This is ridiculous.

As I browse through this thread, all I see is arguing. Is divide and conquer that simple...is it that real? "Matt simmons said this"..."the hole is really this big" blah blah blah and blah. Mission accomplished once again...a bunch of people sitting on an internet forum blaming everything on everything but where the real blame is. Trying to change things without changing anything The need for oil comes from us allowing the need to exist, period. Stop going to work. Stop buying gas. Stop giving a # about this government and this system. You cannot have the best of both worlds. There is no such thing as peaceful government. There is no such thing as a peaceful form of control. There is no such thing as one man having the right to govern another. There is no such thing as a form of government that isn't corrupt because humans are too #ing retarded to be gods. There is no such thing as government and the planet coexisting in harmony. Why are you bitching about the BP oil disaster when the real disaster is the fact that oil gets taken out of the earth to begin with? Hasn't the truth and reality of oil being pumped out of the earth and put into a car for you to drive to go around and do things like WORK and CONSUME hit you for what it's really all about already? DOESN'T IT ALL SEEM KIND OF ODD? This really did it for me.....I actually saw someone say Dick Cheney should be afraid to die because of all the blood on his hands....do you really think Dick Cheney has personally killed anyone? The blood is on the hands of whoever was stupid enough to do what he/she was told. The blood is on the hands of your brothers and sisters who are KILLING IN THE NAME OF. Killing in the name of an idea that isn't even their own....which makes them dead even more so then the people that these idiots have killed. "We've had enough and we're waking up and we want freedom", all while still bitching about how big you think the size of the crack in the ocean floor is. How could anyone be so dependant on the poison they condemn? "Matt simmons said this"...person provides a video link of matt simmons on some talkshow...what emblem is the corner of that video link? MSNBC. Awakening my ass. Any kind of awakening lies on the shoulders of the 1-10 people on this planet whose minds are untouched.

"With this mic device
I spit nonfiction
Who got the power
This be my question
Tha mass or the few in this torn nation?
The priest the book orTHE CONGREGATION??
The politricks who rob and hold down your zone?
OR THOSE WHO GIVE THE THIEVES THE KEY TO THEIR HOMES?
Tha pig who's free to murder one Shucklak
OR SURVIVORS WHO MAKE A MOVE AND MURDER ONE BACK??

reply to post by Ciledehgaem


I agree

RATM

reply to post by SUICIDEHK45


Nothing but love...seriously. Thank you.

reply to post by Ciledehgaem


Does this have anything to do with or contain information about the BP disaster?
TLDR put it to bed in the Skunk area or something.

s and f'd.

i also tire of those who blame everyone but themselves.

but aint that america?

simpletons need a 'evil' to pin all their anger upon. they think in dichotomies, in black and white, right and wrong. meanwhile, the truth is far more complex and in-depth. and many dont seem to do in depth real well.

they need the bad guys easy to recognize and justice meted out in 30-60 minutes, including commercial time.

this is the witch hunt mentality, and it never ends well. but it will continue to enrich the fear mongers (Buy my DVD!) and muddy the waters for those of us trying to pick through the placer to find the gold.

now, be ready to have your entire post skimmed or ignored while they claim you are promoting the drinking of corexit.

[edit on 17-7-2010 by justadood]

reply to post by justadood


it's everything it's me it's you it's...i don't know there's no words for it but for some reason it's it..some people get it some people will never get it who knows who cares i'm officially cared out.

I've got to admire your post. While I don't agree with all of it, I see a fight and a passion to step off the ride...to hell in a hand basket. I think that's pretty much where we all are here...fight or flight. We've had words like "hope" and "change" ripped from our vocabulary and used against us. Our culture has evolved around oil for years, and most of us don't know how to live any other way. We've slowly been trapped into living to work and working to live. So, I understand the fighting, the arguing, the stupidity in some cases, and even the hatred to an extent.

Your best point is divide and conquer shouldn't be this easy. Everyone is looking for a clear route to a solution to what we have ultimately done to ourselves. How can we begin?

reply to post by Ciledehgaem

Yes, I see your dilemma.

You shouldn't blame yourself. I don't blame myself.

I blame greed. Greedy deceitful short-cutting money grubbing power mongering cut-throat lying ******* corporate/government executives.

Nope, no guilt here.

Peace

Two thumbs up
Donovan's 1965 Universial solider says it in song so well.
It is time for us to take responibility for our own actions, NO MORE VICTIM

So, we should blame the consumers for BP's shoddy arsed drilling practices and the petro industries' active and ongoing supression of alternative energy sources? That's realistic.
Price a solar panel lately? Auto industry adopting the Fish Carbeurator? I could stop at the local BP station and ask, but they just aren't selling hydrogen today are they?
Safety comes first when I blow glass, if I screw up and burn my studio down, would it be fair to blame my customers? How in the hell can you can put their utter failure on the shoulders of the consumer, that's patently ridiculous. Oil can be drilled for without covering over 1/3 of the Gulf of Mexico with the crap, they got greedy, skipped a few steps which directly caused this disaster.

reply to post by twitchy


so, in other words, you dont want to change your lifestyle at all. You just want to believe in some green alternative fantasy where you can continue to consume far more than your fair share.

Well, its a myth.

Solar panels and wind turbines are not going to let you turn on your air conditioner while running your microwave and watching thee big screens.

and i have yet to see a laptop made of wood and berries.

reply to post by justadood


I'm sorry, but I'm probably the last person you could pit that arguement against, I believe man belongs in an agrarian tribal patriarchy and that society itself is the grand illusion. Yeah I'm willing to 'change' my lifestyle, but if history is any account, the only real political and social change derives from violence and civil disobedience. As soon as the energy companies get off their dogmatic greedy butts and start offering real alternatives, our only recourse is the status quo, but I fail to see how this lays the blame for a blown out oil well on the consumer when it's clearly a case of criminal negligence.

reply to post by twitchy


i see, so you are all about living in utopia, as soon as the corporations package it properly for your consumption.

how incredibly noble.

Originally posted by justadood
reply to post by twitchy

 

i see, so you are all about living in utopia, as soon as the corporations package it properly for your consumption.

how incredibly noble.

What are you on about here justadood? How exactly do the words 'Tribal Patriarchy' suggest corporate packaging for consumption to you? My god, don't you know that this 'society' we live in now is the utopia, we have automobiles that heat our buttocks for us. The price of this progress is subjugation, the illusion of classes, and pepetual, though well disguised slavery at the behest of those in power.
We should picking berries and looking after our own. How you manage to politicize that is just mind boggling.

i agree

but you're speaking to a bunch of people so deep within "the matrix" that they have no idea what to do. This will ultimately continue until the consumers are consumed and uncomfortably living.

There's no point in 'waking up' when the majority who become aware of the nightmare, while still stuck in sleep paralysis. While the people who want things to be completely different are just as paralyzed due to the majority of people still stuck in a loop.

Many people have ideas and ideals on how to live without abundance and abundance of waste. We the dreamers are restrained because of (you) hopeless, helpless, lost people who deep within have great potential and great minds that are ultimately dumbed downed and follow the leader into what they were told life is supposed to be like. The people who dream and idealize and who don't follow the leader cannot do much but sit back and look in pity because we feel outnumbered.

Nothing will change until chaos ensues. Nothing will change after chaos ensues, unless you change your whole life and mindset of what life is meant to be. Until you are literally reborn innocent with new eyes to this world you will be a slave in one way or another, from any walk of life.

Chaos out of Order/Order out of Chaos

Oh and this is not a utopia. A Utopian world is not about ultimate comfort and accessibility to things . It is about balance and much more most of your thoughts cannot reach because of how you were programmed from youth.

Originally posted by Ciledehgaem
There is no such thing as one man having the right to govern another.

Well, that's a nice platitude, a nice pronouncement from a free-speech perspective, but it doesn't really hold water from a naturalist perspective.

We know for a fact that human society is very much like chimpanzee and gorilla societies, which feature these hierarchies of authority, with an alpha male dominating and guiding and punishing all the others. Such hierarchies exist in most animal species. From mammals down to insects, there is social order.

The Founders of our country were, perhaps, expressing sophisticated human ideals as "rights" granted by the Creator; but the fact that most animal species observe some sort of social order should be accepted, I think, as evidence that government IS a right granted by the Creator to some — the Alpha Males or Alpha Females — to be exercised over the other spineless wimps, okay?

Yeah, some people are meant to dominate and control others. That's part of who we are, it's basic to our evolution, right.

Interestingly, in the animal world, the dominant males decide who gets the best piece of ass — they fight off the challengers for that ass, right, because it's prime breeding material, and the Alpha Male gets to sow his seed there, propagating the next generation of the strongest offspring.

The second-tier males either don't get to reproduce, or they reproduce with the second-tier females, producing second-tier offspring.

There's no swapping of strongest and weakest sex partners in Nature. The weaker specimens are not supposed to survive, right? The great big Alpha Males don't go for the weak, old, crippled, second-tier females, right?

Now, if we extended and applied this to human society, we should be segregating the weak from the strong, we should be allowing the weak (and weak-minded) to die off, rather than "empowering" them and breeding with them, which is what humanity is all about.

Everything humanity thinks and does is so contrary to Nature, it's amazing that we have survived as long as we have. Really.

Declaring that nobody has a right to kick our ass on occasion is just wrong. Go out and try to live that philosophy. You'll get your ass kicked pretty quickly, which is the natural order of things.

— Doc Velocity

[edit on 7/18/2010 by Doc Velocity]

Originally posted by Doc Velocity
...most animal species observe some sort of social order should be accepted, I think, as evidence that government IS a right granted by the Creator...

Except that most animal species aren't being 'governed' by militant occultists hundreds and even thousands of miles away in a financially perpetuated class based system of debt and warfare. The default mechanism of hierarchy in human society is tribal patriarchy and familial interraction, IMO as evidenced by indigenous peoples in isolated areas who had no contact with the 'civilized' world. Imagine explaining taxation to a villager in Borneo, for example, his reaction to your mandate would be a meal of long pork for his family, as it should be.

Originally posted by twitchy
Except that most animal species aren't being 'governed' by militant occultists hundreds and even thousands of miles away in a financially perpetuated class based system bleh bleh bleh blah blah mumbo mumbo banana pudding

Look, your concept of social justice is alien to Nature, okay? You're coming at Nature with your fists clenched, screeching that your rights have been violated, okay, by those Alpha Males over there.

Nature breathes a sigh of indifference.

So, go play with the second-tier chimps, you haven't proven yourself as an Alpha contender.

— Doc Velocity

Originally posted by Doc Velocity

Originally posted by twitchy
Except that most animal species aren't being 'governed' by militant occultists hundreds and even thousands of miles away in a financially perpetuated class based system bleh bleh bleh blah blah mumbo mumbo banana pudding

Look, your concept of social justice is alien to Nature, okay? You're coming at Nature with your fists clenched, screeching that your rights have been violated, okay, by those Alpha Males over there.

Nature breathes a sigh of indifference.

So, go play with the second-tier chimps, you haven't proven yourself as an Alpha contender.

— Doc Velocity

Social injustice is alien to nature? Ya think?
You're Bloody Well Right
And with your own fists clenched you're screeching at the bars of your own cage as well Doc.

Originally posted by twitchy
Social injustice is alien to nature? Ya think?

Nope. Didn't say that. Said just the opposite. I said social justice is an alien concept in Nature. The Law of the Jungle and Natural Selection are Nature's offhanded reply to our demands for social justice.

Social Justice only exists in our minds, along with Nirvana, God, and the Easter Bunny.

Originally posted by twitchy
And with your own fists clenched you're screeching at the bars of your own cage as well Doc.

Well, I wasn't making it personal, I didn't mean that Ciledehgaem specifically was attempting to defy natural order in his condemnation of the governance of Man. I was speaking metaphorically.

I understand that you may be speaking metaphorically, as well. Sure, I acknowledge that I rail against tha fekking Machine all the time — but the difference is, I'm making progress in changing tha Machine from within. Yeah, I've seen tha Machine falter and flinch a couple of times from my calculated blows. I like it.

(Incidentally, just for the kids in the peanut gallery, when I'm assailing tha Machine I put on my headphones and listen to the Firebird Suite at high volume as performed by Isao Tomita. It's better and more therapeutic to my brain than the deathmetal blast of Cock & Ball Torture, okay? Don't get me wrong, Cock & Ball Torture is great, and I want them to perform at my niece's confirmation party, but I need more ethereal vibes when going against tha Machine.)



— Doc Velocity







[edit on 7/18/2010 by Doc Velocity]