The 'How to Get Out Of The Matrix' thread (w proof)

Originally posted by Redroc64
Hi Dominicus,
You say in your op ,

4. So you say you are an individual with a certain gender, race, age, creed, etc. All beliefs, all labels of the matrix projector the mind none of which are the actual you.

Well if im not the person who is here...Who is it that is here?. And more importantly...Where is the real me?.Also, what is the real me.

This is why these kinds of posts are dangerous. There are so many people (especially now) that are confused about thier lives and meaning right now that to ponder the possibility of creating your own reality is tempting.

YOU are the reality. The world around you is the reality that you are meant to explore and learn from. I find these kinds of beliefs to be hypocritical to a point. The OP speaks of letting go of ego and self but yet what you are proposing is all about SELF. I think that rather than retreating inward, we need to reach out to those around us. Perhaps that is the real lesson....

if this is something that I fabricated ....then fabrications also include what was said by plato, socrates, kanada, siddharta, advaita, philosphers, jesus, the natives, theologians, mystics, monks, hermits, the world over of the last 3000 years.

some odds you got there captain

But seriously, could you quote a thing or two these great men you've named have said about this so-called Matrix?

[edit on 1-9-2010 by ATLien]

reply to post by Redroc64

Well if im not the person who is here...Who is it that is here?. And more importantly...Where is the real me?.Also, what is the real me

The real you is a direct experience that is beyond words. Anything said about this 'true you' brings us to the realm of words ...which are all relative, each person having their own subjective (emotions, feelings, thoughts, and ideas) meaning to what each word means. Words are simply maps and pointers at what is actual ...but actual is beyond words.

Lets say you read a book or listen to somebody's story of what it is like to go to the beach and swim in the summer time. Everything is fine with that ...but the direct experience of swimming in the beach is when all words go out the window ..... you are then, there, in that present moment of that experience.

So instead of reading this and reading that ...it is most important to find out directly through direct experience.

The real you is beyond words, beyond thought, beyond the body. Seek the source of thoughts ...find out where is the root of the thought that you exist, that you are that body and that mind ....where is that thought?

Better yet ...who or what is you that is not a thought? Remember thoughts are just imaginations with no substance ...thoughts are projected by the mind ...the mind is also the projector of this illusion, of the matrix. So look for the answer of what/who you are that is not a thought ...everytime an answer as a thought pops up, discard is a thought and keep going..... he answer will present itself beyond the mind/thoughts....

[edit on 1-9-2010 by dominicus]

It might be wise to put some information about how our brains turn thought into physical activities. It is painfully obvious primates are unable to grasp the concept.lk

I am going to flag the OP.

It is time we started playing the game with all the cards. By refusing to think about these issues, we are only burying heads in the sand.

Thanks for the thought provoking post and I can only hope people will start to address these issues.

Originally posted by win 52
It might be wise to put some information about how our brains turn thought into physical activities. It is painfully obvious primates are unable to grasp the concept.lk

I dunno, I was watching a video the other day of a dolphin learning to blow rings and play with them and them teaching his friends, now they all do it..Also, Apes have begun using sticks to test depth in the water as they wade through it and then teaching there friends..Sounds like some thinking was involved there, don't you think?

[edit on 1-9-2010 by ATLien]

reply to post by dominicus


Wow thank you for the verification. My husband and I thought there was definitely a message in that movie, along with Constantine, Sleepy Hollow, The Craft, The Royal Tennebaums, and so on. You just have to watch it in a different view then what most people see it as. When i first watched that movie, I thought for a split second what if this movie, was what was really going on. Then I dismissed it.

I am trying to study and understand the Qabalah, and I know we are all on Malkuth, which is The Foundation, The Gate, and the gate of the garden of Eden. My belief is that we are all in hell, I mean look around do you actually know any happy people. Do you know anyone who isn't controlled by their Ego, and False Self? I don't, but I am trying to break free from hell, through meditation. I can easily relax now and block out all noises, and see pictures of what I am focusing in my mind. I just need to get there. In order to understand Malkuth, we have to get to the Mother which is Yesod, the moon. once we get to her we actually see our false, or shadow self, and we destroy our Ego, thus we begin to see our will and our true self. Which is what you are basically saying. Then we can choose our own Path or we can move on to Tipareth. Which is the Son, Christ, Buddha, whatever you call it. Then through that we can get to Kether or God. Confused, look up the Qabalah, Kabalah, Cabalah, or however you want to spell it.

So basically everything that you just said to us makes sense, to me. You just confirmed a lot of this stuff I have been thinking about and I thank you for that. We all have the power to do this, just as we all can meditate and get there.

reply to post by mysticalzoe


What!? lol...I'm through with this thread

reply to post by westcoast

This is why these kinds of posts are dangerous. There are so many people (especially now) that are confused about their lives and meaning right now that to ponder the possibility of creating your own reality is tempting.

nothing dangerous about this kind of post.... whats more dangerous is to allow folks to continue in their everyday limited consciousness to make decisions and choices from that perspective.

The attempt of this thread is exactly what you are trying to get to in your own meditations and your own path.

YOU are the reality. The world around you is the reality that you are meant to explore and learn from.

to a certain degree yes ....but it is just learning the limits of the illusion and what is and is not possible in the matrix. Then One reaches an age and intuition that there is something more going on than meets the eye and at this stage most just give up in exchange for regular life (kids, job, school, family etc) ...nothing wrong with that but there are some out there who sacrificed all of this to find out and have found out what is really going on.

I find these kinds of beliefs to be hypocritical to a point. The OP speaks of letting go of ego and self but yet what you are proposing is all about SELF.

Nothing hypocritical here.... the Self is an illusion, an imagination ...its just the thought 'I' or 'I am" .....it is just a thought and has no concrete foundation. Where is the concrete-ness of the thought I ? Any answer is a thought which is more imagination, thought, matrix-projector.

Once this is realized and seen for what it is ...there is a release from the limits of the body, mind ...personality ...it is like seeing from a birds eye view ..seeing everyone's perspective equally ...seeing that it is a huge play ...a matrix.

I think that rather than retreating inward, we need to reach out to those around us. Perhaps that is the real lesson....

thats the thing ....once freed from the matrix .....everyone else becomes soooo much more important to you, even complete strangers ...hence the reason for such a thread ......its not 'i don't give a crap about you guys' ...its more so 'we are all united and important and cut from the same cloth and the cloth is infinite and aware and intelligent and see from every perspective and so on ......."
\
But this cant be seen unless the escape from the matrix has happened ...even if its for a few seconds and then back again ......

reply to post by westcoast


Hi Westcoast,

I am sorry if anyone would find my post dangerous,it was certainly not my intention.

I think in your reply you sort of implied that i may be a selfish person,i can assure you i am not, but do find that our society is awash with this type of person...some though
..through no fault of their own.

I most certainly agree with you that we all should be more selfess and help others.But as you indicated in your post,you have to help yoursef first..is this only achievable through meditation ?. If so,then how else can i help myself..as i am hopless at meditation.

Thanks..

reply to post by ATLien

I dunno, I was watching a video the other day of a dolphin learning to blow rings and play with them and them teaching his friends, now they all do it..Also, Apes have begun using sticks to test depth in the water as they wade through it and then teaching there friends..Sounds like some thinking was involved there, don't you think?

you dont get what is being said here..... yes the mind learns and the mind increases its knowledge base and grows in intelligence. This thread is not taking anything away from the mind itself ...which is a brilliant and awesome tool ....but it is just a tool. And this tool has turned around and claimed your identity and projects its limited perspective to you.

thinking still happens but it is all the realm of imagination. When dolphins learned to blow bubbles ...it happened int hat instant, that moment ...it was happening and then the mind came in later and labeled, and analyzed, and conceptualized.

The moment, learning, reality, everything, including who you really are is all before there are any thoughts about any of it.

What!? lol...I'm through with this thread

That's just her take on it all based on where she is right now in life seeing this through kabbalah(just another branch of knowledge that knows about this), but you took it a certain way and came to a conclusion that you are done with the thread. Like I said 99.9999% won't get this .....it requires wrestling with all of this for quite some time to get it ...took me 10 years. Then I told a friend of mine about this and it took him 3 hours to get it!!!

You seem to me to be describing an interpretation of Zen Buddhism, I used to study this quite a lot and meditated every day but I haven't done it for years.
In Zen the aim of meditation is to transcend the physical realm and your own thoughts and become one with what is called "the void"or the universal whole.

I do have to take some issue with your thread title though as using your consciousness would seem to go against the things I learned, it is your own consciousness that you are trying to escape in the first place.
Also I don't really see how you can have transcended your own thoughts if the 4th line in your post is "I have been thinking for quite some time how to word this"

They way I was taught to think about meditation is thus.
Sit still in a silent room and try not to think, you will soon notice that even though you are consciously trying not to think anything that thoughts will still come into your head about completely random things, "do I have enough milk", "did I pay that gas bill"
As these thoughts are appearing against your will you can start to question where they are coming from, which part of "you" is thinking these random things.
After some practice you can get to the stage where these thoughts stop occurring, but they will be replaced by other things like "hey my legs are really hurting by sitting in the lotus position", you then move on to ignore these thought too.
Until you reach a point on "no mind"

As I said I don't practice meditation any more but it's a wonderfully relaxing thing to do.

reply to post by dominicus


Thanks for your answer Dominicus,

I had to read your answer a few times there ...not because i was confused..but because it sort of makes sense to me..even if i truly still do not understand fully.

Can i ask you Dominicus..if i ask myself who and what i am, and i am then answered by my own thoughts..how will this lead to me finding who i really am if i discard my answers in my thoughts...told you i dont fully understand yet

Thanks.

reply to post by davespanners

You seem to me to be describing an interpretation of Zen Buddhism, I used to study this quite a lot and meditated every day but I haven't done it for years.

thats the thing ...we can find this escape from the Matrix philosophy not only in Zen buddhism but also amongst philosophers (some who were agnostic), Christianity, Hinduism ....that state isn't subject to any branch ...instead multiple branches put their own interpretation on that state.

Also I don't really see how you can have transcended your own thoughts if the 4th line in your post is "I have been thinking for quite some time how to word this"

That's the thing tho ...that 'I' is used to wrestle with how to word the state beyond I into the language that all other I's use. Having transcended the I is only known by the state of No 'I', to everyone else everything seems exactly the same ....i.e. the nature of the matrix.

As these thoughts are appearing against your will you can start to question where they are coming from, which part of "you" is thinking these random things.

1 of may techniques ....notice that that 'you' that starts to question which part of you are these thoughts coming from ....is also a thought.

reply to post by ATLien

Originally posted by ATLien

if this is something that I fabricated ....then fabrications also include what was said by plato, socrates, kanada, siddharta, advaita, philosphers, jesus, the natives, theologians, mystics, monks, hermits, the world over of the last 3000 years.

some odds you got there captain

But seriously, could you quote a thing or two these great men you've named have said about this so-called Matrix?

To give a modern parallel, similar to, but outside of the Matrix, lets use Inception as a case study. Inception whether intentionally or inadvertently borrows heavily from Kabbalistic concepts,

In Your Dreams: The Kabbalah of Inception

... Kabbalah considers our physical world an illusion, a temporary residence, and not true reality. ...

rabbisimcha.com...

And it didn't take Jewish scholars to pick up on this,

"Inception," the science fiction thriller by writer-director Christopher Nolan that easily qualifies as the most highly anticipated movie of the summer, opens with a dramatic shot of huge waves breaking onto a nameless shore. And that image suggests the best way to watch a film with such a tightly coiled plot, cerebral conceits and formidable ambition. Rather than trying to game out "Inception" on first viewing, it's best to let it wash over you, and save the head-scratching and inevitable Talmudic interpretations for later.

www.washingtonpost.com...

The general view-point from Rabbinic sages is that there's an external reality, which is composed of 5 universes spread over a total of 10 planes. At the pinnacle of progression through these various worlds is complete ascension, a connection with limitlessness (antediluvian-man gave this concept the label 'God').

If you're looking for academic citations, verifying this really was the viewpoint of these ancient philosophers, I'd highly recommend reading one of the primary sources like Etz Hayyim by Rabbi Vital; or for a more gentle introduction I'd suggest Inner Space by Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan.

Hope this helps.

[edit on 1-9-2010 by Xtraeme]

reply to post by dominicus


Miraj = Former christian mystic.

Who's assuming now?

Miraj = someone who lives by assumptions and beliefs prior to having investigated themselves directly on whether or not there is any substantial truth to the matter. In this case not knowing that the title 'mystic' cannot be simply chosen but is bestowed on and stuck to those who have been initiated into direct experience of reality behind the proverbial curtain that the masses operate in front of.

I have a quote for you.

And Jesus said unto them, "And whom do you say that I am?"
They replied, "You are the eschatological manifestation of the ground of our being, the ontological foundation of the context of our very selfhood revealed."
And Jesus replied, "What?"

I know you feel special, but I just call it delusions of grandeur.

reply to post by Miraj

Miraj = Former christian mystic. Who's assuming now?

still no assumptions on this end ...if your a former Christian Mystic then 1. you missed the point all together. 2.You were never one in the first place as the experiences that happen to one are direct initiations and make one a mystic. One cannot chose to be one.

But that's neither here nor there.....its not about your label or mine

I have a quote for you. And Jesus said unto them, "And whom do you say that I am?" They replied, "You are the eschatological manifestation of the ground of our being, the ontological foundation of the context of our very selfhood revealed." And Jesus replied, "What?"

good humor ...yet more in that humor is the ground of truth. A blueprint of truth. Actually when he asked who do people say he is ....many answers were given..... how does the mentality of the culture from over 2,000 years ago even begin to comprehend what Jesus was all about ..... hence the parables to dumb it down to a bunch of sleepwalking hard headed Jews.

I know you feel special, but I just call it delusions of grandeur.

Spare me your continuous assumptions friend .......the 'I, me' that could or might feel special in all this has been seen over a year ago to be a joke, an illusion, not real ......there is no one here to feel special.

You call them delusions of grandeur, let us rejoice that were not building off of your subjective views.

Granted the odds are in favor of 3000 years of philosophy, theology, mysticism, spirituality and so on in the various paths that say absolute truth and the state of no 'I' is by no means delusions of grandeur. Again better odds than your stance my friend ....and yet your stance is all part of the play of the Matrix.

this guys videos are similar. to that concept atleast. Crazy stuff. IlluminatiMatrix

[edit on 1-9-2010 by Myendica]

reply to post by mysticalzoe


Wow...I'm sorry that you see our lives here so bad as to think we are in hell. It makes me sad to think that so many people probably feel the same way you do. We are misguided which leads to confusion and fear.

The world around us and our lives are a wonderful gift from God. I believe that we are here to learn and grow, not to run away from it. I don't understand why so many want so desperatly to break free...I honestly believe that our lives are what we make them. I think the 'assention' is what will happen when our souls are freed from our physical body at death, which is the natural course of everyones lives. How we choose to live our lives will dictate where our soul continues to after our death.

This life is incredible! There is negative and positive energy. It is up to us which we connect to. We don't need to 'break free' from anything. There are so many incredible things right here in front of us that we could spend many lifetimes exploring it and still only understand a small portion of it.

Personally, I am chosing to concentrate on the positive, incredible energy of the holy spirit and live out this life here on earth to the best of my ability. Hell is not earth, it is our own device and choice to dwell in the negative.

reply to post by GBP/JPY


Yup, you just described what I said but in a different manner..

See where this is going?

You have alot of good points, ... and some deep insight, why go and ruin it all with a tagline like " The Matrix".

I know you dont mean the matrix, literaly, but people have seen so many " matrix this, matrix that" threads that they automaticaly lump you in with that group and assume your thread is a bunch of nonsense written by an Emo Teen.

The Matrix is a movie, ....


.. This is a spiritual revolution.