Quran written because Bible corrupted?

I have heard that due to the Holy Bible being corrupted that the Quran was written to correct those errors. Is there any truth in this?


1John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God. 8 He that loveth not knoweth not God; for God is love.

reply to post by LAinhabitant


I am putting my neck on the block here - but I believe that anything written by man is full of lies.

So, the Bible does not spell out the truth.

The Qran does not spell out the truth.

We have to spell out our own truth.

I was just reading a great article on this. Tell me what you think of the article.
www.messiahtruth.com...

The Claim of Corruption in the Bible -- Do Muslims offer proof supporting corruption in the Bible? Yes, they do. Where do they derive this proof? They derive it mainly from atheists whose aim in pointing out "contradictions" is to convince people that G-d does not exist. For someone who already believes in G-d's existence, this should seem to be a rather questionable ethic. Secondly, Muslim apologists will sort through biblical archeology and biblical criticism, each of which range from both ends of the spectrum, from supporting the Bible 100% all the way to saying that the Bible is 100% fiction. Once having done that, they present the material that is best suited for their purposes, never telling anyone what a hot issue biblical criticism is, or that for every negative view, there is an equal and opposite positive view. Thirdly, the Qu'ran itself says that the word of G-d cannot be altered, all the while making the claim that the Bible was originally the word of G-d but corrupted by man. This is a contradiction in itself. If the Torah was the word of G-d, that means, according to the Qu'ran, that it is categorically impossible for man to change it. Hence, using Muslim logic, the Torah we have in our hands today is the same Torah that Moses handed down to the Jews at Mount Sinai.

[edit on 31-8-2010 by Romantic_Rebel]

the quaran was not written because the bible is tainted, because even the quaran is tainted. Mouhamad want his own religion which exalted him. Jesus was in fact the Christ(Son of God), and Islam blasphemies that truth.

Originally posted by clever024
the quaran was not written because the bible is tainted, because even the quaran is tainted. Mouhamad want his own religion which exalted him. Jesus was in fact the Christ(Son of God), and Islam blasphemies that truth.

You are both right and wrong on that part. Muhammad did want his own religion. Because he wanted all of Mecca. Where your wrong at is that Jesus is not the son of God. God cannot have children.
www.messiahtruth.com...

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


Ok. I can take an "I'm wrong" but yes God can have kids. God can do anything God wants. omniopotent! But the fact is what made Jesus the son of God was the Holy Spirit, which decended on him from heaven during his baptism, God is SPIRIT, thus God's son, is Spirit made FLESH!

Originally posted by clever024
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

 

Ok. I can take an "I'm wrong" but yes God can have kids. God can do anything God wants. omniopotent! But the fact is what made Jesus the son of God was the Holy Spirit, which decended on him from heaven during his baptism, God is SPIRIT, thus God's son, is Spirit made FLESH!

Still your wrong. You seem to don't know what G-D is and how G-D works.
judaism.about.com...

CHRISTIANITY CONTRADICTS JEWISH THEOLOGY The following theological points apply primarily to the Roman Catholic Church, the largest Christian denomination, and the one most familiar to the Western world.
A. GOD AS THREE? The Catholic idea of Trinity breaks God into three separate beings: The Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost (Matthew 28:19). Contrast this to the Shema, the basis of Jewish belief: "Hear O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is ONE" (Deut. 6:4). Jews declare the Shema every day, while writing it on doorposts (Mezuzah), and binding it to the hand and head (Tefillin). This statement of God's One-ness is the first words a Jewish child is taught to say, and the last words uttered before a Jew dies. In Jewish law, worship of a three-part god is considered idolatry -- one of the three cardinal sins that a Jew should rather give up his life than transgress. This explains why during the Inquisitions and throughout history, Jews gave up their lives rather than convert.
B. MAN AS GOD? Christians believe that God came down to earth in human form, as Jesus said: "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30). Maimonides devotes most of the "Guide for the Perplexed" to the fundamental idea that God is incorporeal, meaning that He assumes no physical form. God is Eternal, above time. He is Infinite, beyond space. He cannot be born, and cannot die. Saying that God assumes human form makes God small, diminishing both His unity and His divinity. As the Torah says: "God is not a mortal" (Numbers 23:19). Judaism says that the Messiah will be born of human parents, and possess normal physical attributes like other people. He will not be a demi-god, and will not possess supernatural qualities. In fact, an individual is alive in every generation with the capacity to step into the role of the Messiah. (see Maimonides - Laws of Kings 11:3)

[edit on 31-8-2010 by Romantic_Rebel]

lol, see the thing is, every generation does not need a messiah, they already had one, named Jesus Christ. and last time I checked Jesus was born to human parents. (well one) as for supernatural abilities, I believe they would have SOME supernatural abilities granted by God, because of Moses and Elijah both had supernatural abilities granted by God. if they do not, then they were merely insane men who decided to make a change, and now people look at them as "prophets". God works through people, not the other way around. obviously you let some websites that have no obscure biblical facts taken out of context for your fact. read the book as a whole. all this is IMO.

[edit on 31-8-2010 by clever024]

Originally posted by clever024
lol, see the thing is, every generation does not need a messiah, they already had one, named Jesus Christ. and last time I checked Jesus was born to human parents. (well one) as for supernatural abilities, I believe they would have SOME supernatural abilities granted by God, because of Moses and Elijah both had supernatural abilities granted by God. if they do not, then they were merely insane men who decided to make a change, and now people look at them as "prophets". God works through people, not the other way around. obviously you let some websites that have no obscure biblical facts taken out of context for your fact. read the book as a whole. all this is IMO.

[edit on 31-8-2010 by clever024]

Yes Moses and Elijah did perform miracles. But miracles dose not mean their convent with G-D. How can Jesus be born of a Virgin but have normal human parents? That's a huge contradiction! On miracles again.

judaism.about.com...

Of the 15,000 religions in human history, only Judaism bases its belief on national revelation -- i.e. God speaking to the entire nation. If God is going to start a religion, it makes sense He'll tell everyone, not just one person. Judaism, unique among all of the world's major religions, does not rely on "claims of miracles" as the basis for its religion. In fact, the Bible says that God sometimes grants the power of "miracles" to charlatans, in order to test Jewish loyalty to the Torah (Deut. 13:4). Maimonides states (Foundations of Torah, ch. 8): The Jews did not believe in Moses, our teacher, because of the miracles he performed. Whenever anyone's belief is based on seeing miracles, he has lingering doubts, because it is possible the miracles were performed through magic or sorcery. All of the miracles performed by Moses in the desert were because they were necessary, and not as proof of his prophecy. What then was the basis of [Jewish] belief? The Revelation at Mount Sinai, which we saw with our own eyes and heard with our own ears, not dependent on the testimony of others... as it says, "Face to face, God spoke with you..." The Torah also states: "God did not make this covenant with our fathers, but with us -- who are all here alive today." (Deut. 5:3) Judaism is not miracles. It is the personal eyewitness experience of every man, woman and child, standing at Mount Sinai 3,300 years ago.

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


Ok, Jesus was born to a virgin yes, but thats not what makes him God. I have heard of cases of women bearing child with an intact hymen before. but whats completely IDIOTIC about your refuting "comment" is God testing people's "allegience" to scriptute. NO God would say hey, here is a document that man help write and thus has been corrupted because of its editing, so lets test peoples allegience to it. think about it. now, I'm going to stop replying because you have 2 lines of "original thought" and a bunch of copy and pate good day to you!

Originally posted by clever024
reply to post by Romantic_Rebel

 

Ok, Jesus was born to a virgin yes, but thats not what makes him God. I have heard of cases of women bearing child with an intact hymen before. but whats completely IDIOTIC about your refuting "comment" is God testing people's "allegience" to scriptute. NO God would say hey, here is a document that man help write and thus has been corrupted because of its editing, so lets test peoples allegience to it. think about it. now, I'm going to stop replying because you have 2 lines of "original thought" and a bunch of copy and pate good day to you!

I already proven to you that Jesus is not the Messiah; He never fulfilled the necessary prophecies to become the Messiah. I would leave this message for you though.


www.simpletoremember.com...

Maimonides states that the popularity of Christianity (and Islam) is part of God’s plan to spread the ideals of Torah throughout the world. This moves society closer to a perfected state of morality and toward a greater understanding of God. All this is in preparation for the Messianic age. Indeed, the world is in desperate need of Messianic redemption. War and pollution threaten our planet; ego and confusion erode family life. To the extent we are aware of the problems of society, is the extent we will yearn for redemption. As the Talmud says, one of the first questions a Jew is asked on Judgment Day is: "Did you yearn for the arrival of the Messiah?" How can we hasten the coming of the Messiah? The best way is to love all humanity generously, to keep the mitzvot of the Torah (as best we can), and to encourage others to do so as well. Despite the gloom, the world does seem headed toward redemption. One apparent sign is that the Jewish people have returned to the Land of Israel and made it bloom again. Additionally, a major movement is afoot of young Jews returning to Torah tradition. The Messiah can come at any moment, and it all depends on our actions. God is ready when we are. For as King David says: "Redemption will come today—if you hearken to His voice."

I love how everyone talks about religion like they know as "fact" what is real and what isn't..

Wake up!!! There are "NO" proven facts about religion, any religion!!!

Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs but I'm personally sick of people quoting religious books as FACT...

Even then, most religious books are written in a way that leaves them open to different interpretations that will be argued over for eternity..

Does anyone else not think there was a reason for that??

Why were all these "so called" books of fact not written with clear meaning??

Anyways, enough rant..Do go on.

If you take it that the Quran was written because of the flaws in the bible you can then argue that the book of Mormon was written because all preceding religious books are flawed.

The book of Mormon was published in 1830. Personally I think all religious books are flawed because they where written by man. What I see in almost all relgions is men using the fear of god to control other men and to have control over women. Crowd control for the masses.

reply to post by jpmail


To me thats not a theory,
It's a fact...

Religion was "invented" to control the masses...
Thats it..Nothing more...

Originally posted by CynicalM

Wake up!!! There are "NO" proven facts about religion, any religion!!!

The one irrefutable fact about religion is that there is, ancient and modern,
irrefutable evidence that religion or faith is important to people.

All religions are merely systemic apparatus to explain and bring order to human metaphysical awareness and experience.

Originally posted by LAinhabitant
I have heard that due to the Holy Bible being corrupted that the Quran was written to correct those errors. Is there any truth in this?

Read the book "Why I am not a Muslim" by Ibn Warriq.
He tells the complete history of how Islam was invented and why.
The Quran is a freak'n mess. The 'history' presented in it is dead wrong.
It's a mish-mash of what the pagans of the time believed, what the
Jews believed and (wrong) bible history.

Seriously .. it's one of the best books I've ever read.
Get it. Read it. Excellent!

reply to post by teapot

The one irrefutable fact about religion is that there is, ancient and modern,
irrefutable evidence that religion or faith is important to people.

All religions are merely systemic apparatus to explain and bring order to human metaphysical awareness and experience.

All just a very nice way to say "control the riff raff"...

reply to post by Romantic_Rebel


I am finding your posts quite amusing!

To claim that you understand god, know what it thinks, and take all thosed biased prophecies as some sort of truth is not only arrogant, it is extremely close minded.

I have no problems with what you choose to believe, but beliefs are all they are.

Nothing is proven, nothing is written in stone - you can link to all the sites of a particular religion that you choose to, it still does not constitute proof.

When someone proves one way or the other that god exists or does not, that is the end of faith, which all religions require.

In other words, conclusive proof, will mean the end of religion as we know it.

Maybe that's not such a bad thing...

Originally posted by Romantic_Rebel

Originally posted by clever024
the quaran was not written because the bible is tainted, because even the quaran is tainted. Mouhamad want his own religion which exalted him. Jesus was in fact the Christ(Son of God), and Islam blasphemies that truth.

You are both right and wrong on that part. Muhammad did want his own religion. Because he wanted all of Mecca. Where your wrong at is that Jesus is not the son of God. God cannot have children.
www.messiahtruth.com...

I always find this argument interesting. If that were the case, and God was real, that would mean Jesus was the only person that ever existed that was NOT the son/daughter of God and everyone else is. So, I guess Jesus was pretty special.

If one believes in the Bible then one believes that our "Father in Heaven" is just that. "Our Father". The creator of the human race and therefore our father and therefore we are ALL his children.

Every single one of us, including Jesus is a child of God. It doesn't matter if he was born to a virgin Mary or not. For some reason that's important to people, but to me it's not. I don't care how he was born or if his mother was a virgin or what. As long as he was human he was a son of God, our brother in the human race, and he tried to do what he thought was right. That's all that's important to me.

Also, I think it's quite impressive that a god that supposedly cannot have children has over six billion of them on the planet right now alone! Not even considering the ones that have passed away!

God must be a smooth talker! That's how he gets him into bed I guess. Tells them he's shooting blanks and then whoops too late! Shoulda used protection! Got over 6 billion kids now and growing lol! Pretty impressive for a "god" that can't have children.

Not that Jesus though!! OH NO! He's not mine. I'm not paying child support on that one. I mean of all the people that ever lived on the planet. Boy that Jesus one. That's the ONE that's Definitely not NOT MINE! lol HAHAHA.

You see the irony would be that Jesus wasn't the son of God and every one else that ever existed WAS a child of God, but Jesus wasn't even though he would be the most likely candidate. See the irony? Get it? Oh never mind, I digress.

Also, to say that God cannot have children. By definition that would mean God isn't a god. If he exists he created the Adam and Eve. He definitely could create one more being by hand if he had to or chose to. A god would capable of all things regardless of if humans could understand it or not.

The word god doesn't just mean ruler. It means ruler of ALL things. Including the universe, the laws of nature and physics, and the space time continuum and every atom in the universe/multiverse of which he could surely arrange into a fetus if he so chooses to.

To imply that God is not capable of something means he's not a god. It would mean it was alien or perhaps a higher being or inter dimensional being or a demon or something like that.

Something that may seem higher or more powerful than yourself, but is still restricted by something even more powerful than itself, say the physical laws of the universe or a even a higher conscious being or something like that.

But that's not something that should be worshiped. Studied perhaps, communicated with perhaps, but a being that is NOT a god and that is NOT capable of ALL things, but that is claiming to BE a god and capable of ALL things is being deceptive. So, watch out for that.

To say that God cannot have children is to say that God isn't completely free to exercise his will or his design and therefore isn't all powerful and therefore is not the ruler of ALL things and therefore is not God.

He is not the highest of highs because he himself is restricted by some higher power or some rule that is enforced by some higher power. That there is some higher force above God that would stop him from doing such a thing like the laws of physics or space time or biology or a higher conscious being on another plane of existence or something. For God to be a god there can be nothing like that.

For example if there was a higher being telling God what to do then God wouldn't be God. The higher being telling God what to do would be the real god.

A true god must be the highest of highs and therefore there is no force more powerful than it to restrict it from doing anything it might please. The God of the Bible isn't restricted by the universe or natural laws because God created the universe and the natural laws if you believe the Bible and could have created them anyway he wanted.

If not then there was some higher force restricting what God could do. If that's the case then God isn't God. Because then he couldn't have created the universe for example because for laws of physics to exist that could have restricted what God wanted to do when creating the universe there would have already had to have been a universe in existence for a set of natural laws to exist in and therefore be applied to this creator to restrict him from doing what he wanted to do.

So, if the universe already existed God could not have created it, and if it didn't exist there were no laws of physics in existence yet that could have restricted God in anyway. So, it's got to be one or the other.

As in the multiverse theory it is hypothesized that each universe has its own set of physics therefore meaning the natural laws of the universe can't apply until the universe itself is created or comes into existence.

So, if God is really god, what could have stopped him from creating a universe where he could have children if he wanted? If he were truly a god then nothing, but if something then it is not a god. It is a deceptive higher being that has lied and deceived the entire human race by telling us there were no limits to its power when there in fact were limits and restrictions, such as not being able to have or create children.

Now I'm not saying God is real or not real, but when one says God they imply a being that isn't restricted by ANYTHING and is capable of EVERYTHING. Anything short of that, it is not a God. It's just alien being of some sort or it doesn't exist at all.

[edit on 31-8-2010 by tinfoilman]

[edit on 31-8-2010 by tinfoilman]

The koran was written as record of oral stories from a man of dubious character. His vision of peace and religion is a work of violence, intolerance,and conquest. It's really a reflection of his character flaws. Modern Islamic flowers tend to cherry pick the "good" parts as shining examples of their religion and how it's really a group hug waiting to happen.

The Bible is 1) a history book with the old testament 2) a recount, from various perspectives, of Jesus and the basis of Christianity with the new testament. It is a compilation of books from known historical figures and unknown authors.

The Bible has undergone revisions with books added or taken as political views changed.

The koran has been unedited, unchanged since day one.

I believe the Bible has been corrupted by man with his tampering of the original version of the Bible.

I truly believe the koran is a work of fiction by a man who was a pedophile and who had serious flaws in basic human character. Mohamed must have had the gift of public speaking in honest tones, such as Hitler had. Otherwise, no one would believe his stories and the load of crap he spouted.

Bottom line, it's a question of personal faith to your religion.

Obviously, people of the Islamic religion will want to kill me, just following their religion, for blaspheming their prophet.