Woah! Did I just see the entire sea floor lift up?!

Originally posted by Free4Ever2
If the camera is moving why does the robotic arm stay where it is!

Why does the sea floor actaully go above the hand of the robotic arm?

They are connected together… all you are seeing is a robotic arm move and then the camera move.

Can't believe this thread, genuinely makes me worry that people can interpret something so obvious as a camera pan as something so ridiculious as the sea floor moving.

[edit on 5-8-2010 by modern]

I'm surprised this thread is still going.

It seems almost like a religion argument, with both sides steadfastly arguing their POV, neither willing to even consider that they are wrong.

There seems to be a lot of passion about this matter. I won't be surprised if I am attacked for simply making this observation.

Originally posted by kai22
reply to post by Chance321

 

Hi there, it was me that said about footage of these 'other ROVs' putting an end to the debate, one way or the other.

I've received some minor criticisms regarding my posts on here, and I have criticised the thread myself, so I wondered if I could pose you a question?

Nothing patronising, just a simple, curious question.

You say the plumes of dust - quite a distance from the camera - point to this activity. In your honest opinion, is there anything else that could've caused them?

I've said before that they could've been caused by underwater currents, fish that are just out of sight, or now with mention of these other ROVs, could one of them possibly have kicked up the plume 'upstream' so to speak?

Thanks for your time,

Kyle

And not to answer patronisingly (kidding, kidding ) Not an expert, but there didn't appear to be anything in the area that would've caused the dust plumes, if it were due to currents, why nothing till just before "the incident" as if what was happening was moving towards the ROV. As for ROV's upstream? (shrug) I'm not gonna say no and stamp my foot, but just going from the arm chair quarterback possition I'm still gonna have to stay with something other then a ROV tilting happened down there. Also one other thing. Your going to have to go along with me for a moment. After the floor dropped and as the dust was settling the ROV seemed to be hit with some turbulance?, did you notice the hose/cable in front of the camera shaking? that's the other part that seems more then just a simple movement caused by the ROV itself.

reply to post by Blazer


Alright, just one more post and I'll be able to upload videos I took of a huge crack in the ocean floor spewing way more oil than the well they were showing us, so here's my post, and soon I'll be making a new thread to guide those here to wherever it is the videos will be going.

Peace

That's what I said as well, basically. The dirt, silt, and detritus don't linger in the liquid medium and slowly disperse, they appear to come crashing back to the sea floor almost as if the camera is quickly being pulled from a down angle orientation upwards.

EDIT to say: this is in response to kai22 who said, "I just had one final look at the vid. Has anyone mentioned how the floor 'rises' slowly then 'falls' two or three times as fast?"

[edit on 5-8-2010 by Threadfall]

Wow. What a disaster a question caused.

Flags mean different things to different people it seems.

Korg, I understand where you're coming from, I believe, and I'm just using you as an example regarding the flag issue you raised. This issue occurs all the time. A well researched, thoughtful, solid, informative, novel thread certainly deserves to be flagged. Flags get noticed and brought to the front page, right? And a thread with the above criteria certainly deserves to be brought to the attention of all.

So how do people notify others to get their attention to discuss an issue that they feel is important, deserves an opinion or are looking for answers or an explanation? They flag it to get attention and have people visit the thread, correct? See the problem? Is one right and the other wrong or are people using the tools supplied to do multiple functions? IMHO we don't have the proper tools to differentiate them.

The one issue here that really bugs me regards the blatant assumption by some that when the sea floor allegedly rises that it means a large portion, or the entire portion, of The Gulf did so. When I first saw the video I absolutely swore I saw the sea floor rising, although I thought I saw a small portion of it rising. Yes, a small portion. I perceived a bubble of sorts that slowly inflated and pushed the seafloor upwards and then deflated at a slightly different rate, taking the sea floor back down with it. I perceived it to rise a few feet and didn't anticipate a tsunami because of the action. I didn't see the type of sudden and abrupt motion and displacement needed to initiate one. Is my perception of the bubble scientifically valid? I don't know. I do however know that ground deformation does occur. Am I a geologist? No. However, I'm interested in the subject and have read about it and seen videos regarding the displacement needed for a tsunami to occur. I feel I'm knowledgeable enough to make an arm chair educated guess. Am I right? I don't know.

I've watched the video several times including in slow motion and frame by frame. I'm still unsure what I saw. And I really don't need to hear anyone tell me outright that I can't think, I have a low IQ, I'm a liar, I'm stupid, I'm mental or any other related remark. However I'm more than receptive to debate specific issues, thoughts or perceptions brought about in a civil way. I believe that's the intended purpose of ATS.

I too would love to see other ROV feeds at the time of this event. I would still like to know if anyone knows anything about the alleged alarm that PropheticSeer discussed as that could potentially lay this to rest too. Another question I have. Because of the beginning of the video we can conclude that the camera can pan independently of the ROV's movement and its arm. This may be common knowledge to some, but not me. I've seen posts saying that the ROV was resting on the sea floor and others that it's not, due to the altimeter reading. Which is it?

Originally posted by kai22
IMHO, I think you have it the wrong way round. If the arm pushing into the seabed was causing the ROV to tilt, wouldn't it cause it to tilt backwards first? This would create the illusion that the floor is sinking first. The ROV couldn't have been floating before the 'ground rising' due to it appearing so stable.

I was thinking the same thing and a picture of the Oceaneering ROV out of the sea shows the arms in the front, and pivoting in the front, which supports our thoughts. I fully agree with the redundant comments made on this thread instead of people adding anything informative, to some extent, but instead continuing to drag this thread to the ground, no pun intended.

To no one specifically, don't tell people what they saw, try to convince them that they may have perceived it incorrectly. Everyone's entitled to their opinion but most people don't want to hear someone elses when they're rude, ignorant, disrespectful or non courteous. Among other things.

Originally posted by Unst0ppable0ne

Watch the video, and look at the top right, you will see the letters "ALT". This is short of ALTITUDE! The sea floor doesn't move, the ROV moves, and the ALTITUDE of the ROV CHANGES!

This can easily go many directions.

The ALT would change in BOTH INSTANCES - Of just the ROV moving AND if the sea floor rose.

How does the ROV determine ALT? Sonar? Well how does the sonar know the difference between a rising sea floor and just the ROV moving? It doesn't. It simply reads them both as ALT change.

Therefore, the ALT would change in EITHER SCENARIO.

And could people please stop ridiculing and bullying others into being ashamed or afraid to speak their views? It's extremely sickening.

reply to post by Three_moons


Bravo to you.

I couldn't have said it better myself. If you check out my earlier posts I tried to. I am glad to see that someone else feels the same way as I do about some of the demeaning comments that have been made lately.

Firstly, I'm glad this thread is back on track on actually serving it's purpose of being a place for debate as opposed to petty 'I'm right, you're stupid' posts. I'm actually starting to enjoy this thread now

For the past hour I've been trying (very hard) to find another source of the same footage, however the video featured in the link at the start of this thread is basically the only one, give or take a few of those annoying sponsors/plugs or whatever they're called.

I've written an e-mail to 'PropheticSeer' through youtube asking where he got the video from, though I doubt I'll get a good response. More likely I'll be accused of being a disinfo agent or someone trying to 'dispose of all the evidence', yada yada...

In response to Chance321's question regarding turbulance, yes I can see what you mean. I originally thought it was because of the ROV's thrusters, but after watching the video a few times I'm starting to have doubts. The coordinates in the top left corner barely move at all, same with the compass at the top of the screen. Strange...

So far I've been unable to find ANY info on the video whatsoever, not the location, the exact type of ROV used, or wether anything else was in the area or not.

I'll try to update as soon as something turns up, but until I guess it's just gonna have to be speculation and educated guesses

It is clear some people have misinterpreted what others are trying to explain. So I have taken some time to create a few images to explain what I believe is happening. I am not gauranteeing this is 100% proof, as that is impossible unless further evidence comes to light.

I am putting this forward as a likely explanation for the observed phenomena, explaining the logic behind why I believe this to be so. I will also try to explain some of the common misconceptions arising in this thread.

To start off, I think everyone should click on this link here. This is showing the Millenium Plus ROV in action. You can see how nimble it is in the water, as it uses multiple thrusters to provide adequate force to control the ROV's movement. For specifications, find the link in my earlier post (click "thread" at the bottom of this post to find my previous posts.)


To start off, I believe the ROV is not resting on the sea floor. If it was, you would see no movement of the sea floor whatsoever, as the ROV would be connected to it, like my previous elevator analogy.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f0241cd69a3d.jpg[/atsimg]
You can see at 1:03 the arm of the ROV is moving on it's own power. Note that this is not the camera panning. The camera remains fixed stationary to the front of the ROV, as you can see by the arm on the right.

At 1:11, you can see the arm on the left touch the seafloor, sending up a small 'puff' of silt, which wafts in front of the camera slightly.

After a period of some 'enthusiastic' commentary telling you what you are about to see, it appears the sea floor rises in the field of vision. This occurs at 1:30, and is what some people are calling a "bulge" in the sea floor. However, I believe it could be explained as a mere tilting of the ROV...

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/070fb6482f77.jpg[/atsimg]
This movement may have been done intentionally to 'push' the arm further into the ground, by creating a torque with the thrusters. But as there is no information regarding the reasons for doing this, it is merely an assumption, so I won't try to claim exactly why this happened.

As the angle of the ROV (and consequently, the camera) changes, you can even see a couple of specs of silt in the light drifting with the currents. These appear to drift up at the same time as the sea floor does, indicating the entire field of vision is changing. This movement causes a bit more disturbance to the silt on the sea floor, causing more billowing clouds to enter the field of vision.

It holds this position for approx 15 seconds, until at 1:45, the thrusters are applied, causing the ROV to level out at a faster speed than when it tilted down.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/3d5fc93375a7.jpg[/atsimg]

This causes the illusion of the sea floor dropping quickly. It also causes a large amount of disturbance to the silt, causing darker billowing clouds to enter the field of vision. The ROV then makes a slight rotation to the right, then rotates even further to the left, bring into view a cable/pipe of some kind. This can be seen by watching the artificial compass at the top, showing the ROV changing it's orientation.

As the ROV is changing it's attitude, as opposed to it's depth, there will be no clear change in the depth and alt readings, other than minor fluctuations.

I hope this is an adequate explanation for those who are willing to accept that this might not be a dramatic event after all. Sadly, I think there are those who will dismiss this altogether, as it doesn't agree with the 'conspiracy' speculation rampant in this thread. This is ATS, after all

I don't believe BP are a trustworthy corporation, but that doesn't mean I will blindly accept the word of anyone who claims there is some kind of major event taking place. If you continue to believe the theory that this is some kind of undocumented supernatural event, please at least try to explain why you have come to conclude this. Preferably without having to bring out the "disinfo" taunts to those who disagree with you.

I have made an effort to show you my point of view without being derogatory or insulting, and I encourage you to do the same if you share a different point of view. That is all.

It is alarming to read how so many people can interpret a simple camera tilt as a "disaster".

More disturbing it is to read most of those who are "not sure" of what happened rely on other sources and points of view rather than their own common sense.

Can't believe this thread grew this much. It got debunked pretty quick, yet so many people still thought that THE ENTIRE SEA FLOOR (of which you can only see 0.0000000000000000000001% of the entire surface through the ROV) collapsed.

This is scary.

Another video of possible methane bubble.



[edit on 7-8-2010 by boomadatigger]

reply to post by boomadatigger


another thread opened up with on the subject of a new video narrated by the same guy:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

please note:
The narrator is selling seeds and stuff for a post-apocalyptic society, and uses the video as an oportunity to promote what he is selling and what you need to survive when the world ends.

Just to update you all...

I received an reply for PropheticSeer regarding the original video on this thread. He sais he got the video from 'BeePeeOilDisaster', another user on YouTube. After looking at some of his videos, I have to question wether or not this guy is actually sane.

Most of the videos seem to be about bugs in the gulf. To show you what I mean, here are just a few of the titles -

Strange superbug in The Gulf Of Mexico
Superbugs attacking wells and equipment in gulf of mexico
Creature crawling across sea floor (THIS is a conspiracy??!!)
Strange gulf superbugs fly out of ROV's metal arm
Superbugs in the gulf transform steel into reptile head!! (parts 1 - 11)

There could well be something(s) going on in the gulf, but this guy seems to be taking the piss abit. Of the videos I've watched, most seem to have a brief overview but no detailed descriptions.

I have to point out at this point that I had to watch the videos WITHOUT sound thanks to the missus so apologies if the audio is any more detailed.

Kyle

reply to post by kai22

Now I find that very interesting. I had a few reasons to suspect that BeePeeOilDisaster was also the OP of Mysterious BP bugs swim through solid steel. I asked him if the videos were his to which I never received a reply, in addition to numerous other questions, although he did acknowledge he saw my questions. If they are one and the same, then there's also mention of these in the above mentioned thread:

Mysterious BP bugs swim through solid steel
UFO activity at site of BP Deep Water Horizon
BP site of new blood pentagram invoked April 20th, 2010 with 11 sacrificial deaths offered to open ritual
BP site of a underwater Pyramid complex or Star Gate
Underwater Battle for Earth Rages Beneath BP Oil Spill
as well as other, shall we say, interesting observations.

Edited to add following:

reply to post by tsurfer2000h

Thanks. I'd been following all along and certainly saw your posts along the way. I think your posts actually gave me some motivation in writing mine.

reply to post by Curious and Concerned

Thanks for taking the time to put that information together, although I have some comments after reading it and watching the video yet again.

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
To start off, I believe the ROV is not resting on the sea floor. If it was, you would see no movement of the sea floor whatsoever, as the ROV would be connected to it, like my previous elevator analogy. You can see at 1:03 the arm of the ROV is moving on it's own power. Note that this is not the camera panning. The camera remains fixed stationary to the front of the ROV, as you can see by the arm on the right.

I don't think that proves or denies if the ROV is resting on the sea floor because around 0:16 we can see that the camera has the ability to move independently of the ROV and its arm.

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
This movement may have been done intentionally to 'push' the arm further into the ground, by creating a torque with the thrusters.

At 0:21 you can see the ROV's claw opening and closing and at 1:13 you can see the ROV move and bounce a little in response to the arm hitting the sea floor, implying that it's hard and difficult to penetrate. It reminds me of taking a sledge hammer to concrete and getting a similar effect. Around 1:30, which I initially interpreted as the arm going through the floor, now suggests to me that it's debris moving around the arm and simply giving it that appearance. We know there's a claw on the arm, not a drill or some kind of device that will easily allow it to penetrate the sea floor that appears hard, not soft, as mentioned above. So I tend to think that the arm never penetrated the sea floor at all because of the action I saw at 1:13.

So I guess I'm seeing the independent camera movement and the thrusters stirring up debris although something about the movement of the camera is still questionable to me. It looks fluid and very different from the movement in the beginning besides simply the rate of tilting.

[edit on 8/7/2010 by Three_moons]

Looks like a Methane gas release.

or some sort of pressure release.

Originally posted by boomadatigger
Another video of possible methane bubble.

[edit on 7-8-2010 by boomadatigger]

Originally posted by boomadatigger
Another video of possible methane bubble.

[edit on 7-8-2010 by boomadatigger]

The first 45 seconds of his "amazingfantasticearthshattering" exaggeration makes me suspect the video creator is being entirely facetious. I think its a troll.

[edit on 7-8-2010 by Saytan75]

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
It is clear some people have misinterpreted what others are trying to explain. So I have taken some time to create a few images to explain what I believe is happening.

I'm afraid you may have wasted your time. There are some here that obviously live inside some kind of fantasy world.

The voice of reason to these people is as alien as trying to understand the language of the trees.

I have seriously had to reevaluate my admiration for the members of ATS thanks to this very thread.

All the best,

Korg.

Originally posted by Three_moons

Originally posted by Curious and Concerned
To start off, I believe the ROV is not resting on the sea floor. If it was, you would see no movement of the sea floor whatsoever, as the ROV would be connected to it, like my previous elevator analogy. You can see at 1:03 the arm of the ROV is moving on it's own power. Note that this is not the camera panning. The camera remains fixed stationary to the front of the ROV, as you can see by the arm on the right.

I don't think that proves or denies if the ROV is resting on the sea floor because around 0:16 we can see that the camera has the ability to move independently of the ROV and its arm.

Really?
If there is one thing I am absolutely sure of, it is that the ROV is NOT resting on the sea floor. Did you understand my elevator analogy? I don't know how I can explain it any clearer than that. If the ROV was on the sea floor, you would not have seen any movement. It's as simple as that.

I think the ability of the ROV to remain stationary may be fooling people into thinking it's resting on the sea floor. But if you clicked on the link I provided, you can see how stable, and how nimble the ROV is underwater. It can maintain a stationary position quite easily without resting on the sea floor.

Originally posted by Three_moons
So I guess I'm seeing the independent camera movement and the thrusters stirring up debris although something about the movement of the camera is still questionable to me. It looks fluid and very different from the movement in the beginning besides simply the rate of tilting.

The movement of the "sea floor rising" is clearly different to the panning of the camera at the start. Are you saying you believe that the camera is panning when the thrusters are stirring up debris? You can clearly see this is not the case as the arm on the right remains stationary in the field of vision.
I do agree that the movement looks "fluid", just like a manuverable ROV in a fluid, to be more precise.
Everything about this video is questionable, but to me it looks just like a tilting of the ROV would. I am yet to see any reason to believe it is anything other than this