burns me up inside...but sometimes you have to put on the "I'm bigger than you" hat and just walk in the other direction...a person's mentality and mindset is not going to change because you don't like it, and what I mentioned above about irrate natives is a perfect example - it's one big vicious circle.

Originally posted by Eastern_Diamondback


I think I subconciously had that Victoria's Secret model in mind when I typed that. Sorry.

No problem, it happens all the time. She's so hot she confuses people.