The History of High Rise Collapses

Originally posted by snapperski
reply to post by TrickoftheShade

 

the simple solution to this,you have the UN council assign a team of world specialist of each field,and give them the resources to investigate,but the biggest problem would be cooperation from the american government,and as for the money,why should that be a problem,after all america prints its own money anyway..but i should imagen the UN could finance this easy,with its income,and it wasn't only americans that died that day,as far as america bashing from states that dis-agree with American Foreign Policy,i'm afraid you get that anyway,so it wouldn't make much differents..would it ? ..but there would be a level of civil investigation,were you have neutral parties overseeing the conduct of the investigators,and making sure it not used as a platform of US bashing,unrelated to 9/11.

Do you know how the UN is financed? Do you understand that the US doesn't just "print its own money"?

How can you say that because "you get that anyway" that bias against America from vested interests wouldn't cloud or derail the process?

Who are the neutral parties? How would they "oversee" the investigators?

There is absolutely no way to know the exact collapse sequence nor is there a way to know the exact damage that WTC 7 suffered and how that affected its stability.

We have photographs from a number of angles showing that the damage WTC7 sustained was relatively mild, asymmetrical, and not enough to penetrate the core. Either way, the damage from falling derby still does nothing to explain how WTC7 fell at freefall. I agree with you that there is absolutely no way we can know what was happening inside WTC7, other than the columns became dislodged before the falling mass encountered them, but in the absence of any real physical evidence people can assert any theory they like, because others cannot show that they are wrong. I strongly suspect that hard physical evidence is impossible without a two-way time-machine. But that does not make their theories right. I am still waiting for an explanation as to how all the columns on each floors during the period of freefall became dislodged before the falling mass had even encountered them and removing any inertia from the static floors.

The best information we have comes from the members of the FDNY who watched that building that afternoon.

No, the best information can be gleaned from the video evidence and the very few pieces of steel that were kept.

And their stories indicate that WTC 7 basically started its collapse sequence much earlier in the day...and very slowly...until the early evening when the rest of the building came down.

Wait... what? As far as I am able to discern, WTC7 collapsed spontaneously in 7 seconds. How is that very slowly over the course of the entire day? Are you watching the same video I am?

Originally posted by snapperski
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

one question to the man that clearly thinks,his smarter then the rest of us,now concerning the pentagon,plane engines,made from titanium,apparently just vaporized,but office equipment never,just meters away ,how is this possible,please enlighten us with your great wisdom.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/334f6ba0032c.jpg[/atsimg]

and to zoom in for you..

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/98362ab4759c.jpg[/atsimg]

and another thing that bothers me is why they won't released this footage from these cameras.??
surely this wound end all the debating and conspiracy concerning the pentagon..it would put it to bed so to speak...
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/4c08c78ad0ba.jpg[/atsimg]

plus another question i have is were did this plane part come from,as it well documented to NOT be from the alleged plane that hit the pentagon..??
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c0ad05ef2d44.jpg[/atsimg]

Ah lets see another lesson on building construction YOU GUYS clutch at straws and get a bit STUPID in your attempts to disprove something.

Lets see if you showed a picture of a monitor still sitting INTACT at the impact point and not a FEW FLOORS above in a building recently strenghtend to resist bomb attacks then I would be

By the way have underlined clues above to make things easier for you to UNDERSTAND!

Well its lucky for me my next door neighbour works for a Roll Royce Engine Assembly plant titanium is used in the fan blades.

Look here re the engine part claimed not to be part of the engine.

www.aerospaceweb.org...

Extract taken from above.

One similarity between the two photos can be seen in the cleats along the edge of the Pentagon object. These devices are called dovetail slots and provide attachment points for the compressor blades. The shapes of these slots on the Pentagon wreckage appear to match those on the RB211 assembly shown on the left. Furthermore, the "nosepiece" jutting out from the center of the disk in the Pentagon photo shares commonalities with the central shaft visible in the RB211 photo.

Images from page

www.aerospaceweb.org...

NEXT!

If somehow we could all come together as one voice, we could demand that they release video of the pentagon on 9-11. Everyone believes that there has to be film evidence they haven't released. I think their strategy IS divide and conquer. What we need is a catchy slogan asking for a picture of the plane, and everyone of us can ask it to every politician we see everytime we see them. Relentlessly asking the same question over and over because it is, a fair question. We've got to stick together in this. The group of 'debunkers' are fools. They must not be allowed to weaken the strain. Relentlessy asking the same question, "where's the film of the plane hitting the pentagon?" "Where's the film...?" It shouldn't be that hard to get some celebrity with enough credibility to put forth this simple request. If we build it, they will come.

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade

Originally posted by snapperski
reply to post by TrickoftheShade

 

the simple solution to this,you have the UN council assign a team of world specialist of each field,and give them the resources to investigate,but the biggest problem would be cooperation from the american government,and as for the money,why should that be a problem,after all america prints its own money anyway..but i should imagen the UN could finance this easy,with its income,and it wasn't only americans that died that day,as far as america bashing from states that dis-agree with American Foreign Policy,i'm afraid you get that anyway,so it wouldn't make much differents..would it ? ..but there would be a level of civil investigation,were you have neutral parties overseeing the conduct of the investigators,and making sure it not used as a platform of US bashing,unrelated to 9/11.

Do you know how the UN is financed? Do you understand that the US doesn't just "print its own money"?

How can you say that because "you get that anyway" that bias against America from vested interests wouldn't cloud or derail the process?

Who are the neutral parties? How would they "oversee" the investigators?

ok well firstly i'm well versed on how a fractal reserve banking system works,but that a whole new thread,so lets not take this off topic.

and secondly,if the united states paid what they owe to the united nations which is said to be around $800 million (92% of the regular budget arrears) i would think that would cover it,don't you ?

and thirdly,the neutral parties would be voted on by all members of the UN council.

and as for a bias view upon america and said vested intrest's,thats a rather paranoid view you have there,plus as i've already stated,the neutral parties,voted on by the UN council,would be charged with keeping this in check,and being public we keep check on them.

Originally posted by snapperski
Its the same old names just waiting for a 9/11 thread to start to try and hijack it,and try and belittle the OP...they work as a team,i wonder if it 1 person with many accounts,and use there many accounts to star there own comments.

Varemia/exponent/dereks/thedman/alfie1/weedwacker

This group work as a team,to kill any thread concerning 9/11....they dont seem to comment on any other threads..its like there sitting there waiting for a 9/11 thread to start...then go out of there way to take it off topic,always avoid the questions they cant deny....its getting boreing lads...move on....if you so convince that the government story is true,then why are you here...and so dedicated in trying to kill any 9/11 thread.

Nonsense like this is of the many reasons why Truthers aren't taken seriously.

This is all going off topic.

When a collapse happens, especially as big as this one, the investigation usually is conducted to determine why this happened. This is studied thoroughly to prevent it from happening again.

In my opinion, this wasn't the case for building 7. WTC1+2 is understandable that a big airplane could have shifted the core of the buildings, but WTC7 had no reason to fall. The debris would have fallen on top of the building or grazed the sides it wouldn't have sustained relevant damages to make it fall. Unless of course the building was faulty to begin with, but the commission would have taken it out on the builders for cutting corners.

So you could defend WTC 1+2 but 7 seems way too fishy to let the investigation pass by. We have a small window of opportunity to investigate what hasn't been destroyed to determine the fault. If this window passes there will never be a way to find out what truly happened to those buildings.

I am not doubting the validity of the OS but I don't think this investigation is 100% accurate either. There may not be a conspiracy it could just be stupidity on behalf of the commission, but stupidity has no place in investigating the murder of 3000 people.

reply to post by technical difficulties


No. Truthers aren't taken serious because of the wacky theories and the paint in which they were painted. I would say 85% of people watch television news on the daily. The television news is supposed to emit true and unbiased information to the public. The public assumes the news is correct because it is on TV.

These truthers are made to seem like they are always wrong and are lone nut freaks. That is why truthers aren't take serious.

When in fact it is the news that is biased because of their ratings, money, and who holds stake in their company. That is why you see independent companies report differently then big news corporations. Independent companies don't have the same investors as big corporate news agencies.

reply to post by wmd_2008


well this man at Rolls Royce seems to disagree with you about the engine part.

John W. Brown, spokesman for Rolls Royce (Indianapolis), said, “It is not a part from any Rolls Royce engine that I’m familiar with, and certainly not the AE 3007H made here in Indy.” The AE 3007 engines are used in small commuter jets such as the Cessna Citation; the AE 3007H is also used in the military’s unmanned aircraft, the Global Hawk. The Global Hawk is manufactured by Northrop Grumman’s subsidiary Ryan Aeronautical, which it acquired from Teledyne, Inc. in July 1999.

and the link you gave,dont comfirm what plane it came from,it mearly states it's very simlar and could well be a Rolls Royce part,did you even read the whole page,or just flicked through it,and as for your childish folly comment at the end,saying next,you sure your not the THEDMAN,as you both write very similar,and would explain,how you both star each others comments,even when clearly wrong.

Originally posted by snapperski

ok well firstly i'm well versed on how a fractal reserve banking system works,but that a whole new thread,so lets not take this off topic.

Okay. Then you perhaps understand that the US money supply is not topped up by the government just "printing more money" when it facies spending some. If that was how it worked, why have taxes?

And to be fair that subject is on topic, since i asked you how such a commission would be financed, and your response was to "print more money".

and secondly,if the united states paid what they owe to the united nations which is said to be around $800 million (92% of the regular budget arrears) i would think that would cover it,don't you ?

Yes, they could just use that. It's so simple.

I bet if the US knew that instead of the money going to normal UN procedures and actions it was going to be used to finance a huge investigation into their government they would definitely pay up.

and thirdly,the neutral parties would be voted on by all members of the UN council.

Presumably you mean the security council? Three fifths of which is, or was, according to truthers, fully engaged in the oil/narco war that was the planned result of 9/11. So I'm not sure your neutral parties would be considered neutral for very long. Certainly not by truthers.

and as for a bias view upon america and said vested intrest's,thats a rather paranoid view you have there,plus as i've already stated,the neutral parties,voted on by the UN council,would be charged with keeping this in check,and being public we keep check on them.

Paranoid? It's not paranoid to say that people don't like America, or have political interests that conflict with America's. Would you really like me to provide you with some examples of this?

And as for the accountability of your public enquiry, I'd just ask when was the last time you voted for someone in the UN? And when did you get a chance to vote on a public enquiry in Britain? I get your point that the public nature of such a thing allows some scrutiny, but not much.

So you've got no finance and no way of overseeing it. Care to try again?

Originally posted by technical difficulties

Originally posted by snapperski
Its the same old names just waiting for a 9/11 thread to start to try and hijack it,and try and belittle the OP...they work as a team,i wonder if it 1 person with many accounts,and use there many accounts to star there own comments.

Varemia/exponent/dereks/thedman/alfie1/weedwacker

This group work as a team,to kill any thread concerning 9/11....they dont seem to comment on any other threads..its like there sitting there waiting for a 9/11 thread to start...then go out of there way to take it off topic,always avoid the questions they cant deny....its getting boreing lads...move on....if you so convince that the government story is true,then why are you here...and so dedicated in trying to kill any 9/11 thread.

Nonsense like this is of the many reasons why Truthers aren't taken seriously.

edit on 26-10-2010 by technical difficulties because: (no reason given)

oh ok,and were ment to take you seriously when your only contribution to the thread is that one sentence,and when you been reading these forums as long as i have,you get to notice,these same few,and there shadow accounts,now bring something to the thread,and keep your insults to yourself.

Fire alone caused this steel reenforced segment of freeway to collapse.

A tanker exploded on a freeway overpass in the Oakland/Emeryville area in CA on Sunday, April 29th around 4am.
The deck collapsed and burned.
It was a connecting ramp between I-80 and I-580.
This is what 8,600 gallons (which weighs 80,000 pounds) of unleaded gasoline does when it burns.

Reports state that the fireball started on the lower deck, and the rising heat of the 3000+ degree fire melted parts of the deck above, causing it to collapse.


www.youtube.com...

reply to post by Equinox99


Re WT7 Collapse done by real engineers not joe public on the net!

www.structuremag.org...

Originally posted by wmd_2008
reply to post by Equinox99

 

Re WT7 Collapse done by real engineers not joe public on the net!

www.structuremag.org...

Oh yes you mean Ramon Gilsanz the FEMA man involved with the World Trade Center clean up,one of the men involved in cleaning up ALL the evidence of 9/11,And he only theorises on possible reasons,so your link does not really say anything,apart from show me another government man,telling us what they want us to belive.

Originally posted by snapperski
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

well this man at Rolls Royce seems to disagree with you about the engine part.

John W. Brown, spokesman for Rolls Royce (Indianapolis), said, “It is not a part from any Rolls Royce engine that I’m familiar with, and certainly not the AE 3007H made here in Indy.” The AE 3007 engines are used in small commuter jets such as the Cessna Citation; the AE 3007H is also used in the military’s unmanned aircraft, the Global Hawk. The Global Hawk is manufactured by Northrop Grumman’s subsidiary Ryan Aeronautical, which it acquired from Teledyne, Inc. in July 1999.

and the link you gave,dont comfirm what plane it came from,it mearly states it's very simlar and could well be a Rolls Royce part,did you even read the whole page,or just flicked through it,and as for your childish folly comment at the end,saying next,you sure your not the THEDMAN,as you both write very similar,and would explain,how you both star each others comments,even when clearly wrong.

Only clearly wrong to your understanding of events.
No mate way wrong we are different people only the paranoid on here clutch at those excuses.

NOTICE YOU ARE BEING SELECTIVE what about you monitor pic

The Beoing used RR RB211 engines on 757 guess what not built in the USA and that disc matches for size the part used in RB 211's.

Back to you.

Originally posted by snapperski

Originally posted by wmd_2008
reply to post by Equinox99

 

Re WT7 Collapse done by real engineers not joe public on the net!

www.structuremag.org...

Oh yes you mean Ramon Gilsanz the FEMA man involved with the World Trade Center clean up,one of the men involved in cleaning up ALL the evidence of 9/11,And he only theorises on possible reasons,so your link does not really say anything,apart from show me another government man,telling us what they want us to belive.

Well most of the STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS here in the UK who have looked at 9/11 agree with this and the twin tower collapses. Do you have much dealings with STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS in your line of work?

Back to you again!!

reply to post by wmd_2008

Only clearly wrong to your understanding of events. No mate way wrong we are different people only the paranoid on here clutch at those excuses. NOTICE YOU ARE BEING SELECTIVE what about you monitor pic

as usual you resort to petty insults,is it because i exposed your link as a credible engineer,to infact be a FEMA engineer,who was charged with the 9/11 clean up operation,to dispose of all evidence.

Originally posted by wmd_2008

Originally posted by snapperski

Originally posted by wmd_2008
reply to post by Equinox99

 

Re WT7 Collapse done by real engineers not joe public on the net!

www.structuremag.org...

Oh yes you mean Ramon Gilsanz the FEMA man involved with the World Trade Center clean up,one of the men involved in cleaning up ALL the evidence of 9/11,And he only theorises on possible reasons,so your link does not really say anything,apart from show me another government man,telling us what they want us to belive.

Well most of the STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS here in the UK who have looked at 9/11 agree with this and the twin tower collapses. Do you have much dealings with STRUCTURAL ENGINEERS in your line of work?

Back to you again!!

edit on 26-10-2010 by wmd_2008 because: spelling

yes i do have some form of structural engineering background i made composite steel beams with precast hollowcore/bison beams for 9 years,mainly foundation construction,and also ment i worked side by side with pile drivers,so i'm not completely illiterate when it comes to steel and concrete psychics,but i don't claim to know it all.i'm mearly searching for answers.

would you care to bless us with your structural background knowledge.as seen as you want to take this into our personal life's.

reply to post by Nathan-D

We have photographs from a number of angles showing that the damage WTC7 sustained was relatively mild, asymmetrical, and not enough to penetrate the core.

Then you should have no problems posting a link to those pictures. Because in 9 years I have yet to see any close up pictures of the damage suffered by WTC 7 at the point where the trusses are over the ConEd station.

Wait... what? As far as I am able to discern, WTC7 collapsed spontaneously in 7 seconds. How is that very slowly over the course of the entire day? Are you watching the same video I am?

Pieces of that building were collapsing/falling off most of the afternoon.

reply to post by snapperski


You really shouldnt assume like that. There is no need for your "public international" investigation (which by the way seems to be codespeak for Hang George Bush the way many people use it) There is nothing new to be discovered.


Must comment on those posting about letting the UN handle it.....we are talking about the same UN that put Libya and Iran on its Human Rights Commission??????