FBI knew plan of hijackers well in advance cause they were listening.

I still can't get over how much information that was known before 911 and none of these so called, "intelligence agencies" could put it together. Not one little bit let alone the whole thing but I mean come on now...Just a bit? Heck no, they let this one slip right through and now the citizens have to do all of the leg work to find out what really went on leading up to and on 911.

The 9/11 hijackers were largely unknown prior to that horrible event, right?

Actually, U.S. and allied intelligence services heard a lot from the hijackers' own mouths prior to 9/11:
An FBI informant hosted and rented a room to two hijackers in 2000. Specifically, investigators for the Congressional Joint Inquiry discovered that an FBI informant had hosted and even rented a room to two hijackers in 2000 and that, when the Inquiry sought to interview the informant, the FBI refused outright, and then hid him in an unknown location, and that a high-level FBI official stated these blocking maneuvers were undertaken under orders from the White House. As the New York Times notes:

Senator Bob Graham, the Florida Democrat who is a former chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, accused the White House on Tuesday of covering up evidence ....

The accusation stems from the Federal Bureau of Investigation's refusal to allow investigators for a Congressional inquiry and the independent Sept. 11 commission to interview an informant, Abdussattar Shaikh, who had been the landlord in San Diego of two Sept. 11 hijackers.

Source right here

The French knew...

On an aerial snapshot taken August 28, 2000, DGSE agents locate a key man, very close to Osama bin Laden. His name: Abu Khabab. This pyrotechnist of Egyptian origin, known for having taught the science of artisanal explosives to generations of jihadists, constitutes a theoretically high-priority target. In two biographical notices about him from October 25, 2000 and January 9, 2001, the DGSE enumerates the intelligence exchanged with the Israeli Mossad, the CIA, and Egyptian security services about him. Everything about his trips and his moves was known.

Source here

The Israelis knew too....

At 3:56 p.m., twenty-five minutes after the issuance of the FBI BOLO, officers with the East Rutherford Police Department stopped the commercial moving van through a trace on the plates. According to the police report, Officer Scott DeCarlo and Sgt. Dennis Rivelli approached the stopped van, demanding that the driver exit the vehicle. The driver, 23-year-old Sivan Kurzberg, refused and "was asked several more times [but] appeared to be fumbling with a black leather fanny pouch type of bag". With guns drawn, the police then "physically removed" Kurzberg, while four other men ­- two more men had apparently joined the group since the morning ­- were also removed from the van, handcuffed, placed on the grass median and read their Miranda rights.

Source here

The NSA already knew where Bin laden was and was listening...

According to the Sunday Herald, two days before 9/11, Bin Laden called his stepmother and told her "In two days, you're going to hear big news and you're not going to hear from me for a while.” U.S. officials later told CNN that “in recent years they've been able to monitor some of bin Laden's telephone communications with his [step]mother. Bin Laden at the time was using a satellite telephone, and the signals were intercepted and sometimes recorded." Indeed, before 9/11, to impress important visitors, NSA analysts would occasionally play audio tapes of bin Laden talking to his stepmother.

Source here

Can we trust the government anymore? After all of the facts and I do mean facts that we now know, I really have serious doubts as to where the US government loyalitys rest. It sure isn't with it's own people. If any one of us were to be caught in as many lies we'd be cast away to the most remote prison on earth. Yet while many Americans struggle to make ends meet and put food on their tables, the elite have managed to get another one over on us for the sake of their own agenda. And just to be clear I'm not talking about the myriad of theorys, I'm talking about the facts. Ones that can be verified with no doubt, with those alone there is more than enough evidence to come to the conclusion that if the US government could not figure this out with what we know now, then they should fire all of the agency heads and do some rehiring.

reply to post by mikelee


Well done!

Another example of why there needs to be a new, independent, more powerful investigation.

If I'm not mistaken, the Australian intelligence agencies also warned the US of an impending attack. (I'll have to find where I read that). The govt. is trying to tell us that this was a bolt-out-of-the-blue attack, yet by many intelligent agencies accounts (both inside and outside the US), the govt. was given fair warning. At the very least, the govt. is guilty of gross incompetence.

We want a new investigation.

reply to post by The Baby Seal Club


Thanks!

Check this one out...

PERTH, Australia — When Jack Roche telephoned Australia's intelligence agency in July 2000, he offered a tantalizing story: He had been to Afghanistan and ate lunch with Osama bin Laden. He had received training in explosives and plotted with Al Qaeda leaders to carry out a bombing in Australia. But at the time -- 14 months before the Sept. 11 attacks -- no one was interested.

LA Times

well I mean really what was our government going to do? It wasn't solid enough to do anything. There was no specific time nor place. It's just like I know that 3 people will be murdered today in the US. But I cannot do anything to stop it...

Also you have to realise how many threats the US gets constantly. There is always something or someone but most of the time nothing ever happens. I bet that if we did have more intel than we are led to believe we still couldn't have stopped it.

Double post

reply to post by Reign02



I agree with you but...

We pay these folks to put the peices together and thats what they do, the computers they have built, thats what they are for. I expect more than a bunch of smoke blown at me by the White House. The US, if I remember right, had something on the order of 13 countrys telling them it was coming meaning there was an imminet attack.

I hear you though, and I do agree with you on your comment.

reply to post by Reign02


I know what you mean. But really, when is enough enough? I'm not the head of the CIA or FBI so I don't know where the limit is. But this is also not just some anonymous phone call. This is a min. of 4 intelligent org. in other countries (professionals). And what exact intelligence they passed on is unknown.
Plus we have our own FBI hot on the trail but the agents seem to have been thwarted when they wanted to strike.

you have to remember that these "calls" that were monitiored cannot be used in a court of law or anything. They are without proper warrants or just cause or anything. This was all before the whole patriot act thing.

I am stationed at a RAF base in England and we get bomb threats and warning of possible terrorist activity all the time. But in the 4 years I have been out here not one thing has happened.

Now look at the US, how many full out terrorists attacks on our soil can be confirmed to Islamic terrorists organizations? I can only imagine the number of possible tips and threats that the CIA/FBI pick up on a daily basis. Of course now they are probably taking all of them a lot more seriously. Jihad Jane is a good one to look at to see that they are finally picking up the pace.

Granted I agree with both of you as well, but back 10 years ago things were not like they are now. I wish that they would have done their jobs properly and solved this before 9-11 happened.

reply to post by Reign02

True. There would be the question of what would be allowed in a court of law. But that would entail something that is after-the-fact. I think that if they would have had something before the event, then they should have acted on it and then worry about the repercussions in a court of law afterwards. That's part of the reason that I would like to see a new investigation. That we could ascertain exactly what was known so that the proper steps could be put in place so that something like 9/11 doesn't happen again. We could also then find out if the people who were in charge should not have been. Instead what we have seen is that the people who were in charge received no disciplinary action. Some were even promoted. I guess that's the Peter Principle in action.

Phone calls even before 911, can and were admitted in many court cases involving criminal and terrorist activitys. Not trying to argue the point here, only stating a fact I know of very well. The Patroit Act was a broad sweeping go ahead of authority that extended well beyond the phone call issue. All intelligence agencys have used recordings from hard wired, cellular and sat phones for many years including law enforcement with the proper approval from a Judge regarding the latter.

Federal law enforcement officials may tap telephone lines only after showing "probable cause" of unlawful activity and obtaining a court order. This unlawful activity must involve certain specified violations. The court order must limit the surveillance to communications related to the unlawful activity and to a specific period of time, usually 30 days. (Electronic Communications Privacy Act, 18 USC 2516) Source

I think this thread is the most important on here at the moment but it wont get that much attention because it doesn't go on about controlled demolition of the towers and similar unsubstantiated drama.

Fact is there are obvious intelligence and security lessons to be learnt from 9/11. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but clearly things happened which should not have. For example, how did Mohammed Atta, Ziad Jarrah, Marwan al-Shehhi and Ramzi Binalshibh gain entry to the US ? These men were members of the " Hamburg Cell " and under surveillance by German intelligence years before 9/11. They all spent time in Afghanistan in 1999. How on earth were they allowed entry to the US and allowed to move about freely under their own names ?

Instead of inventing grandiose conspiracy theories I think US citizens should more usefully be considering their border security.

reply to post by Alfie1


Valid point(s) you make

I originally had a large thread that included what you mentioned regarding demolition, the pentagon and other theorys but after I read it, it came across as just another theory headlined by an article. That to me is whats wrong with many of these 911 theorys in that they go for the theory rather than the facts. Seems many in the 911 forum thrive on the conspiracy heresay and toss any facts to the side.

The FBI was acting like a typical government agency they were arrogant and wither it happend the way the government said it did or not they paid for it.

Wasn't there a big shake up after 9/11 with trying to improve how the FBI, CIA and other agencies communicate etc ... ?

I suppose it was a long time coming, but I haven't looked at much of the information regarding it. I've only recently started looking at 9/11 ... it seems to be a fairly complicated topic with so many theories as to what went wrong or what was setup.

It's difficult to know where to start.

reply to post by Pinke

It's difficult to know where to start.

How true indeed! What a quagmire for sure. I'm positive that many have (or perhaps still are) playing CMA (cover my a**) as no one wants to step up on this one and admit they did or didn't do something that might have helped bring disclosuire to the hijacker's plans.