Will we survive without a Leader/Guide?

Hi there,

This thread is aimed at tackling the distance between those of us that seek a leader to help us through the coming changes and those of us who oppose any form of leader and believe that we each hold the power to change the world around us.

The main reason for this thread is to bring to light the possibility of a Messiah, someone who not only is able to see the hidden world for what it is but is also able to communicate this flawlessly to the rest of humanity.

In the same way a psychiatric patient would need a psychiatrist or psychologist to help them through trauma my personal stance is that humanity needs its own counsellor.

There are those of you that would argue against this and put forward that each person has the ability to change their own situations and make their world better.
That we don’t need help, that we are strong and independent and don’t need saving.

I wanted to hear your feedback on where you stand on this and hopefully open up a dialogue and see where it leads us and whether or not the majority secretly hope for a saviour or messiah or feel that the state of the world and the chaos within it can be overcome without a leader or guide.

So who's going to step up first and break the ice?

Peace and blessings.

Explanation: S&F!

Personal Disclosure: Its both IMO! Regardless of whether I lead myself or I look to/for leadership/rolemodels outside myself... The leader [who ever they may be] still remains. For some, the leaders that are outside of them will always be TPTB, whilst for others like myself, TPTB is within us!

Originally posted by OmegaLogos

Explanation: S&F!

Personal Disclosure: Its both IMO!

Regardless of whether I lead myself or I look to/for leadership/rolemodels outside myself... The leader [who ever they may be] still remains. For some, the leaders that are outside of them will always be TPTB, whilst for others like myself, TPTB is within us!

Thank you for starting the discussion and putting forward a balanced point of view.

On an individual level for someone who sees the world in the way you do, perhaps you may or may not need saving or maybe you feel you have already saved yourself and lead a peacful and happy life.

From an individual perspective this is fine but from the perspective of humanity where there are countless billions who have not got the slightest clue what we are talking about here, would they survive without a Leader or Guide? Who will break the news to them, that they are living inside a system that blinds them and brainwashes them and conditions them and keeps them distracted. Who will be able to talk the masses through the machine/matrix and into the light of truth?

Would each one teach one eventually lead to humanity as a whole waking up or would we need a figure head to address humanity and show them all of the above?

What do you think?

Thanks,
Peace and Blessings.

We need a leader movement! A mass of people all well (self)educated enough to use their own ingenuity in reaching the same overall goal(s).

Patton said tell men what they need to do, but not how to do it. We don't need micromanagers, we all just need to realize what the goals are and we'll all lead ourselves to the collective finish line.

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
We need a leader movement! A mass of people all well (self)educated enough to use their own ingenuity in reaching the same overall goal(s).

Patton said tell men what they need to do, but not how to do it. We don't need micromanagers, we all just need to realize what the goals are and we'll all lead ourselves to the collective finish line.

Indeed and thank you.

I would agree. Forcing a belief on humanity will only turn humanity against you.

One question would be what will it take for humanity to trust one individual with the worlds fate?

Many trusted Obama, some still do but I wouldnt say, looking at him now, that he will save us.

Another question would be, what are the goals?

Please let me know your take.

Peace and blessings.

reply to post by Spirit777


We all have our own beliefs,morals and goals.
But as we do not all share these, we need leadership to decide.

Whether this is a person, party or computer program is irelevant..

Problem is, you will never please everyone, majority must rule....
There the problem lies...
Sometimes the Minority makes the most noise...

Originally posted by virgom129
reply to post by Spirit777

 

We all have our own beliefs,morals and goals.
But as we do not all share these, we need leadership to decide.

Whether this is a person, party or computer program is irelevant..

Problem is, you will never please everyone, majority must rule....
There the problem lies...
Sometimes the Minority makes the most noise...

Thanks.

That indeed is a problem. To each problem there is a solution.
The question is how would you get the majority to share the same outlook?

For example the recent iceland volcanic erruption of the swine flu epidemic. Both were real in the sense that the news of each got to most people in the world. The volcanic erruption stopped flights and the majority of people came together to protests against this. The swine flu vaccine, many people came together and rejected this. Maybe poor examples but im sure you get the point. Do we need a catalyst of some kind to get the people thinking in the same direction and if so what would the catalyst be? Would a messiah suffice? Perhaps an outside threat to the whole of humanity?

Peace and blessings.

reply to post by Spirit777


Well my take is rather unique, but it's in my sig.

First, no one human should be trusted. These days half the people can't even trust their own family, so to trust some demigod is insanity.

Ideas are what should be added, checked, verified, and agreed upon. From there we can figure it all out as we go.

Goals depend on the 'fight'. First you must define the threat. Without knowing the disease you can't much find a cure. That's what I try to do in my efforts, and adopt (often hybrid) solutions that might work. When you know the threat/objective, then the goal is finding solutions that most everyone can agree upon. That's the biggest catch. I do my best in my efforts, but no single person can possibly sort it all out alone, otherwise you end up with leader seeking followers, which itself is a threat to be fought.

[edit on 28-7-2010 by IgnoranceIsntBlisss]

reply to post by Spirit777

Explanation: St*r for you!

Personal Disclosure: From my global POV... they are currently alive and that suits me fine! The reason for that is because, to rudely wake them up would be EXACTLY THAT... Rude!!!

BUT... when I act locally... I don't suffer fools easily!

And when I feel internally and pray to my Goddess... I ask her to bless me by advancing their foolish souls quickly into her divine care OR to curse me with being their mentor for as long as it takes for me to deny their ignorance!

reply to post by Spirit777


Like I said, it's usually the minority that is the most vocal and active...

Until you can get the majority to stand up and care what happens we have no hope..

Most are too busy with American Idol and the Footy...

Originally posted by IgnoranceIsntBlisss
reply to post by Spirit777

 

reply to post by Spirit777

 

Well my take is rather unique, but it's in my sig.

First, no one human should be trusted. These days half the people can't even trust their own family, so to trust some demigod is insanity.

Ideas are what should be added, checked, verified, and agreed upon. From there we can figure it all out as we go.

Goals depend on the 'fight'. First you must define the threat. Without knowing the disease you can't much find a cure. That's what I try to do in my efforts, and adopt (often hybrid) solutions that might work. When you know the threat, then the goal is finding solutions that most everyone can agree upon. That's the biggest catch. I do my best in my efforts, but no single person can possibly sort it all out alone, otherwise you end up with leader seeking followers, which itself is a threat to be fought.

Many thanks and i completely agree.

What would it take for humanity to collectivly define the threat?

Indivdually it is hard to find a cure to the cancer which plaugues humanity but coleectively we can self heal.
The question here is what is preventing the majority from realising there is a cancer/threat and could one leader/messiah reveal this to the world?

Can we really heal humanity without the guidence of a demigod?

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
reply to post by Spirit777

 

Explanation: St*r for you!

Personal Disclosure: From my global POV... they are currently alive and that suits me fine!

The reason for that is because, to rudely wake them up would be EXACTLY THAT... Rude!!!

BUT... when I act locally... I don't suffer fools easily!

And when I feel internally and pray to my Goddess... I ask her to bless me by advancing their foolish souls quickly into her divine care OR to curse me with being their mentor for as long as it takes for me to deny their ignorance!

Lol.

What if the leader or guide was able to pleasently arouse (not sexually mind) people out of their sleeps?

Personally i think a spiritual leader would be sensetive to those who sleep.

[edit on 28-7-2010 by Spirit777]

Originally posted by virgom129
reply to post by Spirit777

 

Like I said, it's usually the minority that is the most vocal and active...

Until you can get the majority to stand up and care what happens we have no hope..

Most are too busy with American Idol and the Footy...

Perhaps that is what TPTB are geering us up toward, somthing so monumental and grand the minority become the majority.

For example and alien race makes itself known to humanity....that would unify all of humanity through the same experience.

Once the worlds attention is focused on something this grand would it not be easier to address them and wake them up?

Maybe aliens wasnt a good example but hopefully you get my point.

Peace and blessings.

reply to post by Spirit777


Spirit, some of the replies I find hard to follow. What I will say is if you do not trust others then follow yourself. Leaders will be few and far between that you will trust from your statements so you should look at leading yourself for now. In my humble opinion leaders are not someone you can pop online and find.

reply to post by Spirit777


Isn't that what Project Blue Beam was about?

A false alien intervention???

That would just be TPTB tricking the majority into believing in a messiah..

Back to square one......

Originally posted by Birddog26
reply to post by Spirit777

 

Spirit, some of the replies I find hard to follow. What I will say is if you do not trust others then follow yourself. Leaders will be few and far between that you will trust from your statements so you should look at leading yourself for now. In my humble opinion leaders are not someone you can pop online and find.

I understand and am sorry if my replies are not coherent enough.
What perplexes me is not the fact that I am at peace and am happy within myself as best i can be given my personal situations but that i cannot ignorantly live my life knowing that billions of my brothers and sisters are still sleeping and are unknowingly being subjected to forces of control they are completely oblivious to.

I would feel selfish if i only considered myself in all of this but that is just me. I would much rather we were in it collectivly than individually.

Originally posted by virgom129
reply to post by Spirit777

 

Isn't that what Project Blue Beam was about?

A false alien intervention???

That would just be TPTB tricking the majority into believing in a messiah..

Back to square one......

Perhaps or perhaps there is more to it than a simple explanation.

What if TPTB were aware of a messiah but that this messiah was sitting on the fence to avoid corruption from TPTB and the People and Aliens.

What if there was a three way battle to see which way the messiah would turn.

Just adding some additional factors for consideration.

reply to post by Spirit777

Explantion: Seriously another St*r for you!

Ah yes ...to coax them gently awake! Hmmm? I like the sounds of that alot! Let me brew on that for a bit OK!

Personal Disclosure: As for the messiah that I believe you speak of...

He said it best...

Luke 4:23 & 24[blueletterbible.org]

Luk 4:23 And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself: whatsoever we have heard done in Capernaum, do also here in thy country.
Luk 4:24 And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.

Phrases Meanings: Physician, heal thyself. [phrases.org.uk]

Meaning:
Attend to one's own faults, in preference to pointing out the faults of others.

The phrase alludes to the readiness and ability of physicians to heal sickness in others while sometimes not being able or willing to heal themselves. This suggests something of 'the cobbler always wears the worst shoes', i.e. cobblers are too poor and busy to attend to their own footwear. It also suggests that physicians, while often being able to help the sick, cannot always do so and, when sick themselves, are no better placed than anyone else.

reply to post by Spirit777


Are you serious???

If there was a REAL MESSIAH do you think with all the powers we read in the Bible, they would care what TPTB think or have planned???

A real Messiah could just turn all the sinners into salt...

We could live in peace...

When that happens, I'll believe...

Originally posted by OmegaLogos
reply to post by Spirit777

 

Explantion: Seriously another St*r for you!

Ah yes ...to coax them gently awake! Hmmm? I like the sounds of that alot! Let me brew on that for a bit OK!

Personal Disclosure: As for the messiah that I believe you speak of...

He said it best...

Luke 4:23 & 24[blueletterbible.org]

Luk 4:23 And he said unto them, Ye will surely say unto me this proverb, Physician, heal thyself: whatsoever we have heard done in Capernaum, do also here in thy country.
Luk 4:24 And he said, Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.

Phrases Meanings: Physician, heal thyself. [phrases.org.uk]

Meaning:
Attend to one's own faults, in preference to pointing out the faults of others.

The phrase alludes to the readiness and ability of physicians to heal sickness in others while sometimes not being able or willing to heal themselves. This suggests something of 'the cobbler always wears the worst shoes', i.e. cobblers are too poor and busy to attend to their own footwear. It also suggests that physicians, while often being able to help the sick, cannot always do so and, when sick themselves, are no better placed than anyone else.

Perhaps the messiah is a cobbler turning prophet and in his transition he takes the world with him?