Hidden Hand Message - Law Of One - Discussion!

reply to [url=http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread600391/pg119#pid9735033]post by LeoVirgo

It wasn't you said it was a dumb idea. It was someone else.

Yes, I was trying to prove there claims are all BS. The fact that they couldn't answer an objective question requiring reasoning as opposed to a question requiring just making up claims should have been ample evidence. Even supposing they were right, they were the only ones privileged to speak from heaven and we're all just a bunch of loudmouths who know nothing and should shut up, the fact that they said they could answer all questions but couldn't ask their higher sources for anything requiring more than an elementary knowing of a word or concept should set off alarm bells that they couldn't really know-it-all or come from a place where they know-it-all.

If they did give a correct answer to it I would be pretty surprised. I would have to consider at least one of their claims could potentially be correct. I would still be hesitant to call them light beings, because of their separatist claims, but I would have to admit they were right about being able to answer any questions. I think I could potentially believe they are right because that would be the honest thing to do. It would, at the very least convince me they aren't just humans because they correctly answered something humans haven't answered yet. I could buy their story, sure, because they've shown that they know a thing or two humans don't. To me it would be sufficient evidence that they aren't just humans with messianic delusions. Whether malicious beings or benevolent ones I do not know.

reply to post by polarwarrior


I didn't get crickets from God when I sought if He was real or not. He relieved me of my spiritual anguish and dilemma. I don't pretend to know all His mysteries or that I can love like He does, but I know He's real.

I also don't happen to think the science we know is a lie. I just think we have yet to quantify spirit, but we will get there someday. I believe Schrodinger's Cat was an illustration of the absurdity of applying the Copenhagen Interpretation to Quantum Mechanics. I have yet to formally study it so I have nothing more to say.

reply to post by IAMIAM


Numbers, geometry, science--all these attest to the glory of God just as much as the natural world does.

I am not saying anything. I am just answering people questioning why I would rather consider an answer to an unanswered question in math or science more of a sign that those posters weren't just playing shenanigans.

reply to post by 547000


So can we take this a step forward....with a thought I have been pondering since you have brought up such questions?

You and I both believe Jesus was a real man that walked here. Do you believe he was a divine being....or 'from heaven'? If so....do you think Jesus would of answered your questions for your proof?

Im hoping that we will both be humbled in the idea that its possible he would of not given such answers, for good reasons. But I could be wrong as well.

What do you think about that, if you care to share?

Im hoping to take this all in a different direction that can help us think critically in how things of Spirit works.

LV

reply to post by LeoVirgo


He probably wouldn't. But I wouldn't have to ask Him since He already gave me evidence that He was more than just a man. God does give evidence if you really want to know. It isn't just faith, it can be knowing. You just have to seek.

Originally posted by 547000
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

He probably wouldn't. But I wouldn't have to ask Him since He already gave me evidence that He was more than just a man. God does give evidence if you really want to know.

But in the time of him on Earth....how would you have known? Would it of been the miracles or would it of been his nature in things of Spirit?

What evidence shows you that Jesus was more capable then what you are capable of? Can I ask what you have been shown that offers you this truth?

Please know, Im only conversing....Im not trying to doubt anything of your personal experiences. This is just 2 people sharing what they have discovered and understood. If one being is shown that Jesus was more then what all other men were....but another was taught that all men are to be what Jesus had become....then what? We still just go on the 'alone' path of our own personal understandings....right? For that is the best we can gather here and now.

What if Jesus' resurrection is misinterpreted in the Bible...and what if anyone is capable of ascending to the heavens through living of the nature of Spirit as Jesus did.

Can we really be sure of such things? That he was more then just a man like you and I? And does it harm us, to admit, we do not know?

reply to post by LeoVirgo


I'm sure because I begged God for some evidence to point out to me if He was real, and if so, to point out to me which religion was closest to Him. I wouldn't have been able to believe if I didn't get my evidence. I experienced 1) Invisible stigmata; 2) Filled with light and love. At first I thought I was just hallucinating, then it happened again. Then I thought I was going to hell, but then I was corrected. I don't doubt the crucifixion or the resurrection. As for whether there's more to the story I do not know and cannot add to it, because I have no evidence. It could very well be all people are going to heaven, but it can also be that not everyone is going to heaven. I would like to believe to former, but I cannot say for sure because I have no evidence.

The point is this: God can and will give evidence to those who ask. Those saying you can't get evidence by asking for it are wrong.

I would probably be convinced by the miracles if I were in those times. Especially if He died and came back from the dead.

reply to post by 547000


Thanks for sharing your thoughts and replying

I have to wonder...why there were those that supposedly saw these 'miracles' and still doubted him. So far I have been given no evidence that Jesus did anything we cant do and that he did those miracles that the book speaks of. I have to keep a open mind that man could of stretched the truth and I have went to Thee and admitted I do not know and it took a while for me to be OK with that, being raised in a house where 'if the book says it, then you know it'.

When I pondered on this in my times of seeking....and asked Jesus if he did such things (the miracles, supernatural things)...I was presented with the question of 'why would I do such things'. I was then presented with the question of 'why would some say I did those things'. So I sit on the fence and have had to learn to be ok with that (not knowing).

Again, thanks for sharing

Many things I have asked for evidence...or 'truth'...and have been presented to think about it instead of just being given the answer. Frustrating at times, but humbling just the same.


Wishing your day well, and others,
LV

I think because in those days they believed in evil spirits. Jesus said something about the Pharisees not accepting His works and saying they were of the Devil. It is also said that God eludes the proud. The proud would naturally not ask God Himself for evidence. I was at the lowest moments of my life. I would often cry at what I perceived to be the pointlessness of the universe and the futility of my life. Which is why I initially came to the conclusion that I must have hallucinated it.

I don't really know why God does what He does. But it was humbling to me to realize that a faith I had wrote off as childish and obviously a way of controlling people was actually true.

Which is why, if they could give sufficient evidence that they were more than humans I could possibly contend that they were speaking the truth. They did say they were posting the way they were because they were frustrated at the foolishness of the rest of us. It could possibly be true, I don't know without evidence. I would have to be honest with myself that they did know more as they claimed if they did and would have to seriously consider the fact that I am the fool and they were possibly right. Certainly I would admit I am a fool if they proved me wrong.

reply to post by 547000


Hi again!

I had to come back and share something with you that I ran across just now. It made me think of things we talked of.

I ran across a thread here at ATS and it is channeled material. Granted, I have always said and will stand by, I take nothing 100% and do not really try to say if something is fact or not. But after glancing at this material...I had to ask myself...where does such understanding come from? Is this a persons inner knowing of things that we once had as souls without distortions> Is this a higher self offering information to a being>Is this connection a 'godlike' connection, angelic, divine?

So I had to bring it here...since you spoke of things like math and science being a way to weigh and measure something. There is much acclaimed science in this information and was a enjoyable read actually, for what its worth. So wanted to share it, and get others thoughts on it. Im not looking for 'yes its truth or no its not truth'....just looking for what is peoples first impression while reading it. And...where do you suppose the information comes from? This isnt normal information being offered.

www.galacticfriends.com...

I think miracles can at any time be given to those who ask, but not all can see these as a gift from god or higher power. there is no real turning away of faith once an experience of such a gift has been given or as realized coming from a higher power other than chance in making, but then again there is still no evidence to back any of these as truth, except by faith of such as left behind for those it reaches out to.

Here is a link you all may find of interest.

The Impersonal Life

Pretty much sums up all I have been saying.

Ye are Gods

With love,

Your Brother

Originally posted by IAMIAM
Here is a link you all may find of interest.

The Impersonal Life

Pretty much sums up all I have been saying.

Ye are Gods

With love,

Your Brother

I have seen this mentioned elsewhere and it may have been by you...and there was a mental note somewhere somehow, to read this at some time.

Just glancing at it, cautiously as I do everything....much rings true.

Something that stood out to me though as odd....was the idea that the 3 things to gain was 'love, wisdom, and power'.

How does power...be something to strive for...unless its a humble knowing of what is, is. Im sure this is not talking about 'power' as we think of one having power. Maybe an example of humble power is the knowing that I, have control, of my own thoughts, choices, therefor, that is a power I have that no one can take from me.

This read sparks questions....which is what I like, it makes me think, it makes me weigh things. I will have to take on a more serious read of it at the appropriate time. Thanks for it

Do you know who wrote it?

I like alot of what it said about Jesus...but still cautious, very cautious.

Still, new food for thought....wonderful! Thanks again!
LV

Edit to add...I have so much inner issues with the term 'ye are gods' as in plural. I can find ways to understand the plural of it, but not in perfection, only in the singularity, 'god' can I find the perfection.

Language is pulling my limits.


So far I have found the author as 'anonymous'?

reply to post by LeoVirgo


My first impression was one of incredulity, but I would agree that love is a very important concept when talking about the divine. I don't know whether it was just a bunch of woo using scientific terminology to further the author's agenda or if the author is saying something meaningful because I have yet to formally study modern physics such as relativity or quantum mechanics, so space-time as a concept is one I do not properly understand. Most channeled stuff makes me uncomfortable, so my initial reaction is to take it with a huge grain of salt. Without evidence I find it really hard to believe how this was channeled. Did the author hear a voice that told what to say, or did the author feel inspired to write this after thinking about things the author read? It sounds similar to most spiritualists' conception of earth and it's purpose.

reply to post by 547000


I agree with the huge grain of salt...always. It is interesting to wonder where does this info come from still. I wondering if this is the base of what this persons unconsciousness is capable of understanding...not so much a channel from 'outside' of them....but something very deep within them. They may attribute a name to it that has resonated with them on a personal level. I surely, do not know. I do love reading, others philosophies on life and the Universe though, either way.

I think we all have a knowing of how things work....deep within. Its shedding all the influences of the material world and the outside environment to get to that 'inner knowing' that seems like the hard part sometimes.

I dont see channeled material as something that is coming 'outside' of a person....but instead, somehow, is within them. Some will surely disagree with that....but that is my own take on 'channeling'.

Thanks for sharing and taking a look at it!
LV

reply to post by IAMIAM


In the Infinite Consciousness, which is Infinity and this is the platform for all our imaginations, schools, sequencing, and thought creation, including segements of "time" for the sake of order and progress, we are all the infinite, eteranl, never ending rays of consciousness.

ET_MAN said something in a post that I really liked, because he is sharing what he remembers, has seen, knows, learnt from profound nde and experiences including those beyong this technology universe, beyond the veil, and souls, as they learn to become responsible loving adults, improving their lot as their sense of responsibility, understanding and behavior improves, become bigger and brighter, expanding into larger rays of consciousness. In infinity, souls grow bigger, with each stage and progression reached. We're just a sliver of our Higher Self, in size. Now in Infinity, there are many ways to describe HS. The quantum strangeness of an infinite number of people, who can sit down on an infinite sized table with each other and converse. This is one tangible "reality".

Yet the one where you well up within yourself, bubbling up like an inner spring where more of you, with more memories, you suddenly are aware you know everyone, and even that some are on assignment and some aren't, too caught up in their lives. That is the holistic one, where there is the "holistic global infinite whole of you.

We're all equal. But collectively, our rays of consciousness exist in a global infinity? A global love. If anything is the Highest Creator, this would be the way.

Last night, I was mulling over the many problems my youngest is causing the household. Five boys and the male models have not the best, and their grandfather's nerves are too shot to deal with troubling behavior. But due to thryoid quitting they all have neurological learning disabilities. Each of them with enough love has their wiring stabalize at various preteen/teen ages. My 14 year was just like my youngest. Now he is very enjoyable to be around, though occasionally acts up and talks back. So I poured out these thoughts and woke up, as oft times happens, with a list of ideas, relating to what the occupational therapist said, that we have to find a trampoline, and restring the guitar I got. The trampoline is controversial, and my parents are divided about it due to the accidents, but part of what we're going to try, and lots of fun for them

To find ways, activities to encourage this along with reading fun time. And I went outside, clouds in the sky, the sun was only showing in one spot and I knew it would soon be gone, and more ideas, came, that I've written down, most of all to use humor.

Then the sun, well its not exactly the sun, sent me in, the idea that it was a cloudy day, and not to worry about this, that I would be connected and continue to be inspired came to me, and I thanked Beyond and Family and went in.

We're to pray, meditate, seek, and can bring all our problems before sleep, sungazing, and other spiritual ways, and we are given answers, they come. So while we are the Many In One, or the Infnite Family, we are still children, and we have Loving Parents. The world would change alot if our family relationships and ways of interacting changed, and if we, were seeking constantly. Its the Love channel we have to strive to reach to hear the answers though, though not always. I've had miracles occur even in the darkest pit, but thats the phone line home, the love channel, it means thinking of whats best for another, not wanting to control or dictate to anyone, or be right. We always think we're right, we have to set that aside.

Love & Light!

reply to post by Unity_99


Hi Unity,

Something I have discovered, is children, even grown children....ache for attention.

So often I have thought of getting them the many things that will entertain, keep their energy and joys content, but all in all...if I didnt give attention while they enjoyed, while their energy got spent, the result had limits.

Above all....the want me to watch them have fun, they love to find me watching them laugh when there is something to laugh at....they love having someone catching them smiling, truly, smiling. They love having someone, show awareness to them. (Im sure you know and have discovered all of this, but just sharing for others and reminders for ourselves).

It can become too easy to set them aside with their 'play time' or 'entertainment time' while I shuffle off for folding clothes, washing dishes, ect. Something Im working on double time this year is to make sure I have my chores done, on 'my time' so I dont end up being too busy on 'their time'. I look at it all as the 'offering of self'. If they are reading before bed, I try to make sure I offer them a moment to tell me what they read about. I wish I had the time to read all the books they have to read for school for such things together make great connections and conversations. Observing my youngest this past week playing with his trains (he loves loves loves trains)....he is fine and content to play with them on his own, but when I crawl down to his level on the floor, and start playing with him....his own light burst forth to me, showing gratitude and thanks for me, observing him, sharing with him, in his own little world. These are the precious moments, I try to reach for with them. Ill catch them all playing outside or something and step out to watch them....and there will be moments that they catch me watching, and there is something that fills them up inside when they catch this. Its not a 'needy attention' thing...but a 'thankful attention' thing. Glad to be loved, watched, and wanted.

Which means, if I got a trampoline....I would have to get out there and jump on it Well not all the time, but I would have to make that example, show them to let loose, make the best of it. If I cant show them that...how can I expect them to find it>?

Been doing alot of work in the whole parenting role myself. Will never be perfect at it...but its so important, raising kids.

My oldest son, does not have a male figure that shares his interests. Most males in his life, are into sports. He is not. He is more of the arts and music kid...which seems to create a more soft hearted personality in him since he does not fit that 'athletic mold' of the male figures he sees. This causes my own issues for relations...for I wont let a man into our lives that wants to push children to be something for their gender or for what that person personally finds important. Needing that figure to encourage them on their natural path, their natural interests...is mostly something that seems few and far between in this world today.

My father is an ideal example for my oldest....but he works so much, is hardly ever around him to really be that image for him to learn from and understand.

You mentioned 'kids' and it opened me up a bit...sorry I luvs em sooo.

Parenting has been the biggest trial and blessing, all in one for me. In it, I have been a teacher and student.

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
I'm sorry if you took my conversation with you as me thinking your question was 'dumb'. I was not at all trying to say that, I guess I was passed the idea of those claiming such things to offer any proof, for I didn't believe half of what they said anyways.

That would be me LV - - - except I doubt I used the word 'dumb'.

Many skeptics pull this same "stunt". (if you are superior answer this math equation). They equate Enlightened with Superior.

Even if you do have some kind of connection to "the Source" - - - it does not make you Superior - - - it just makes you connected. And who knows for sure what "Source" one is connected to.

Is anyone here discounting the importance of math? NO.

But demanding proof of a spiritual connection by answer an equation - - - is ridiculous to me.

As I said - - - I don't see it any different then saying "you have to be pitch perfect and sing" to prove you are spiritual. Because - of course - if you are connected to "God" - you will be provided with this ability.

****Question for the OP:

I unfortunately have not read all 120 pages of this thread, nor will I do so, but if my question that I am about to ask has already been addressed, please forgive me.

My question pertains to the term 'soul that is mentioned numerous times in the OP. My question is this: how are you so certain that a human being even has a 'soul?? It seems most logical (and depressing, I admit) that we do not have any such thing as a 'soul, and that when certain physical organ(s) fail within the body, we cease to be anything further. What makes you even certain that we humans even pocess such a thing as a soul??

I assume you have a respectable answer on this question being that without the existence of a human 'soul, your every theory on this topic falls like a house of cards. Please elaborate on how you have determined to a reasonable degree that humans have such a thing as a 'soul. Thank you in advance.

reply to post by LeoVirgo

Love this post.

Its where I am at right now with the almost 3 year old. And we do have a small trampoline. Fortunately his 10 year old sister jumps with him. I throw balls - stuffed animals - etc over the net and play catch with him that way. He thinks it is very funny to throw them back out. We also have a train table and I play trains with him. I wear Lycra shorts and T-shirts with my hair in a ponytail. I have found if I put on any good clothes - I am conscious of them being damaged. I try not to let anything be more important then him when he wants attention - - which as you say can be just watching him play. I get paperback books from the Salvation Army to have nonsense to read while sitting on the porch or grass watching him play. LOL - - he just brought me a Stop Sign to kiss. He likes his Stop Sign. Right now I am sitting on the arm of a corner couch so I can toss the laptop on the other couch if he comes over for a hug or kiss. Or need to get up and dance to Yo Gabba Gabba.