Is the owl on the dollar the same MOLOCH god from Bohemian Grove?

reply to post by dontreally


No, dude.
I haven't mastered it.
I have succumbed to it.
And it is beautiful.

Also, a little advice - beware of thinking you know everything.
Nothing is as it seems or as we are told.
And I mean NOTHING.

Originally posted by CodyOutlaw
reply to post by dontreally

 

No, dude.
I haven't mastered it.
I have succumbed to it.
And it is beautiful.

Isnt that the same thing?

In the language of hell, irrationality, succumbing to evil is 'mastering' it. Not being constrained by the moral boundaries of 'a dualistic mind' is living a 'moral' life.

Satanism inverts everything.

It has its own deluded inner logic to it, granted. The force of the irrational can convey itself as rational...

But the very fact that you need to make the jump between this irrational state, which means you have to acknowledge the reality of evil, as a reality in itself, and not as an impetus created by G-d, thats your mistake.

Evil, doesnt exist, nor does it have to exist as it is now. And i do not mean it in the typical buddhist, there is no evil or good way. I mean only GOOD exists. And no i do not mean it in the even evil is good and beautfiul way. lol

I mean it as evil has its purpose, to cleanse the soul of its defilements - as gold needs to be refined in a hot furnace.

If yuore 'happy' with having 'succumbed' to evil.. Ok. Enjoy the next world. Jewish sages dont teach that this gnostic philosophy poisons the soul with a megalomania for no reason.

Like i said in my earlier post : youre goingto be forced to experience every last bit of the hell you believe youve masterd by succumbing to it.

Even the greatest lover of evil, when subjected to nonstop physical torture, would beg for it to stop. Even if theres a sick satisfaction and enjoyment of it, theres also an ambivalent need and desire for it to just end. Satan is insanity, insanity is not the true fabric of reality, even though many spiritual traditions believe that.

Also, Greek thought was highly influenced by Egyptian and mesopatomian as well as Hindu thought (greek being a subset of the Indo-european language. Greek also being the original language of christianity). Ir includes all these ideas... But no system is most directly apparent in Christianity as Greek... The romans afterall, who merely spread the culture of Greece to the world, were the ones who created christianity and cleverly drew from Jewish teachings but in a very idolatrous way. The entire theosophy was transferred into this Jewish 'garb', without having to drop any of the themes/archetypes of the mythologems of Orphic theology.

To acknowledge it as Greek is incorrect, as it does go further back than that.
As do most of the stories from the OT.
Such as:
The Flood
Noah's Ark
Cain and Abel
The trees in the garden.

All of these can be found in Mesopotamian theology, except, they hadn't been twisted into a monotheistic format yet. All of the inconsistencies and schizophrenic behavior of Yahweh that occurs in the OT can be explained by the mere fact that multiple gods were condensed into one. It was standard practice, as it had been done in Babylon before, for Marduk. The further back you go, the more truth you will find. But you are blinkered by zealotry and blind faith. Yahweh was not responsible for the creation of man. He was merely given dominion over the earth. He is head of a pantheon. These beings your refer to as messengers are gods in their own right. And not all of them are as crazed, jealous and violent as your god.

The rigid monotheism of the Israelite state religion had been inherited from the Hyksos and their worship of Set. Setism/Yahwism would never have taken off as much as it has, if it hadn't been combined erroneously with Christianity. We can thank Paul and the Romans for that. But as for who is more loved? I think you'll find Jesus captured the soul of the world, not your angry storm god.

As yet, Yahweh/Set has not been questioned.
But there will come a time...

Originally posted by CodyOutlaw
To acknowledge it as Greek is incorrect, as it does go further back than that.
As do most of the stories from the OT.
Such as:
The Flood
Noah's Ark
Cain and Abel
The trees in the garden.

All of these can be found in Mesopotamian theology, except, they hadn't been twisted into a monotheistic format yet. All of the inconsistencies and schizophrenic behavior of Yahweh that occurs in the OT can be explained by the mere fact that multiple gods were condensed into one. It was standard practice, as it had been done in Babylon before, for Marduk. The further back you go, the more truth you will find. But you are blinkered by zealotry and blind faith. Yahweh was not responsible for the creation of man. He was merely given dominion over the earth. He is head of a pantheon. These beings your refer to as messengers are gods in their own right. And not all of them are as crazed, jealous and violent as your god.

The rigid monotheism of the Israelite state religion had been inherited from the Hyksos and their worship of Set. Setism/Yahwism would never have taken off as much as it has, if it hadn't been combined erroneously with Christianity. We can thank Paul and the Romans for that. But as for who is more loved? I think you'll find Jesus captured the soul of the world, not your angry storm god.

As yet, Yahweh/Set has not been questioned.
But there will come a time...

Clearly you dont know much about Hebrew or the "old testament" ie; Torah. Can you read Hebrew? The two names of G-d most used in the Torah are Elohim and YHVH. Elohim is plural, an literally means 'powers', indicating the collective total of the pantheon of manifest spiritual forces. Elohim can also be understoof in the singular as simply "G-d", meaning G-d is the collective reality we experience in the mode of nature. This is why Elohim and Hateva (nature, also means 'the word') share the same gematria of 86. Also interesting to note that Ishmael, the father of Islam, was born to Abraham at 86. Allah being derived from the aramaic Elah which is rooted in the Hebrew Elohim......

YHVH conversely is a name of G-d that has absolutely no parallel or cognate in any culture outside of Judaism. You can go searching for etyhomogical similarities. The point is, there are no IDEOLOGICAL cognates to this name. G-d in the mode of YHVH is the name of mercy. The holy one is known simply as "ein sof" - the infinite one. Nothing can be known of him aside from giving negative statements (he is not etc). He assumes archetypal forms in which he relates with man. the two ways are the above two names. When the Torah says YHVH Elokenu, its saying more the "the lord your God" its actually saying The name YHVH IS Elohim, which is a necessary garb between man and his creation.

This world and us cant exist without what the kabbalah calls a 'tzimtzum'. G-ds contracts his infinite light to create a finitie reality in which we can exist. He did this by creating a Void, which contained within it a 'reshimu' a imprint of himself. Within this void he drew a line, a kav, and from the kav the universes were created. Therefore, Elohim, is the archetypal quality of 'contraction', judgement, Nature, whereas YHVH is expansion, mercy and the miraculous. These modes are NECESSARY in not only creating the world, but also in creating a PEACEFUL world. G-d contracted himself in order to REVEAL himself to his creations. Therefore, us humans, who are made in his image are meant to mirror this aspect of contraction. How do we manifest this 'contraction'? Through DISCIPLINE. By limiting ourselves to only morally and ethically correct behavior, we thereby manifest and draw down the higher name, YHVH. This is the essence of life. When one wants to capture a spiritual sentiment, what does he do? He crystalizes this feeling in any artistic form; whether it be poetry, painting, dancing... There need to be a vehicle that can limit this insight and give it expression in space and time. G-d, the creator, who is not simply an isolated 'archetype' as the pagans believe, is EVERYTHING. This is the israelite and Jewish statement of faith "Shema Yisrael , Adonai Elohenu, Adonai Echad". G-d is OUR G-d - ie; god is literally inside me, and everything i experience is aswell experienced by him. I am a physical manifestation of some aspect he wants to reveal. Just as HE created a world within a limited context, so must we we create a spiritual world that limits the moral range of reality to only the good, and that which the 7 noachide commands command as morally correct.

There IS a g-d beyond us. We do not create g-ds. The Torah has word for these creations and the torah constantly says that only YHVH is a G-d. The rest are masekas, pesels, which means a sculptured image, or a molten image; in essence describing the "self made images' that the pagans worship.

These various manifestations in Kabbalah and Torah thought are simply assigned as qualities, that descrive the specific manifestation of the one. Whether as Chesed (love) Gevurah (judgement) or Tiferet (mercy). These arent deified and certainly arent personified. Also, what torah are you reading? You talk as if G-d doesnt show his love? Read the book of Deuteronomy, Leviticus. Do you know the entire book of leviticus which deals with laws does not mention the name Elohim once!? That basically means that by following these laws the name of Elohim, judgement, will become completely sublimated by the name YHVH. G-d throughout the torah speaks in a loving kind way. He even says to those who honor him he;ll show loving kindness to the thousandth generation; wheras those who spurn him will be harmed to a much lesser tenure. As for 'jealousy'. The concept of jealousy isnt bad. and if it should apply to anyone it should be the creator of all reality; our source of existence. In fact, given how people like YOU treat him, hes a G-d of enormous mercy. forgiving even those who deny his very existence.

you should read frankenstein 'the new promotheus' by mary shelly. Its speak exactly to the moral quandary and confusion that lies at the core of all those who struggle with the idea of the G-d of Torah.

Im not ignorant of gnosticism. I havent 'blinded myself with faith and zeal'. I have rationally chosen, which is in my power to do, to follow what i know to be true. I dont believe and i know better than to believe that "evil is the creative principle' as you believe. If youve ever studied Torah which is ABOVE this world, you would see how truly divine it is. Did you know the middle word in the entire Torah (pentateuch) is Darosh, derush which means 'search searchingly' the source of the english word "research". in the very middle the point of the Torah reveals itself. SEARCH Deeply into this work and you'll will discover your purpose in this world.

reply to post by dontreally


Yes, I can rread Hebrew and Aramaic. Also, Akkadian and a couple of others.
You are equating Yahweh with the Father. The creator. This is inaccurate.
Of course, you would think this accurate, as you follow your scriptures dilligently.
But it's incorrect.

The Ab, Ilum, El, the Father, is a removed creator god, distant and unknowable.
This is the Father Jesus refers to.
Certainly not the big ole angry Set/Yahweh you love.

Sorry, man, I know it's frustrating for you, but you cannot convince someone of your correctness, by quoting only your own biased sources. Things go much further back than the Hebrew bible.

Originally posted by CodyOutlaw
reply to post by dontreally

 

Yes, I can rread Hebrew and Aramaic. Also, Akkadian and a couple of others.
You are equating Yahweh with the Father. The creator. This is inaccurate.
Of course, you would think this accurate, as you follow your scriptures dilligently.
But it's incorrect.

The Ab, Ilum, El, the Father, is a removed creator god, distant and unknowable.
This is the Father Jesus refers to.
Certainly not the big ole angry Set/Yahweh you love.

Sorry, man, I know it's frustrating for you, but you cannot convince someone of your correctness, by quoting only your own biased sources. Things go much further back than the Hebrew bible.

How is it my sources are biased, but not yours?

since you can read hebrew, im gonna go far out on the limb and guess you might understand Jewish spirituality.

The greatest artifact we have of the ancient israelites is todays Yehudim - descendents of the tribe of Judah, Benjamin and Levi. Their literature goes as back as 100 BCE (some mishnaic tractates) with Midrash and Talmudic tractates being written throughout the 100 CE to 1000 CE period.

The same underlying spirituality is being discussed in these works. All of them to be understood in a kabbalistic manner, that is, metaphorically. Midrash, Mishna, Talmud etc. The Sefer Yetzirah can be dated at least as far back as the 300 CE, with the Heichalot going even further. The Jewish mystical tradition of the kabbalah is the same today as it was then. Having studied both gnosticism, hinduism, Buddhism, Sufism, and paganism throughout the world, they all share the same common conception of reality. There is literally no fundamental differences. Its all speculative, based on that particular cultures 'experience' of reality, They all have a more or less moral relative tone to it. They all unanimously support the concept of the divine feminine; this is especially apparent in Islam with Fatima and Mary and in Christianity with Mary and her 'virgin birth' and purity. The same concept is being alluded to here. The supremacy of the divine mother over the mean overbearing 'judgemental' father. To feel ashamed for ones behavior it tantamount to 'sin', because one was created that way. to feel ashamed of such a natural action is to deny G-ds very will.

Now, this is why Torah has ALWAYS, throughout the long history of Judaism, been at complete odds with their pagan neighbors. Judaism has no such belief. Judaism believes G-d desires man to change his fundamental nature. To work on himself. This is kabbalistically spoken of throughout the torah and the books of the prophets. There is no way in hell to succesfully reconcile this with the traditional gnostic view; because one, it contradicts the historical reality of the Jewish people and their tradition, and two, their tradition is much more sensible and consistent.

The nations simpyl struggle with vanity and jealousy. The very story of Jacob and esau is also to be comprehended macrocosmically. Jacob is the Good inclination, which appears LATER in life, at around the age of 13. Likewise, the traditional Judaism appears on the world scene in a fantastic fashion with the Jewish exile and subsequent redemption from Egypt. It occured in a highly miraculous fashion. The sea of reeds, a body of water that existed at that time was literally parted open and 3 million Israelites and some gentiles with them crossed through, while the egyptians, the living symbol of constraint and strife, were pummeled by the collapsing waves. This is so allegorically wonderous, first of all, but also second of all, it actually occurred macrocosmically, engineered by no human agent but the creator himself. Also, theres a great kabbalistic secret in the parting of the reed sea.. If you know hebrew and kabbalah, then im sure you know of the particular power of the 72 names of G-d, the shemhamforesh. Esau represents the earlier empires of the world - specifically as Egypt, which represented the acme of its development. G-d was telling man that that epoch in our development was over and done with (alluded to in the sacrifice of Isaac). He was bringing us to a HIGHER level, to the level of Rachamim, to true service and awareness of not just spiritual reality and its dynamics, but the creator of the world himself. But, as we learn in the torah, esau - who is Edom (rome), which as you know also means 'destruction', HATES and is forever jealous of Jacob. Jacob stole what he believes to belong to him - his 'birthright'. But he spurned it. He spurned it by not accepting G-ds decree. Thus, the european nobility, the ancestors of the biblical esau/edom, are waging theuir war against the Jewish people. The church of Rome at its head, the UN 'its teeth', and Nato its fist. Whats going on today in Israel is of course engineered by the power barons, and they intend for it to end up as either a two state solution for Israel and palestine (like shown at the DIA) or an all out war against Israel. I dont know how this will happen, but it could very well be about the 'humanitarian crisis' in 'palestine (which of course is a made up people. You need to have a language to be classified as a people. They speak arabic. They can go to any of teh 22 other arab natiosn. Jews speak Hebew. they are an ancient people who deserve to reunited with the homeland that theyve yearned for for thousands of years). This would result in a "peaceful interjection' by Nato and other UN forces. It would probably end up as things went in Kosovo.

I guess well wait for that time. Till than, my point has been made. Esau, is Rome, the western world and culture, and Jacob is Judaism and todays Jews. Torah is a level of reality which right now exists spiritually, within a book, but soon enough will be realized and materialized when mankind assumes responsbility and when the Jewish temple in Jerusalem is rebuilt.

Hate to poo poo on your degree. I can read Aramaic and Hebrew too. Not Akkadian, though, im sure its an interesting study.

As a theistic satanist, does that make you a sadist? Or, are you only comfortable with evil, and therefore reconciled with it, rather than someone who finds it thrilling and enjoyable...Because, youre complaing about Yahweh, and his cuelty when Rome, who established christianity was more cruel and sadistic than any empire the world has ever seen,. Look at Nazi Germany, Russia, China. This is the product of Esau (russia and germany. China though has become a bastard child of the west) evil, sadistic, Red with blood lust. In truth, hes like frankenstein, massively ashamed and conflicted with his behavior. Hes angry at his creator for having created such a monster, but being so stupid and unaware that the creator has ALREADY showed him hot to change, he instead shirks responsibility and attempts to KILL his creator. Mary Shelly was intimating something quite dramatic and prophetic when she wrote that. Her husband perry Bysshe Shelly, the poet, once said "Poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world. " And its true.

reply to post by dontreally


Actually, both Percy Shelley and Lord Byron were Luciferians. And incredible poets!

But, that's beside the point. The point is that there are no unbiased sources! None! Which is why one must read them all, and use one's own intellect to interpret as you will.

Now, Rome has nothing to do with Jesus. He's merely been used as a figurehead, as always happens. Wars are fought over money and power, land and resources. Religion is used to motivate an unenlightened mass population. What better way to appeal to a human being, than to appeal to his bloodthirsty need to feel self-righteous in their moral beliefs.

You are correct - everything plays out macrocosmically. As above, so below.

But the bloodshed in the Torah was carried out at the direct behest of Yahweh. The bloodshed of the Catholic church was carried out at the direct behest of a series of nasty, disgusting popes, in pursuit of power, money, land and resources.

Am I a sadist? What do you mean by sadist? Someone who goes into a city and kills every living being in sight? Who delights in the death of heathens? Then no, I'll leave that sadism to the "armies and chosen ones of heaven."

reply to post by spiritualgirl


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/d3458fa4a71e.jpg[/atsimg]

"Chemosh was a god developed out of the primitive Semitic mother-goddess Athtar, whose name he bears (Moabite Stone, line 17; compare Barton, "Semitic Origins," iv.). Peake wrongly holds that Ashtar-Chemosh was a deity distinct from Chemosh, while Moore and Bäthgen ("Beiträge zur Semitischen Religionsge. schichte," p. 14) regard "Ashtar" in this name as equivalent to "Astarte," who they believe was worshiped in the temple of Chemosh"

"The etymology of "Chemosh" is unknown. The name of the father of Mesba, Chemosh-melek ("Chemosh is Malik," or "Chemosh is king"; compare Moabite Stone, line 1), indicates the possibility that Chemosh and Malik (or Moloch) were one and the same deity. Judges xi. 24 has been thought by some to be a proof of this, since it speaks of Chemosh as the god of the Ammonites, while Moloch is elsewhere their god (compare I Kings xi. 7, 33). Several critics rightly regard the statement in Judges as a mistake; but such an error was not unnatural. since both Chemosh and Moloch were developed, in different environments, from the same primitive divinity, and possessed many of the same epithets"

Read more: www.jewishencyclopedia.com...

I don't think it represents any god from the Greek pantheon or whatever. The owl was the symbol used for the "m" sound in the ancient Egyptian language, and there are many things occult whose names also begin with the "m" sound.

In response to the original topic, I believe the owl on the dollar bill isnt an owl at all, nor is it a spider. If you can get a really hi res picture of the dollar bill and zoom in on 'the owl' the features that once made it look like an owl at lower res (the head and large eyes) disappear and are merely lines, which upon suggestion do look more like a spider. Take a look at this: www.youtube.com...

But upon further investigation I have realised that this little picture of an 'owl or a spider' is actually nothing more than a part of the pattern on the dollar bill and can be found in numerous other parts of the bill. Watch this: www.youtube.com...

Whether or not this pattern was designed to look vaguely like an owl or not I dont know, but I dont think there's much to it. I only came to this belief recently as I have also always believed there was a picture of an owl on the dollar bill but decided to do some extensive research into Bohemian Grove to see whether the elite are in fact 'devil worshippers'.

What I've found is that the elite do attend Bohemian Grove, that there may be some homosexual activty there, and that they burn 'something' symbolized as their cares of the world in the Cremation of Care, but thats it! I have found no evidence that it is a mock or real human sacrifice. There's no evidence that they are worshipping any demon god or the devil and much of what Alex Jones says in his film about the place is wrong. I cant find any evidence that Molech was symbolized as an owl, he was a bull. Alex says PJ on the cover of the program is a little demon, that's highly speculative, it could be anything. And the supposed childs skeleton could also be anything. It seems theres no evidence to suggest anything other than the elite go there to burn away the cares of their lives symbolized in the ritual, anything else is speculation. If anyone has reliable evidence that suggests otherwise then please show it to me. It seems nobody knows exactly what goes on there.

As for the whole owl thing i think there is something to it but what exactly i dont know. They definitely perform the ritual in front of a huge owl and i believe the shape of the roads around the congress was designed to look like an owl. Why do the elite use the owl symbol? Does anybody have any conclusive proof as to why?