Civility, decorum and the Aliens and UFO Forum

reply to post by OldDragger

99% of the UFO postings are from surfing You Tube or some website! That's not reseach!

What do you suggest? It's a discussion forum and people can only discuss whatever is available to them. Maybe someone should post an affidavit from a President or post a genuine repair manual for a flying saucer?

Your argument seems to prohibit discussion unless people are active researchers. By extension, discussion of sports or politics should be dismissed unless we're politicians or athletes?

The weather's been crap in England this summer, but I'm not a meteorologist so I'll be quiet. Likewise, by your standards, you aren't a UFO researcher either so you have no right to discuss the subject.

ETA: Sorry Nef. My post is against the spirit of your thread, but it needed saying. It's the last thing I'll post in here.


[edit on 16-8-2010 by Kandinsky]

reply to post by neformore


Thanks for this.

If people are getting scorned and ridiculed for posting decent UFO sightings its a wonder we still have them tbh.

What is the point in having a UFO/Alien Forum if all you get is name called and ridiculed. Dont these people realise it could kill the ufo/alien debate on the board. The more ridicule the less threads if you ask me.

Maybe thats the plan for some. Maybe im just paranoid

Well, I think my own proof of visitation thread is a good example of what upsets people. I was called a troll and many other negative things throughout the whole thing.
BUT, there are 1557 replies!!
I think that generated more discussion than all the You Tube hoaxes combined. Furthermore it cuts to the heart of the subject.
MANY posts bemoan "sceptics", and many dislike even allowing same on ATS. They think it's uncivil.
While I'm in favor of civility, I hope that ATS won't become just another namby-pamby rules is rules form.

reply to post by neformore


I'm fairly new here, still a newbie, I still lurk on other forums but this is where I've decided to join. ATS is by far the most professional website on this subject.

Sometimes I will come across a thread that interests me, and being a newbie looking for answers, I'll often pass by without commenting, seeing how the OP or subject is being treated, often times after the second or third reply. And I also understand old members that have seen more than their share on certain views, and express it. But respect is always nice.

Thank you for bringing this up.

the problem with the hoax thing is that

everything about UFO cant be verified by science

so, when you read anything UFO related, you need to assume that the information CAN BE FALSE too

the problem is that a lot of people are angry towards some certain people and try burn the topic

another BIG problem is around most of the users here: everyone thats join the board want to find the truth about aliens

guess what: you wont find it.

the only thing you will find is a bunch of information that cant be verified, so, if you are looking for TRUTH, its impossible to find it

everything here is related to perspectives, not scientific evidences

and even if something is scientific related, it always it not verified by third party sources, and so thats not really science

so, if you like to discuss about possibilities, you are welcomed, otherwise, you will just ruin the experience for yourself and everyone else

I think ATS has suffered in loss of quality due to the real deals that made this forum (UFO/ETs) have left due to poor treatment by some very low brow individuals - who ridicule and simply don't understand there are many things to be understood in this field.

The big 3 are no longer posting - and since that time there has been a huge decrease in *QUALITY* and an increase in.. well... crap!

The same bunch of heroes every time band together and reiterate their disbelief over and over and over - like WE GET IT already .... "you are skeptics and debunkers and believe in nothing that has no physical 'proof'"

I think (apart from this reply) I have ignored ALL of them - and I'll be called closed minded for saying that - and that is fine by me...

But the damage has already been done by the 2 leaving and the 3rd banned (?!) - the investment of ATS has been lost...only to surface on other sites (which can be great BTW).

Overall - the negatives have pretty much won this forum (UFO/ETs) and hopefully the *owners* have a unbiased and encouraging opinion for any new potential zorgon or internos or mike type pedigree - and PROTECT them as they are the INVESTMENT of a greater and more inspirational version of ATS.

Thank the gods. You do listen to us, Thankyou AshleyD for listening to my concerns, thankyou ATS admin for taking action on this issue.

Originally posted by OldDragger


Fair enough.
I would suggest however, a higher standard for posters of alleged UFO material.
While some are well thought out, too many are "hey I saw this on You Tube, what do you guys think". Really, that's asking for it!
Also bombastic thread titles invite sarcasm, yet seem to slide right by mods.
These types seem like blatant attempts at getting stars and flags, and really have no supporting evidence to discuss.
Same with the "I'm an alien " threads, unless the OP presents something in the first few posts, what does ATS expect except scorn and some ridicule.
If you ecpect discussion, then give us something to discuss, not just a UFO cheerleading section!

I agree, far to many Original posts are not held up to the same standard as all the replies that must follow. Like invites like.

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by OldDragger
I'm asking posters to give us something!
People post some blurry pic, then seem to be insulted that everyone doesn't fawn all over them.
Same with the You Tube stuff. If you think it;s real, how about telling us why?

Many reasons for this I would think. Many new members aren't up on what has transpired in the past here. Many don't know what ATS standards are. One thing that boils my britches is when a new member, full of enthusiasm, comes here and posts a topic. Then we have older members going, "Ah jeez, not this again." The new member doesn't know that. Cut THEM some slack.

Secondly and this is not meant to piss you off but why don't you go out in the field and do some research? Bring something to the board as opposed to waiting on it?

I have asked the same thing Intrepid. I have even given suggestions on shooting footage and the like. Instead of shooting people down with the "ATS Standard" but I've yet to see an ATSer actually recite the standard and point to where it is located. If there is a standard then it should have a section where it can be referenced. Oh and the fastest way to find out if you have aptitude? Go do One hour photo work for awhile. After explaining to a customer it was the lens cap and not chemical depletion which resulted in no image, then you can come back at least with a point of reference. I don't suggest people go out shooting UFOs first because that's where the mistakes are made. Also because it could be dangerous. But I do agree that if you have not logged some work time in on getting the perfect pic w/o using the auto focus/speed & app adjustments, then they need to just sit and wait for those who are trying to get it right.

Originally posted by Faiol
the problem is that a lot of people are angry towards some certain people and try burn the topic

With respect, I disagree with these statements.

Certain posters may be (what you describe as) 'angry' with a known hoaxer or a new hoaxer or even someone trying to promote a hoaxer - not the people on this board.
Frustration may set in if members continually support these hoaxers, but for the most part it is directed at external sources.

Originally posted by watchZEITGEISTnow
"you are skeptics and debunkers and believe in nothing that has no physical 'proof'"

I really think if you read and follow ALL posters in this forum you get a feel for what people are like.

I suggest you would be surprised to see actually how open-minded the so-called 'debunkers' are. Just because they question, doesn't mean they don't believe.

Though flippancy and sarcasm don't bother me, you do make a better case with facts, rather than jokes.

Still, I'd rather not see the humor punished, just the superciliousness. I think it's possible to be facetious without being contumelious.


TheAssoc.



[edit on 16-8-2010 by TheAssociate]

reply to post by Faiol

otherwise, you will just ruin the experience for yourself and everyone else

Hmmm, Well.
Maybe,maybe not.

Ironically enough there is an "ignore" button on a forum dedicated to the denial of ignorance.

Yes well unfortunatly for the OP this websites motto is Deny Ignorance, not Embrace Fantasy. I understand that a lot of theorys people post here, are infact just that, and probably someone has useful information pertaining to it that either prove or disprove it, and yes that should be contributed in a civil manner. However even yourself has to admit, a great deal of these "theorys" are basicaly just total nonesense, based with zero grasp of reality, total conjecture and staunch ignorance of any real world facts what so ever. They basicaly deserve to be witch hunted im affraid. ESPECIALY the people who, after seing the cold hard facts laid before them choose to completely ignore reality and continue a thread with ten pages filled with poorly garbled wishful thinking. NO NO NO, that should in no way be tolerated, just my opinion of course, but dont really be surprised if you post something thats utter nonesense its going to be ridiculed with scorn.

And on this note that the moderators have raised can there be some way of addressing the 10 user-limit cap. on the ignore list.
It needs to be more like a 100 user-limit cap.

ATS has a lot more ignorant and abusive users these days and I'm getting very tired of having to juggle the morons who are on my ignore list.

The usually tend to the the ones launching attacks against the thread starters in the aliens forums etc.

Originally posted by watchZEITGEISTnow
I think ATS has suffered in loss of quality due to the real deals that made this forum (UFO/ETs) have left due to poor treatment by some very low brow individuals - who ridicule and simply don't understand there are many things to be understood in this field.

The big 3 are no longer posting - and since that time there has been a huge decrease in *QUALITY* and an increase in.. well... crap!

The crap always was and always will be present here.

The big three, although I think we should add jkrog08 to the list, so the big four did add a lot to this forum but as forums go, people come and go, it's a cycle.

You're forgetting (and probably ignoring) that there are other people here doing some great work for the forums.

You want quality? support these people, don't dwell on what's gone, concentrate on what's ahead.

The same bunch of heroes every time band together and reiterate their disbelief over and over and over - like WE GET IT already .... "you are skeptics and debunkers and believe in nothing that has no physical 'proof'"

Such a close minded response, but I'll cover this later on, suffice to say, I know you have me on ignore (and I fully understand you won't see this) and are of the opinion that I am one of those "skeptics and debunkers and believe in nothing that has no physical 'proof'".

I think (apart from this reply) I have ignored ALL of them - and I'll be called closed minded for saying that - and that is fine by me...

Why is it fine by you?

Why can't you accept that not everyone will agree with you?

You stated earlier that there are many things to be understood in this field, yet you choose to ignore half of it.

This is extremely hypocritical, close minded and ignorant.

And it's this attitude that makes UFOlogy a joke and it's this attitude that pisses people like me off, who actually spend some time and effort (mostly) to help educate and inform others when posting in this forum.

Sometimes it's a pain in the butt having to repeat myself over and over again..."it's not a fireball, it's contrails from a jet illuminated by the sun" but I do it because I want to help educate people so they understand things better, do I sometimes come off as being rude? Yes. I won't deny that, it's probably why I have 18 foes (half of which are banned) and who knows how many people have me on ignore.

But here's the thing, I don't have ANYONE on ignore, I will read and take in everyone's opinion.

More people should try it sometime.

But the damage has already been done by the 2 leaving and the 3rd banned (?!) - the investment of ATS has been lost...only to surface on other sites (which can be great BTW).

Overall - the negatives have pretty much won this forum (UFO/ETs) and hopefully the *owners* have a unbiased and encouraging opinion for any new potential zorgon or internos or mike type pedigree - and PROTECT them as they are the INVESTMENT of a greater and more inspirational version of ATS.

As I said before, you focus way too much on the negative and the past.

Move on, be the change you want to see.

I've probably lost in on some 2 hoaxers and will attempt to stop. Some times something so blatantly obviously a hoax gets to me when the hoaxer tries to put up their proof after its been thoroughly dissected and agreed to be a hoax.

This is the third thread that I have been to regarding civility and baiting the other guy into a sword fight. I have witnessed those who enjoy this conduct and or the challenge. They dance on the razors edge of name calling or straight out belittling the other member- with delight.

They do not break the "site agreement" as they know the boundaries very well. This consumes a minimum of two pages, if not five, of the thread.

It's almost everywhere I look, and this bantering by these two have driven off anyone remotely interested commenting on the OP!

So you take a teen or new member who sees this, and reads this unique show of wills or sword fight- I think you end up with "monkey see, monkey do"

The snowball effect- is what I am inferring.

That is my observation and I am too new here to suggest a remedy, as of yet.

To bad we can't apply a filter to those extremely large threads where nothing of importance is shown. For example, only show posts that have received 5 or more stars.

There are times where I don't want to ignore a member, but wouldn't mind weeding out the garbage.

reply to post by Tribble


The solution is to simply not insult. I have failed this a few times. I'll be more vigilant. I've seen many do it as well.


I think it's the fact that a hoaxer derails a thread and people get pissed off by the hoaxer. That then causes the hoaxer to move to another thread and spread the anger ad those angry follow him. It's very much so a snowball effect.

Two solutions, both of which must be implemented. Those who derail a thread with personal baseless claims and is obviously hoaxing should be post banned for a day or two. And us all, including me, should not insult.