U.K get rid of unnecessary laws

So what do you guys suggest?

Just ignore it and be resigned to the fact that well be bullied into a nanny state?

I feel saddened by this sense of defeatism. If the smart and sensible of the population decide there is no point, were stuck with "i wanna marry a horse" dude.

And that surely would just be a waste?

Yeah the govn't will screw us over... but hey! what else is new?

~TR~

reply to post by Tomb_Raven


Its only defeatist if your whole life revoles around what a government does.

The government is not lifes purpose is it?

I am not saying ignorance is bliss, I am saying pay attention to the world around you but do not make it your purpose because it is not.

Best way I can put it.



[edit on 1-7-2010 by XXXN3O]

reply to post by XXXN3O


lol what the govn't wanted never stopped me doing what i wanted to do

i just feel this is the first time we were given a fair chance to voice our views in a way that everybody else could actually see and comment on

I dont have high hopes... but at least there is a chance?!? And if this is a dead end then what have i lost?

~TR~

Originally posted by nik1halo
How about the right not to get fined for leaving your dustbin out on the wrong day? The right not to be spied on, using the anti-terror laws to infringe upon our right to privacy? The right to look after my friend's kids for them as a favour without having to have a pointless CRB check? They are just off the top of my head.

None of those were "rights" to lose, so it's a moot point really, except for the right to not be fioned without due process but you get that option anyway by going to court to contest it. Although I agree they are silly.

Originally posted by nik1halo
Come on people, we're always moaning here on ATS that the government have too much control over our everyday lives. Well, now you have the opportunity to do something about it!

Quite. You can say what you want about Government, but I do actually believe that the Libs and Conservatives together both want smaller Government, more personal responsibility and less Government interference. This can be a good thing, as long as it doesn't just become a sideshow.

reply to post by Tomb_Raven


The way I see it, it would only be fair if everyones opinions were selected but that is impossible for more than one reason that can be simplified. Out of all the responses they will select ones that they want to go with to satisfy the majority and justify it. Its a small mind screw for the majority to calm down a little.

I myself am happy and no government could take that from me. I help my fellow man if I am in a position to do so and share what I have, I have experienced the last five years of a life of having a house and bare essentials. I took it on the chin and I hope others do.



[edit on 1-7-2010 by XXXN3O]

Originally posted by Retseh
Most Brits seem to vote with their feet rather than the ballot paper (or in this case complaints website). I mean have you SEEN Australia?

Question is, where will you all go when no one wants you any more?

Better see if you can start fixing a few things, Englandistan only appears to be an attractive residency option for the residents of the Asian sub-continent these days.

My recommendation - escape while it's still an option.

Ah Retseh, you're usual anti British nonsense. Englandistan? Haha, whatever chap. We all know who you are, you were outed in that Falklands thread.

Originally posted by XXXN3O
The very first bill this farce, for what better of a word, produced was to introduce a 5 year fixed term parliament which is hardly liberal in a supposedly democratic country. Expect more of the same.

Actually, if you understood the reasons behind it properly instead of standing on your soap box about a supposed Nany State, you would see the fixed term Parliament thing is far more democratic than allowing the incumbant Government the power to determine when to hold an election.

Had Brown used his power in 2007/2008 he would have won the election and we'd be stuck with him, as he was riding high in the polls but he decided to go the full term, foolishly for him.

A fixed term parliament takes away this power so a sitting Government can't call an election when it suits them in order to win. In fact, most democracies have fixed Parliaments and the UK was an aborration.

reply to post by stumason


I do understand what you are saying but it has a flipside. If the current public wants the government out during the term it is not possible as far as I am aware.

I enjoy reading opinions including your own but accusing someone of standing on a soapbox is laughable on a forum. The whole point is to discuss topics which allows each member a chance to stand on a soapbox and have a voice.

Show me the point where I said I am completely right here and ill apologise for stating my own opinion. I could easily say your doing the same and you are, the difference is that I respect others.

[edit on 1-7-2010 by XXXN3O]

reply to post by XXXN3O


on the other hand it could so easily backfire on the govn't

what if enough people got together wrote an elloquent argument and proposal and petitioned it around the UK gaining the support of thousands (say over facebook or twitter ... i mean come on even just the student body should be able to amass a sh*tload of votes) and the govn't is forced to act upon it. Seeing as its on such a public portal they could hardly ignore it without raising eyebrows. I doubt it'll happen and im not going to organise it but the potential is there. Sheeple will be sheeple, but if the govn't didnt have good intentions they just gave us a gun with which to shoot them in the foot didnt they?

I mean theyre not going to say " well we only put up the website as a show of good faith hoping people were happy with the current situation " if a big enough fuss is kicked up?

Id just call that bad politics

no doubt the website will loose all if any momentum by the end of the week and people will forget. But the opportunity was there.

~TR~

who cares about the stupid petty laws.

david cameron hasn't even impressed me yet.

its like hes a puppet.

punch n judy

i can#t wait for 2015 or when England get fed up of camerons crap

Originally posted by Tomb_Raven
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

on the other hand it could so easily backfire on the govn't

what if enough people got together wrote an elloquent argument and proposal and petitioned it around the UK gaining the support of thousands (say over facebook or twitter ... i mean come on even just the student body should be able to amass a sh*tload of votes) and the govn't is forced to act upon it. Seeing as its on such a public portal they could hardly ignore it without raising eyebrows. I doubt it'll happen and im not going to organise it but the potential is there. Sheeple will be sheeple, but if the govn't didnt have good intentions they just gave us a gun with which to shoot them in the foot didnt they?

I mean theyre not going to say " well we only put up the website as a show of good faith hoping people were happy with the current situation " if a big enough fuss is kicked up?

Id just call that bad politics

no doubt the website will loose all if any momentum by the end of the week and people will forget. But the opportunity was there.

~TR~

There is only one way to find out is there not. Try it and see what happens.

I was glad to see Gordon Brown leave as the labour government was shambolic at best but im sceptical about any party to be honest. I liked the Lib Dem policies during the election and im happy to see the id cards go.

I dont have anything to add myself with the public opinion site as I am content, I already know what is to come over time and I dont mean that in a condescending sense. Im just saying that things get better at times and things get worse at times. Enjoy life and learn from the cards you get.



[edit on 1-7-2010 by XXXN3O]

Originally posted by XXXN3O
I do understand what you are saying but it has a flipside. If the current public wants the government out during the term it is not possible as far as I am aware.

It's not possible now, so what's the difference? They are thinking of putting into place a systme where people can present bills to parliament directly with enough signatures and a means to recall MP's who fail their constituents. That is far more democratic than anything we have now.

Originally posted by XXXN3O
I enjoy reading opinions including your own but accusing someone of standing on a soapbox is laughable on a forum. The whole point is to discuss topics which allows each member a chance to stand on a soapbox and have a voice.

Show me the point where I said I am completely right here and ill apologise for stating my own opinion. I could easily say your doing the same and you are, the difference is that I respect others.

I am sorry. I just get fed up to the back teeth with people being so damned negative about the UK and calling it a Police/Nanny State as if we're on our way to being like North Korea.

EDIT: It's reassuring to see that on that site some of the most popular ideas are legalising Cannabis. I have added my two pence into the mix and I highly suggest others do too! The more who are involved, the more chance there will be of something happening.

[edit on 1/7/10 by stumason]

reply to post by XXXN3O


you know i just might.

I understand where your coming from and if your secure in your position well great for you (no sarcasm intended)

But there are certain issues others hold dear... and this is the first (from what i can see) truely open forum for the populace to share its views, and i personally cannot see anything wrong with it.

If we end up disapointed it'll probably be our own fault. The website will be way too fractured and split into single interest parties, but if you can get a large enough group together and tackle this in an organised manner we may be able to make a difference.

((mhmmm ponders thoughtfully... what if i plant some of these ideas in the more actively politically minded of my friends mhmmm))

~TR~

reply to post by stumason


I hear you mate.

I think everyones just getting tired of a lot of different things.

I myself was worried about the ID cards leading to chipping. That seems to have vanished for now which is great.

Its going to be tought times ahead I think and people are going to need each other.



[edit on 1-7-2010 by XXXN3O]

Originally posted by Tomb_Raven
reply to post by XXXN3O

 

you know i just might.

I understand where your coming from

and if your secure in your position well great for you

(no sarcasm intended)

But there are certain issues others hold dear... and this is the first (from what i can see) truely open forum for the populace to share its views, and i personally cannot see anything wrong with it.

If we end up disapointed it'll probably be our own fault. The website will be way too fractured and split into single interest parties, but if you can get a large enough group together and tackle this in an organised manner we may be able to make a difference.

((mhmmm ponders thoughtfully... what if i plant some of these ideas in the more actively politically minded of my friends mhmmm))

~TR~

Go for it then!

Only thing thats stopping you is yourself by the looks of it.

On the website. It will obviously attract humorous comments, but it may also collect more serious views and opinion which could inform the politicians of the public view of some of the more pointless laws and regulation.

Legalising cannabis is one of those perennial topics, but if we try to stick to what could be changed then that would help. My personal view is that the legalisation of cannabis won’t happen – and I am pleased that it will not.

Two more observations

1) Someone said that we should scrap Stature Law. I think that may be a misunderstanding of what a Statute is. A Statute is the document that describes the law – you cannot scrap it!

Statute Law Database

2) The UK is not a police state nor are the British oppressed and under the jack boot of authority. You have to put things in perspectiv and try to avoid the Daily Mail hype as there is over exaggeration and falsehood.

The fact is that laws and regulations have a legitimate and compelling reason to exist. The issue is which ones could go without any adverse effect and / or what activities have gone too far and need to be controlled (by law) and cut back - like intrusive CCTV.

Regards

Originally posted by Tomb_Raven
So what do you guys suggest?

Just ignore it and be resigned to the fact that well be bullied into a nanny state?

I feel saddened by this sense of defeatism. If the smart and sensible of the population decide there is no point, were stuck with "i wanna marry a horse" dude.

And that surely would just be a waste?

Yeah the govn't will screw us over... but hey! what else is new?

~TR~

Brother, it is not defeatism... it is realism.

We live in a world which is more akin to a play than reality. What we see before us, what we are told to make our opinions on and take our education from is 99% a front, a farce, a mask covering the true way the world works. The papers, the news on TV, the televised political debates... These are not to be looked at as a serious, genuine event, they are not what they seem to be, they are a distraction... a magnet pulling us away from the truth.

Now, if the website was more like this:

"Bilderbergs, Rothschilds, Leeman Brothers admit to evil controlling ways, they have seen the light and want to put our world into a better place. They have seen the error of their ways... And they want to know what YOU the public beleive is the way forward."

Source (I wish)

Then I would be looking at it with a pinch of hope.



[edit on 2-7-2010 by and14263]

Originally posted by paraphi


Legalising cannabis is one of those perennial topics, but if we try to stick to what could be changed then that would help. My personal view is that the legalisation of cannabis won’t happen – and I am pleased that it will not.

But surely the current policy of a possible 5 year prison sentence for smoking or posessing the drug is crazy. Criminalising young people for smoking cannibis is wrong. This is a law that needs changing. Especially if the Torries are aiming to reduce the prison figures.

Originally posted by paraphi
On the website. It will obviously attract humorous comments, but it may also collect more serious views and opinion which could inform the politicians of the public view of some of the more pointless laws and regulation.

Legalising cannabis is one of those perennial topics, but if we try to stick to what could be changed then that would help. My personal view is that the legalisation of cannabis won’t happen – and I am pleased that it will not.

Two more observations

1) Someone said that we should scrap Stature Law. I think that may be a misunderstanding of what a Statute is. A Statute is the document that describes the law – you cannot scrap it!

Statute Law Database

2) The UK is not a police state nor are the British oppressed and under the jack boot of authority. You have to put things in perspectiv and try to avoid the Daily Mail hype as there is over exaggeration and falsehood.

The fact is that laws and regulations have a legitimate and compelling reason to exist. The issue is which ones could go without any adverse effect and / or what activities have gone too far and need to be controlled (by law) and cut back - like intrusive CCTV.

Regards

I am just assuming here that you are refering to my post that statute law needs a and overhaul..note I said overhaul.

Statute law: the words are fixed and thus the policy they implement are confined.

Words in common law are not fixed and can evolve therefore we look to case law to guide and evolve.

Take for example based on true events ie mine.

I rented a property, the law says that the landlord has to have a gas safety check every year.There was none for 6 years. Thus the law was broken by not having the check.

This law is based in Statute Law, I sustained an acquired brain injury with my working memory from carbon monoxide leaking, my IQ was tested and my working memory has a 20 points difference in the premorbid IQ

Can I prosecute under this law.. no as a private citizen I can not lay a private prosecution because I am not listed as an officer in the Statute Law. The Health and Safety Executive "own" that law.


Lord Wilberforce, speaking in the House of Lords in 1997 said:
"Perhaps I may remind noble lords of what our essential civil rights, as guaranteed by common law, are: the presumption of innocence; the right to a fair hearing; no man to be obliged to testify against himself; the rule against double jeopardy; no retrospective legislation; no legislation to be given an effect contrary to international law - an old principle that has been there for years; freedom of expression; and freedom of association …firmly secured already by the common law of this country, and not intended to be superseded or modified by new inter-state obligations…"

Yes Statute Law needs an overhaul..

reply to post by BANANAMONTANA


I'm sorry to hear that. Did the HSE prosecute the landlord? If so (and if he was guilty) I assume you could then have launched a private action for damages?

This does illustrate the extent to which law is subject to administrative expediency.

Originally posted by and14263
Really though, do you think this is something that the gov. will act upon?

Do you think this is 'the people' getting their say?

Do you think the gov. ever listen to the people?

I wonder if I've come to the wrong website sometimes I really do.

Ed: (You'll have to excuse my tone today, I'm in an incredibley negative mood)

[edit on 1-7-2010 by and14263]

Lets just say I'd like to believe. Call me an optimist if you will, but I actually think this new Gov't may have learned a few things from the past idiot's failures.