Global warming 'undeniable,' report says

Originally posted by GeechQuestInfo
If the sun isn't the greatest factor in global warming then in theory could we get rid of the sun and heat our planet with all of our carbon emissions?

Obviously not, the sun drives the climate. We all should have learned that in grade school.

If we did not have an atmosphere we would be freezing - the sun provides heat yes - however the heat is retained by our atmosphere - like insulation - CO2 build up increases that retention - like more insulation - hence global warming.

I would have thought you would have learnt that as a two year old.

Interesting....

We go from "THERE IS NO GLOBAL WARMING!" to "THE GOVERNMENT IS TRYING TO KILL US!"


Talk about fear mongering.

More like an obvious ploy to keep the status quo.

Besides, we already have band-aids in place. (So-called "Chemtrails" to dim the Sun so we can merrily keep rolling along)

Typical liberal tripe! Even when the data was found to be bogus and the books cooked, even when it was discovered that the monitoring stations were put in urban centers that tend to be warmer due to heat retention, even when it was discovered that the scientists colluded to supress data that contradicted their religion - they pressed on - and continue to do so. Apparently they are taking a page out of the old "Repeat a lie enough times and people will believe it" playbook.

Sorry kooks, not this time!

I agree we should be moving away from fossil fuels regardless of the debate over GW. That said, the carbon tax is an illussion of a fix. The energy revolution is stalled because renewable energy isn't profitable. Energy abundance? bio-plastics? hemp? These are the future that, if the market is honest, are not inherently scarce.

And on the flip side, who's to say we have any right to sustain such a standard of living when 3/4 of the planet can't. The energy revolution threatens to make things more egalitarian and with it, its own host of new problems.

In my view, I think this time in history,depending on what we do in the next century or two, will be remembered as a model of civilization outliving its potential. The gifts of the industrial/communication/technological revolution from the 19th and 20th centuries are presenting a future unlike anything we have had.

The carbon tax as a solution just tells me we have a long way to go.

Cheers

Originally posted by kozmo
Typical liberal tripe! Even when the data was found to be bogus and the books cooked, even when it was discovered that the monitoring stations were put in urban centers that tend to be warmer due to heat retention, even when it was discovered that the scientists colluded to supress data that contradicted their religion - they pressed on - and continue to do so. Apparently they are taking a page out of the old "Repeat a lie enough times and people will believe it" playbook.

Sorry kooks, not this time!

None of your post is true. None of it.

Hence your conclusions are also erroneous.

Nothing was cooked, nothing. The monitoring stations were not "put" in built up areas - the science and data comes from thousands and thousands of different means, from different studies with different samples - but your not interested because you WANT this to be a lie because you simply can not take on board the reality of this.

Originally posted by AwakeinNM
This is obviously damage control. More cooked data to support the politicalization of the weather.

I'll say it again: The politicalization of the weather.

Why would a certain group want to make it seem like something is broken and needs fixing? Because they have the solution! And guess what? You get to pay for it - and they profit.

Can no one see that?


By the way, the weather isn't broken.

NO the weather is not broken - but then again - absolutely no who understands these issues is saying that.

Has anyone ever noticed that people use straw men and distractions when they are clearly wrong.

I wish more people could think beyond the profit side of climate change. Theres always people with agendas.

Climate change will affect so many different things. Entire nations will dissapear under the ocean over the next few hundred years. There are issues for food security, water security, human health (eg changing ranges of disease and disease vectors such as Malaria and the mosquito), climate refugees potentially leading to large scale wars, resource conflicts, depleted fisheries, collapse of ecosystems (which is already happening), changes in rainfall disribution leading to flooding, the list goes on....

It would do people well to consider the facts before dismissing CC as political propoganda. With these kinds of consequences, do you really want to take that chance?

All of the IPCC material is quite conservative, however many of the expected outcomes have a confidence level of 90%. With the amount of factors included in the models used, I would say that a confidence of 90% is pretty damn good and worth monitoring. The difference in between the third and fourth assessment reports is also quite large, and extra data has been collated.

Know this: the IPCC does not conduct new science. It draws from the available literature.

I would make a thread, but I'm really not sure if its worth trying to show people that are covering their eyes.

I am amazed at how many people (especially ATS) are so recalcitrant to accept any evidence of man made global warming due to their ideology. I have been following the science and weather patterns for years and though I used to be convinced by the anti climate change nay sayers, when I became determined to be unbiased and look at the science and patterns for myself, I became convinced that man made global warming is a reality - and one that if we don't address it because of this silly anti-warming ideologue bunch, we will live to regret it.

Good gods, you people are unbelievable. Still arguing over this?

Ok, look.

CO2 is a gas which absorbs longwave radiation. There is an abundance of CO2 in our atmosphere, and a much larger abundance of carbon trapped in numerous forms all throughout our planet. When the planet is bombarded by radiation from the sun, it is warmed and releases it's own heat in the form of longwave radiation, which is then absorbed by CO2 in the atmosphere, and then re-radiated out from the CO2. Since the CO2 would radiate in all directions, naturally some of the expulsion goes downwards, where it rewarms the Earth HENCE the Greenhouse Effect.

Carbon in all forms goes through cycles, whether being in use in living creatures, minerals, gases, and many other forms. Point being that there is a NATURAL cycle. When the cycles are disrupted, changes occur. Like when humans disrupt the medium-term carbon cycle by pumping oil out of the ground and mining coal and burning them to power machinery and create heat. This releases huge amounts of carbon, due to the vastness of the scale at which we are disrupting the cycle, and causes REAL, observable changes in global characteristics, such as the ones described in the OP article.

And don't forget that positive feedback, once you get the ball rollin' it just won't stop!

NEXUS

Originally posted by GeechQuestInfo
Well, technically it's not on this planet, but it's the sun.

Where's the correlation?

Understand that the warning of Global Warming is not a new warning, it has been around since the 1800's. Al Gore didn't invent the term.

Global warming is a warming of the average suface temps on earth, and they have been steadily increasing since 1979 without a break.

Ice cores show that it has been 650,000 yrs since the levels of methane, ozone, and carbon dioxide have been at this level, co2 values of today haven't been seen since 20 million years ago.


Global dimming has counter acted global warming by reducing the amount of iradiance at earth's surface since the 1960's, the main cause of this is pollution and aerosols, then those proponants do their own damages.


There is much science involved to arrive at the decision that global warming is taking place, to ignore the facts is ignorance.

Just because of 'green taxes' and hearing 'carbon footprint' and Al Gore being involved, doesn't mean it isn't happening. I have no doubt myself that it is, I was in the 3rd grade when I first learned about it, what is scary is that they never thought it would happen this fast, 100 yrs or more is what we were taught, but enviromental changes, our use of fossil fuels and other things toxic to our atmosphere is rushing the process.

Global Warming is real. Unfortunately.

reply to post by C0bzz


Well you see how the peaks of solar activity are the peaks of temperature?

And do you see here how the sunspots are getting worse?

www.windows2universe.org...

It's basically like this. If you shoot a Fibonacci sequence of bullets a piece of armor, as you go upward, the armor gets weaker. Eventually The armor breaks. That's like the sun and our atmosphere.

Well you see how the peaks of solar activity are the peaks of temperature?

You sure about that?



It looks like it might have some effect. Remember that Mount Pinatubo blew up in 1991 which lowered temperatures slightly.

I predict when we reach solar maximum again (2012) the temperatures will go marginally up and combined with global warming via CO2, it will be without a doubt the hottest year we've had. I also predict that a couple of years after solar maximum (similar to oh, say, 1984) you guys will be screaming global cooling even though the previous solar minimum was cooler, and the next solar minimum will likely be far higher, even if solar forcing @ minimums stays constant.

[edit on 30/7/2010 by C0bzz]

reply to post by metamagic


Source:

Meanwhile, opponents of agreements and policies to reduce carbon emissions, including a handful of scientists, have argued there could be a natural cause for global warming, such as variations in solar energy hitting the Earth.

Among them is Ian Clark, a geography professor at the University of Ottawa who researches Arctic permafrost. He thinks the reason the climate report doesn't deal much with the cause of global warming is because "nobody really knows the cause." Read more: www.cbc.ca...

Good thinking!

Many sources of global warming exist, why jump to conclusions?

Precautionary Principle.

Back to school I guess
Energy in = Energy out
....
....

Global Warming. Blech. Same old story. Fear-mongering to gain power and tax the poor. Yeah, yeah, the world is going to end because of us humans and our lifestyle, right?

Bull. No matter how much the GW-zombies want it to be true, the world, and humanity, will not go extinct because of a change in temperature. We've been there, done that, more than once before, in history, which you would know if you'd bothered to check.

So, excuse me if I don't cower in fear for the Climate Apocalypse to come.

You want someone to blame in your Global Warming cult? Blame the corporations and politicians. Not us regulars. End of story.

Besides, Mother Nature isn't as wimpy as you people claim she is.

Check out these previous ATS threads. There is no consensus about climate change IMO. There are probably as much scientists anti global warming as there are pro. And there have been numerous errors and scandals exposed about 6 months ago. This list is not complete. I know that there are members who have listed all the scandals and errors of late 2009/ early 2010 here on ATS.. Can't find them though.



UN Blowback: More Than 650 Scientists Dissent Over Man-Made Global Warming Claims


World misled over Himalayan glacier meltdown

Its Conclusive: CRU Climate Data Manipulation At Its Worst!

More Climate Fraud Uncovered

IPCC Says Climate Prediction Impossible

There has been no global warming since 1995

The Latest IPCC Scandal - AMAZONGATE!

Hmmm,. another yes it is, no it not debate..
So, you no its notters
explain, if you will, the melting ice caps
the warming oceans
the receding glaciers.
the torrential rains.

And please present it in a scientific manor.

reply to post by Aristophrenia


I'm so sorry that you haven't been paying attention and continue to embrace ignorance!

Ya know, I was going to paste a bunch of links here but you do your own homework! Either that, or put your head back in your posterior and continue to believe the lie. It is almost a full year since this was exposed!