Freedom is the Problem

We live in a society that is based on rights. But is there a line that can't be crossed?

Years ago, I would have said "Yes", but year after year, the moral fabric or our society fades away into the shadows. What do we have when morality is non-existent? Anarchy?

My point is that America started as a society to rebel against the fascism in England. Hundreds of years later, we have become so "Free" that we have lost all hope for structure.

To combat this, we turn to legislation. In the panic of the anarchy that "Freedom" has caused, we outlaw those very rights we swore to protect/

The rights that set us apart from fascism.

Look at us now. We have become the very thing we once fled from.

Back to where we started. All that work for nothing.

So... the problem isn't freedom at all!

It's human nature!

IRM

reply to post by baked


You are spot on, and I think the reasons are relatively clear. In my opinion, the "line" has been moved lower and lower. It is caused, in large part, by moral relativism, acceptance of "unacceptable" behavior, political correctness, corruption, lack of accountability, a society of enablers and the list goes on and on.

There is complete lack of conscience in todays society and in my opinion it is in direct proportion to the level of atheism. I don't wish to turn this into a religious debate and will not engage in such, but I would argue if people tried to live as Christ-like as possible, we would not need laws. Whether you believe in Christ or not isn't the issue. The issue is, does the "image" of Christ represent all that is good, and loving and caring and honest? Absolutely, it does! Unfortunately, and sadly, too many in todays society reject Jesus Christ. When you reject Christ, by default you accepting something that is far less "good".

We used to be told to let our conscience be our guide, but now we are taught that guilt is a wasted emotion and we have no reason to feel guilty. If we enjoy something and it feels good, then DO IT, in complete contradiction to our conscience.

It is a sad state of affairs but I don't think anybody can argue that American society has degraded severely over the last several decades.

America didn't start as a reaction to "English Fascism" as you put it, England barely had control over the colonies, and this was in part of the problem, also if America would not be allowed representation then why should they pay taxes? We all know the story...

reply to post by casualtorment



I'm talking about the decision to leave in the first place. Before the pilgrims came here. Not after the colonies were created.

reply to post by baked


Just to point out - The Pilgrims were Quakers and came to the new world not because they were dealing with intolerance but because they felt that the society around them was too tolerant.

*edited to add missed word*

[edit on 8/19/10 by Hefficide]

Originally posted by casualtorment
America didn't start as a reaction to "English Fascism" as you put it, England barely had control over the colonies, and this was in part of the problem, also if America would not be allowed representation then why should they pay taxes? We all know the story...

It was to pay for the wars which we fought to protect the colonies, IIRC.

Anyway, people are the problem, not freedom. Freedom is desirable in some areas (particularly socially, in my opinion) while regulation is necessary in others.

reply to post by baked

We live in a society that is based on rights. But is there a line that can't be crossed?

Years ago, I would have said "Yes", but year after year, the moral fabric or our society fades away into the shadows. What do we have when morality is non-existent? Anarchy?

where does morality come from? From society’s customs? From God’s commandments? From the cold, impersonal commandments of pure reason? Or from human emotions and sentiments?

My point is that America started as a society to rebel against the fascism in England. Hundreds of years later, we have become so "Free" that we have lost all hope for structure.

Well that's problem you are going to get when you let people make up their own mind on what morality is. As bad as religion might be, at least it keeps it's sheep in line on the issue of morality.

To combat this, we turn to legislation. In the panic of the anarchy that "Freedom" has caused, we outlaw those very rights we swore to protect/

The rights that set us apart from fascism.

Look at us now. We have become the very thing we once fled from.

Back to where we started. All that work for nothing.

No we turn to legislation because the definition "moral" is not the same for everybody under a secular thinking society.

If the laws are becoming to much it is merely an indication that society is not "grown up enough" to handle this freedom.

Maybe we actually need a mystical institute to tell us how we should and how we shouldn't live.....

Peace

Humans alone are good but when you put many upon many the greed and evil comes out

Originally posted by 27th Aquarius
Humans alone are good but when you put many upon many the greed and evil comes out

A person's ability to be good is severely diminished when there are no other people to be good to.

When you float the idea that perhaps the problems that we face are caused by allowing people to assosiate with whom they wish, to speak as they wish, to go where they wish and own what they produce....well, it might seem like an innocent query to you, and its exploration of course has merit...just be aware that to me, someone who considers himself a free person...to me you are floating the idea that you, or some group, somehow has *ownership* over me. As if just by being born i should be subject to you, or to those who you nievely entrust with violent power over us all.

What youre innocently floating as a trial ballon is the concept of slavery - that one man can own another. Very dangerous and very offensive to a person such as myself, who knows he cannot own you, or any other man.

Just consider what youre proposing.

I don't think freedom is the issue. Morality comes from the heart.

Our society has degraded because people are cowards and followers, that was all well and good when fear and persecution ruled the day and kept the majority in line so to speak. But as science grew it undermined religious fear. Most operate through fear.I agree that Jesus was the ultimate role model but most do not follow because of his goodness the follow out of fear of hell or a need to believe not LOVE the only thing that should matter.

As the leaders scrambled for more and more control they catered to the lowest common denominator, purposely elevating idiots, charlatans, whores and immoral thieves to GOD status. The sheeple wanting to be like the Joneses and feel connected followed and idolized the scum they put forth as role model's.

Its all part of a planned devolution of the human condition. Those families have been in power long before America was founded and their control grid wont be circumvented without the courage to do what's right and put the excuses away.

This next section is addressed to the sheeple of all types.

If your job hurts people, if your a soldiger being paid to kill, if you serve God for money, if your doing something cause everyone else does and society says its okay YOU ARE A COWARD. You are forwarding the agenda of control by being their facilitator!

I don't care what excuse or justification you use to sleep at night YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE.

If you are not doing something you love in a loving manner and spreading good will you are part of the problem not the solution.