The real ATS conspiracy PART 2: Whispers of the Past

Good day ATS, I bring to you now part 2 of The Real ATS Conspiracy. Before anyone gets all worked up, this will simply be but a retelling of some classic ATS history. This will explain where the first COINTELPRO accusations originally arose, and why some of the people we see in my first thread had grudges against ATS. This thread will recount the story of WhispersInTheDark (we'll call him WITD), some apparently also knew him as -shhh-whispers, but that member is non-existent. At one time, this subject was completely taboo. Many people will probably know this story, and many will not.

According to his profile, he registered on August the 4th, 2003. WITD was known as a cryptic and mysterious poster, often using code words and intelligence slang in his posts. It was one single post by WITD that started a chain of events so intriguing that ATS is now left with its own conspiracy. The following is a true story. If his profile is correct, WITD posted the following message onto ATS the same day he registered:

rumors from inside the beltway -- August may be hell

Whispers --

Chaos on Capital Hill.
The football has been replaced by a dummy for the dummy.
Doves are fighting but hawks are regrouping.
The commander-in-chief takes a little time off. A trip. Out-of-the-hill. Just like before 9-11.
Who has the football? Why?

Rumors. Whispers. Fears.

Watch Jakarta.

Sixteen hours later the Marriot Hotel bombing took place in Jakarta, killing 12 people and injuring 150. This sent ATS into a frenzy, people began to think WITD might have been a high level intelligence agent. Obviously he could have simply edited his post after the bombings, but ATS forum software always leaves a record of the edit, and there was no such edit mark on WITD's post.

Soon enough an ATS member informed the FBI of the situation. I'm nor sure if it was ATS staff or the FBI, but all of WITD's posts were sucked up, completely wiping out almost everything he'd ever written on ATS. The FBI declared the post by WITD a hoax. SkepticOverlord believes WITD "took advantage of a weakness in the forum software, enabling him to edit his post directly in the database, thus, not leaving an edit mark". SkepticOverlord expands on this:

So, for a short-term fix, I simply altered one key attribute in the posts database table, making it nearly impossible for an XSS exploit to work. That stopped the madness.

Some weeks later, when I was doing some server housekeeping, I noticed an old directory... abovetopsecret.com/xmb ... It contained all the old, super-sloppy XMB 1.6 code from the previous server that I put in place when we moved to the new server, and XMB 1.8! I forgot about it... but some members where using it during our first move to a dedicated server. It was still functioning. That's where he accessed the exploitable scripts.

WITD was declared to be nothing but a simple "script kiddie". However, many members would not accept this outcome, they believed there was more to it than what they were being told. They argued there were several key pieces of apparent evidence that implied perhaps the posts were made before the bombings:

1) Two members and DragonRider (an mod at the time, now banned) believed they had read WITD's Jakarta warning before the bombings.
2) WITD apparently knew the FBI had been contacted before ATS administration was even aware of it.
3) The CIA apparently did know about the bombings before they happened.
4) The IP's left by WITD traced back to DoD intelligence networks. I think DragonRider, being a mod at the time and able to see poster IP's, discovered this.
5) There were members that had replied to WITD's original post and had quoted what he said, their posts were also dated before the bombings took place, which means he would had to of also changed the date of those posts.

Lets examine each of those points, ignoring the first one for the moment. If WITD was aware the FBI had been contacted before ATS administration, he either had connections to the FBI, or the person that alerted the FBI also alerted WITD that the FBI had been contacted. The third point if true (I haven't looked into it) means it's possible WITD did in fact get his information from the FBI. WITD's IP addresses and the dates on the subsequent posts by other members could also have been changed by WITD via exploits, however changing dates on others posts could be considered above the ability of a simple script kiddie.

Now, onto DragonRider, a mod at the time, an extremely respected member, and now apparently dead according to rumor. He was the one that kept pushing the subject of WITD, and also one of those that believed they saw WITD's prediction before the bombings, because of this, it inevitably ended with him being banned, and a whole heap of members that left with him. He either got too close to the truth or got to become overly obsessed and annoying over a hoax. It was apparently October or November 2003 on a Sunday afternoon, some time after the initial WITD events, ATS was hacked and SkepticOverlord's U2U's were made public. In this thread at Amkon, you can read (you'll need to scroll down a bit) what is supposedly a post made by DragonRider after it was discovered that one of these U2U's contained a conversation between SkepticOverlord and Bob88, in this U2U Bob88 admits that he was WITD.

Now there are many different possible explanations for how and why those U2U's became public. I personally think the chances are quite low that the U2U discussing WITD was real, but I'm trying to keep personal opinion out of this. Now lets examine some things. If it were any of staff members that enacted this WITD hoax, it could only be one of the admin's (presumably just the 3 amigos). This lies in the fact that you need database access in order to edit the date of a post, either that, or you need to be using some sort of script exploit, which I'm assuming none of the staff would be doing.

We are therefore left with two possible conclusions, either WITD was the real deal, or he was some sort of hacker, though obviously much more than a simple script kiddie IMO, if true. There are many different theories I could start putting forward at this point, though I'll leave that up to the reader. To be honest, this is quite a complex and highly diluted subject, it's hard to know what's real and what's not at this point, I haven't, and probably can't, make any solid conclusions about all this, not that I've done excessive research. I'm sure there's lots more to this story, which I'm hoping members will feel free to add, or correct me where I am wrong.

Now we can't go without including the official comic version of this story can we, as taken from: ATS History: COINTELPRO and "WhispersInTheDark". I suggest reading through that thread, and all other threads I link to in this post, you will hear all sides of this argument by doing so.




Also, before I finish this up, there was a weird correlation I noticed. Most people should know by now that the movie "Knowing" predicted the Gulf of Mexico rig explosion, yes, that's right, a movie about predicting the future predicted the future. The footage in the movie looked almost identical to that of the real life event. If you've seen that movie, you will know the number list was created by a girl who heard "Whispers", these whispers were also mentioned at other points in the movie, but never fully explained. In both cases, it appears the source of these so called predictions were "whispers", assuming of course that WITD's predictions were real.

A quote from the movie Knowing:

How do they talk to you?
They whisper into our heads.

A quote from WhispersInTheDark:

The whispers tell us stories.
They tell us what to watch.
They tell us what to ignore.

Related Pages:

COINTELPRO and ATS? - A thread made by DragonRider.
The WITD Whispers Thread - All recovered WITD posts.
POLL: WITD - What did people think at the time?

[edit on 23/8/10 by CHA0S]

I loved your other thread on this stuff, you have made me aware of segment of this sites history i was never aware of.

I have to say this is probably the only thing I have ever read on ATS that I think could be a real possibility. I truly think you are on to something, the only thing i could add is that i implore you to keep copies of all you work.

Ohh.. and keep up the good work

S&F

reply to post by kevinunknown

the only thing i could add is that i implore you to keep copies of all you work.

Don't worry, I do. And I'm glad you like the thread.

reply to post by CHA0S


I really hope that the MODS let us discuss this and keep the thread up

Also you might want to fix one of your links it’s just not working it’s in this bit of the OP

“ATS was hacked and SkepticOverlord's U2U's were made public. In this thread at Amkon, you can read (you'll need to scroll down a bit) what is supposedly a post made by”

Well its not working its not a 404 i think it might be the wrong URL. Interestingly however I tried accessing some other threads to do with this after reading it and I can’t get on to them because of the 404’s.

I would really like to learn more about this so am off to do some of my own research, if i find anything new i’ll let you know.

Originally posted by CHA0S
WITD was declared to be nothing but a simple "script kiddie".

This is indeed the case.

1) Two members and DragonRider (an mod at the time, now banned) believed they had read WITD's Jakarta warning before the bombings.

He had a number of "personal demons" that were only exacerbated by these events. He was wrong.

2) WITD apparently knew the FBI had been contacted before ATS administration was even aware of it.

Since he had the ability to run unchecked queries on publicly available code and data schema, it's conceivable he stumbled onto the U2U conversation with members who were discussing contacting the FBI... indeed, one member (not the one making contact) informed us of the conversation.

4) The IP's left by WITD traced back to DoD intelligence networks. I think DragonRider, being a mod at the time and able to see poster IP's, discovered this.

They were able to alter the database and change their recorded IP at will.

5) There were members that had replied to WITD's original post and had quoted what he said, their posts were also dated before the bombings took place, which means he would had to of also changed the date of those posts.

He was able to alter anything in the database, including the recorded date of any post.... or alter old posts so as to make them seem to support his story.


One missing piece... Dragonrider, unable to believe or trust us, went so far as to post the basis of our explanation on the XMB support forum, trying to ascertain if it was possible for a person to exploit version 1.6 of their software in that manner that was observed. The unequivocal response from their support team was YES. But even then, he refused to believe the "WITD" person was anything but a prankster.

I have heard of this member, WITD...

What if he were telling the truth and did know certain things? Makes it interesting to say the least. To me it just seems like a lot of work to make a hoax like that. Guess we will never know the truth of the story.

I also wonder about darknight too. He seemed out there but you just never know. His posts were interesting as well to me.



edit...read SO's post..wow..


[edit on 8/23/2010 by mblahnikluver]

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


WOW! I didn't know all of this. Why would anyone do a hoax like that? For fun? Sounds like too much work to me. I guess some people get a kick out of hoaxing others.

reply to post by SkepticOverlord


Thanks for tuning in SO. As you'll see I covered most of the explanations you gave, I have to admit it your story does hold up, and I tend to believe you, maybe because I like this website so much, but it certainly is a mysterious and intriguing story in any case. I think it's brilliant that ATS actually has a conspiracy of it's own, so please forgive me for sharing it, even if it is of this nature.

[edit on 23/8/10 by CHA0S]

Originally posted by mblahnikluver
What if he were telling the truth and did know certain things?

How much more clear can we be?

He was a prankster who knew the exploits available in XMB 1.6.

Originally posted by SkepticOverlord

Originally posted by mblahnikluver
What if he were telling the truth and did know certain things?

How much more clear can we be?

He was a prankster who knew the exploits available in XMB 1.6.

I just read your post I was typing mine while you posted yours

that is just nuts.. guess some people get a kick out of stuff like this.

reply to post by CHA0S


Wow! That last post is pretty damaging whatever way you look at it.

What is the official ATS line on that post?


So are you saying, just to be clear that in the past ATS staff contacted the FBI about a user?

reply to post by kevinunknown

So are you saying, just to be clear that in the past ATS staff contacted the FBI about a user?

Hmmm? I never said that anywhere? I don't think my quote says that either does it? Did I read it wrong?

Originally posted by CHA0S
Before anyone gets all worked up, this will simply be but a retelling of some classic ATS history.

Well, even though I wasn't around when all this took place I can tell you for sure that some people are going to get 'worked-up' ... perhaps that is your intent perhaps not.

Being an ATS history buff myself I have researched all this stuff over the years and I can tell you two things for sure:

1. You are delving in one of the most painful parts of ATS history, where great, in fact best friends came to be at each others throats, mass defections, really sad stuff. Stuff that carried over to the COINTELPRO and SERPO events.

2. There is no way you can encompass the scope of what happened in such a short OP.

If one wants to honestly investigate this one has to track down dozens of related and semi related threads, dozens of outside sites, some of them who have removed the relevant content and most of which were simply lying to aggress ATS.

And even if one does all that, they still will not get a picture complete enough to sway their preconceptions. What I mean is, if you believe the rumors there's not enough out there to change your mind, if you believe ATS same thing, and if you have an open mind, months of research will leave you without enough to be sure either way.

My personal opinion after a great deal of lookingthingsupiness is that WITD was an code exploit as Bill says, the SERPO/Laura stuff was NC, and it is well documented that the COINTEL stuff was a April Fool's joke gone wrong. (That is if I remember all that correctly as I quit looking at it a year ago)

But to those who's interests lie in attacking ATS for whatever their reasons, they like to muddy all those waters to make their point, fully knowing that most folks will not take the time to look at the totality of the available evidence because it simply takes too long.

Either way, what you have done here is resurrect ghosts of considerable pain. Surely you must know that even with the superficial research you have undertaken.

Why would you do that?

[edit on 23 Aug 2010 by schrodingers dog]

reply to post by schrodingers dog

Why supress past events?

I found it really interesting.

(I'd flag it but the flag box has gone?)

[edit on 23-8-2010 by and14263]