So You Wanna Fight? ATS Debate Tournament (Tournament Update)

Unfortunately I am going to have to drop out. I no longer have the enthusiam for the tournement, so how do we go about removing ourselves from the debate tourney? I hope this has not caused too much trouble. Thanks, I appreciate it.

Originally posted by hotbakedtater
Unfortunately I am going to have to drop out. I no longer have the enthusiam for the tournement, so how do we go about removing ourselves from the debate tourney? I hope this has not caused too much trouble. Thanks, I appreciate it.

Too late. I think you should be forced to participate

Actually, truthfully, if you have to withdrawal due to personal reasons or time restraints, I suggest you u2u either Semperfortis or Chissler.

But, please do not withdrawal because you are intimidated. This would be the wrong reasons, in my opinion. We all have little idea of what we are going to be debating, and whether or not we get the side of the arguement we even personally tend to lean towards and believe. More than likely we all have some knowledge about what subject matter we will get assigned, but we will (hopefully) all be doing some measure of research prior to submitting our posts.

Again, please do not pull out due to intimidation, it is bound to be a learning experience whether a member wins, loses, or somehow ends up with a draw. Just apply yourself. I've read some of your posts, and know you are knowledgable about certain things, and even managed to learn a few things from them.

If it is due to personal concerns or real life issues, I am certain those putting this together will understand. If it is due to lack of self confidence, everyone has some measure of self-doubt, either that or lack of being humble and are arrogant. Find your middle ground and stand it, don't let your opponent move you unless you being moved stregthens your stance

Please reconsider, and if it is for the right reasons, just u2u Semperfortis and Chissler and I'm sure they can work it out.

peace,
ET


edit to add:
Great. Now if hotbakedtater ends up staying in the tournament, and I lose a debate to hotbakedtater, boy am I going to kick myself

Guys..

I am fighting a nasty cold..

As soon as I am back on my "feet", we will get this going...

Bear with me please..

Semper

Get bettter soon semper.

Just an idea ... should the date of the debate get revisited in a month or something perhaps?

I'd rather know there is a longish wait and have roughish idea of when it's going to be. It might also take some of the pressure off ATS staff?

Also had a debate related question. I read up on some of the rules of previous debates ... Five references ... Does this include book references?

reply to post by semperfortis


Yeah, get well soon Semper

I'll stop pestering you

reply to post by semperfortis


Not that I have to offer a survivalist subject matter expert, but take some vitamin C. I spent some time living in the Carolinas, they have some nasty germs down there.

Take your time Semper, rest up, get well. We'll be ready when it's set up and everyone is healthy.

Get well Semper,
John

I am not intimidated at all, I was looking forward to debating, because I enjoy it immensely, and the more formal venue was something I was looking forward to. I thought it would be a challenge to debate a random topic someone else chose for me, just to see if I could to it.

I dont want to cause trouble, so I will stay in and do my best. I do not want to be a quitter.

Just a drama queen.

reply to post by hotbakedtater


That's the spirit, get that enthuthiasm back and stop being a wimp!

Originally posted by Pinke
Also had a debate related question. I read up on some of the rules of previous debates ... Five references ... Does this include book references?

Yes.

Careful with the book references though...proper attribution could take some of the character count away...

Hey! I was wondering if I can make a preference for the debate. I was wondering if we could debate the justification of war vs. Pacifism.

Originally posted by Esoteric Teacher
Take your time Semper, rest up, get well. We'll be ready when it's set up and everyone is healthy.

Allow me to point out, Semper, that you should get off your butt and quit whigning. Are you a marine or a mouse? Tell me exactly how having the sniffles inhibits your ability to type. As I understand it, there is no malaise that can keep Semperfortis down.

reply to post by Ian McLean

And the rabble rousing begins!!!



I honestly expected that the first jibe would be directed at Skyfloating...

reply to post by Ian McLean


They got some nasty germs in the Carolinas. I spent about 8 months living there in 92, and ended up in the hospital with some really bad bug for four days. Sickest I've ever been, lost more than 20 pounds in a week. Incidently, I have not had anything resembling the flu or a bad cold since, though. Not sure what it was, but had breathing problems which is why I spent time in the hospital.

But then again .... I wasn't a Marine

As for the debates, I'm trying to think of what topics and subjects we shall be debating. This shall be interesting

Fun stuff,
ET

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
Hey! I was wondering if I can make a preference for the debate. I was wondering if we could debate the justification of war vs. Pacifism.

Can you argue both sides?

In general, you do not want to be in a debate where you have a lot of personal feelings and convictions, because you may wind up having to debate the other side!

Otherwise, sounds like a decent subject.

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel
Hey! I was wondering if I can make a preference for the debate. I was wondering if we could debate the justification of war vs. Pacifism.

Unfortunately you don't get to choose your topic. That's what challenge matches are for, though.

I'm not sure if you could suggest it as a topic, but I doubt you'll personally get to debate it if you've suggested it and it does get chosen.

It's what makes tournaments great, not knowing what you'll be debating and on which side you'll have to debate from, all part of the fun. Good luck.

I would like if persons could suggest perhaps two topics they *wouldn't* like to debate either from personal feelings or whatever ... though it might make it annoying for the organizing persons.

I read some old debates and it's a shame to see people refuse to debate based on persona feelings.

reply to post by Pinke


Sometimes it's extremely hard to debate certain topic.

I once had to debate the pro life side of abortion, It was extremely difficult for me as I am pro choice. I almost passed completely on the topic. But I instead tried to debate the side of the topic I was given. It was hard, I did loose the debate.

Sometimes it's hard to debate a topic on the opposite side of what you really believe. But you can learn a lot from debating something on the side you won't normally agree with.

reply to post by whatukno


Oh of course you can learn from it but there's just one or two topics I wouldn't want to debate regardless of what side I was on.

If I end up with them I'll try my best and make sure I finish, but I know I'd far prefer just to avoid those one or two topics.

Originally posted by Pinke
I would like if persons could suggest perhaps two topics they *wouldn't* like to debate either from personal feelings or whatever ... though it might make it annoying for the organizing persons.

I read some old debates and it's a shame to see people refuse to debate based on persona feelings.

According to the Fighter's Bill of Rights you do have the right to refuse to debate a position based on certain things:

Fighters' Bill of Rights
Fighters may, without penalty or dishonor, refuse to argue any that position which constitutes:
(1) A religious offense.
(2) A violation of any law or regulation to which fighter is subject.
(3) A source of emotional trauma to the fighter. This includes, but is not necessarily limited to, any debate regarding any type of abuse, adversity, hardship, or disability which has affected the fighter, a fighter's loved ones, or any group/demographic to which the fighter or the fighter's loved ones belong.

I think (though I'd love to see confirmation from one of the Mods on this) that the proper way to deal with this situation would be to send a private message to your opponent and to the debate moderator as soon as the topic is assigned, explaining your objection to the topic and requesting a new one.

Of course, this doesn't cover just disagreeing with the position you've been assigned (which in my experience happens more often than not). In that situation, I've found the best strategy is to try to spin the topic so that it at least points in a direction I can defend, then go all out defending it

Originally posted by whatukno
I once had to debate the pro life side of abortion, It was extremely difficult for me as I am pro choice. I almost passed completely on the topic. But I instead tried to debate the side of the topic I was given. It was hard, I did loose the debate.

Sometimes it's hard to debate a topic on the opposite side of what you really believe. But you can learn a lot from debating something on the side you won't normally agree with.

I agree completely. That was an epic debate. I got the pro-choice side, which I wouldn't have volunteered to argue. I had to really step out of my comfort zone, and ended up learning 10x more than if I'd had the side I was 'comfortable' with.

One secret to doing these debates is to realize that there are 1000s of people who genuinely, passionately believe the case you've been assigned to argue. We must 'give them voice'. It's a form of empathy: finding the belief-system behind the question in the debate and explaining it, making it accessible and understood to the reader. A board like ATS is best when it acts as a bridge, allowing us to create paths of communication and share wildly different viewpoints. The same is true of debating, in its most essential form.