I don't care about the Gaza issue.

Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by Amagnon

 

I do understand the issue.

It's not what you are describing though.

These are contradictory statements - you obviously do not understand. Ignorance can be cured, stupidity probably cannot - so, if you simply suffer the former, I have no doubt that as you learn more your opinion will change - if your opinion does not change, then the alternative diagnosis seems the more appropriate.

reply to post by Gorman91


reply to post by Amagnon


At the moment you sound like those security guards, sorry, but you have to walk around and see the world.

www.youtube.com...

www.thestar.co.uk...

You are those guys who just stand and watch, or just pass by and say who cares.

See I was one of those people in school who didn't tolerate bullying, heck I was probably one of the smallest dues around, not in height but in weight. That didn't stop me from resisting bullies and even help others.

I used to fight a lot, helped many people, bring them up the game a little because they were bullied too much.

Some people got bullied so much that they automatically became submissive to the next bully. This was a trend, I seen it in my life, and I seen it in world stage.

Originally posted by LittleSecret
reply to post by Gorman91

 

reply to post by Amagnon

 

At the moment you sound like those security guards, sorry, but you have to walk around and see the world.

I'm not sure you read and understood my post? Or are you responding to someone else?

I am not the type to walk on by - I certainly do care, and I certainly will take action.

Originally posted by Amagnon

If you saw some thugs beating up some defenseless people and stealing their stuff - apparently you would say "Who cares, none of my business." Anyone with a soul would at least feel pity for the victim, and probably voice it - even if they felt helpless to assist.

This is what Israel vs Palestine means to those who understand the issue.
[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

this is NOT someone beating up a defenseless person is it?
it is NOT a one-off incident is it? Thousands have died from both sides!!

BOTH SIDES have attacked one another. And it has been going on for DECADES!! AND people are sick and tired of it.

NO one cares who started it. NO one cares if 1 side has better weapons and is therefore more heavy handed when attacking or retaliating.

IF you cant arm yourselves properly, dont go to a fight!!
are palestinians that stupid and backward that they cant arm themselves properly in this modern day and age?

even lil kim jong il has nukes. and they are a closed society.
dont get your ass whooped and start crying to the whole world.
NO ONE CARES.

if you cant fight. dont go to war. admit defeat.
pit your head betw your legs, kneel down to israel and beg them for peace!!
i am sure they will oblige.

carry on with life...

reply to post by Amagnon


I agreed with you, and disagreed with the OP..

I added your reply but forgot to respond to you..

reply to post by LittleSecret


Lovely. You got expelled in my school for fighting back. So I learned to not feel pain. Rest assured I pounced some guys in my day.

But I was responding to the world YOU put me in. The examples you listed are different than the world you put me in. There is nothing preventing intervention there. The world you put me in would have punished them.

In 5th grade, fed up, I told a bully that 10 years from now he would be nothing more than a shop clerk's cleaning servant, and I would be in a good college getting a living. Last winter, We saw each other in a restaurant. He was sweeping the floors. I was back from college eating out. The words were strongly remembered. We chatted about our past. he changed. I waited. We stopped fighting. Why? because I rarely if ever responded. He acted like a fool. he learned the hard way, I learned young. He owes debts. I do not. He can't go to college. I barely have to pay a thing for college.


The difference is simple. I have experienced the world you put me in first hand. I know how to live in such a world.

So forgive me for saying this, but no pile of BS you put near me can change this end result of the same situation from my childhood.

Fighting back only makes you as bad as the one as you are fighting.

There's the rare exception, of course. But I do not care for violence. if I am struck, I ignore it. People become bizarre by it. How can I be knocked to the floor, get up, and just laugh? I do because I can. because violence is not needed there.

Ultimately it ends the same. The aggressors lose a reason to be aggressive. Punches become handshakes. War becomes peace. But they know. if they were ever to go back, showed them just enough of my non violent insanity to not want to go against me.


So again, forgive me, but I saw situations like Palestine and Israel in GRAMMAR school. Often my numbness to pain STOPPED fights because they knew they could not stop me. Why fight if it does nothing> No response? No trap sprung? No reason to fight,

Now good night. Think about it.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Gorman91]

hell you're own sig is essentially what I am talking about.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91

Fighting back only makes you as bad as the one as you are fighting.

There's the rare exception, of course. But I do not care for violence. if I am struck, I ignore it. People become bizarre by it. How can I be knocked to the floor, get up, and just laugh? I do because I can. because violence is not needed there.

Ultimately it ends the same. The aggressors lose a reason to be aggressive. Punches become handshakes. War becomes peace. But they know. if they were ever to go back, showed them just enough of my non violent insanity to not want to go against me.

I can honestly bet you haven't been bullied, and if you have, not to the extent where people end up taking their own lives. Yes, one girl in Waitakere college killed herself.

Another guy cut his arm in the Gym when we were having PE class.

Here, let me make your whole argument simple so you can understand it yourself also:

"Let's have no laws"

Get what I mean?

Or is that too simple for you.


[edit on 28-6-2010 by LittleSecret]

Originally posted by FuGGer

Originally posted by Amagnon

If you saw some thugs beating up some defenseless people and stealing their stuff - apparently you would say "Who cares, none of my business." Anyone with a soul would at least feel pity for the victim, and probably voice it - even if they felt helpless to assist.

This is what Israel vs Palestine means to those who understand the issue.
[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

this is NOT someone beating up a defenseless person is it?
it is NOT a one-off incident is it? Thousands have died from both sides!!

BOTH SIDES have attacked one another. And it has been going on for DECADES!! AND people are sick and tired of it.

NO one cares who started it. NO one cares if 1 side has better weapons and is therefore more heavy handed when attacking or retaliating.

IF you cant arm yourselves properly, dont go to a fight!!
are palestinians that stupid and backward that they cant arm themselves properly in this modern day and age?

even lil kim jong il has nukes. and they are a closed society.
dont get your ass whooped and start crying to the whole world.
NO ONE CARES.

if you cant fight. dont go to war. admit defeat.
pit your head betw your legs, kneel down to israel and beg them for peace!!
i am sure they will oblige.

carry on with life...

Your post betrays complete ignorance of the situation.

I thought this thread might help illuminate things for you a bit; www.abovetopsecret.com...

You claim "thousands have died on both sides" - perhaps this thread will tell you exactly how many.

Palestinians cannot arm themselves because they effectively live behind bars - they can barely feed themselves because all of their farms and groves have been bulldozed or destroyed and Jewish settlers have taken the land.

They cannot arm themselves because their manufacturing capability has been bombed and destroyed. Getting weapons into Palestine is extremely difficult because they live in concentration camps.

They are primitive because bombing, bulldozing, and total sanctions have destroyed any economy they might have had.

Some people will not accept injustice - they will fight against tyranny and oppression to their last breath - these are real people, these are human beings with dignity. They resist the scum who are embodied by Israel.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

reply to post by Amagnon


Didn't you read his post before?

He says he doesn't care about facts, he just cares if someone is fighting, so if you are fighting, it doesn't matter who the aggressor is, both individuals are the wrong.

Sorry OP, I don't agree, and I think you live in a rich neighborhood therefore haven't truly grasped the human nature in time of hopelessness.

You can put a chip in my back and force me to be submissive to aggression, other than that, I'll always fight, an eye for an eye.

Once again OP, no justice, no peace.

Originally posted by Amagnon
Your post betrays complete ignorance of the situation.

Palestinians cannot arm themselves because they effectively live behind bars - they can barely feed themselves because all of their farms and groves have been bulldozed or destroyed and Jewish settlers have taken the land.

They cannot arm themselves because their manufacturing capability has been bombed and destroyed. Getting weapons into Palestine is extremely difficult because they live in concentration camps.

They are primitive because bombing, bulldozing, and total sanctions have destroyed any economy they might have had.

Some people will not accept injustice - they will fight against tyranny and oppression to their last breath - these are real people, these are human beings with dignity. They resist the scum who are embodied by Israel.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

firstly. learn to post without resorting to Personal Attacks.
same goes to your reply to azrael36!

now. "palestinian cant arm themselves bec..."

all i hear are EXCUSES!!. LOSERS make excuses.
WINNERS rise above obstacles in their path.

WINNERS dont cry about the big bad wolf to the world looking for sympathy.
WINNERS get organized and get to work.

LOSERS just give excuses. they go on and on about why they cant do this and that.
LOSERS deserve to be treated like rats in a sewer by WINNERS.

who wants to be a winner?

Why take sides?

I don't know for sure. I guess it's in my nature.

I started taking sides early in life, about third grade...

There was a guy, poor guy, he had only one fully functional hand,
and he was playing tether-ball by himself. Then this other guy
came up and told him to that the tether ball game was for his use
only and to leave (there were two other tether-ball rings unused
at the time). So the guy with the bad hand moved to another
court. Then the antagonist followed him and told him the same thing again.
While he was bullying this kid I walked up, and when he turned to face me,
I decked him...I don't know why I didn't try to reason with him, but I didn't,
I just punched him. I got in alot of trouble at school that day...but not
at home. (I guess dad didn't like bullies either)

reply to post by FuGGer


Losers were those who resisted the Zionist regime of Israel without violence.

Look, Hamas gained Gaza back,

This is how Gaza was before second intifada:

Gaza, one of the most densely populated tracts of land in the world, is home to 1,178,000 Palestinians, 33 per cent of whom live in United Nations-funded refugee camps.
Gaza is also home to 6,900 Jewish settlers. Yet the Israeli-controlled areas and settlements take up about 40 per cent of Gaza's land. Israel controls all external borders, crossing points and major roads in Gaza.

I'm personally pissed off at the OP because he wants the Palestinians to be the same losers they were before. He is saying resisting doesn't achieve anything

Turkey supports Hamas now, that is huge..

[edit on 28-6-2010 by LittleSecret]

Originally posted by LittleSecret
reply to post by Amagnon

 

Didn't you read his post before?

He says he doesn't care about facts, he just cares if someone is fighting, so if you are fighting, it doesn't matter who the aggressor is, both individuals are the wrong.

Sorry OP, I don't agree, and I think you live in a rich neighborhood therefore haven't truly grasped the human nature in time of hopelessness.

You can put a chip in my back and force me to be submissive to aggression, other than that, I'll always fight, an eye for an eye.

Once again OP, no justice, no peace.

Its not even about who is the aggressor - if Israel simply returned the land it had stolen, and allowed the Palestinian people to live normal lives, not in prison - I think they would put it behind them.

To live a life in prison, threatened, attacked, provoked - how is that life? Submitting does not help - Israel wants them all to die.

Originally posted by FuGGer

Originally posted by Amagnon
Your post betrays complete ignorance of the situation.

Palestinians cannot arm themselves because they effectively live behind bars - they can barely feed themselves because all of their farms and groves have been bulldozed or destroyed and Jewish settlers have taken the land.

They cannot arm themselves because their manufacturing capability has been bombed and destroyed. Getting weapons into Palestine is extremely difficult because they live in concentration camps.

They are primitive because bombing, bulldozing, and total sanctions have destroyed any economy they might have had.

Some people will not accept injustice - they will fight against tyranny and oppression to their last breath - these are real people, these are human beings with dignity. They resist the scum who are embodied by Israel.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

firstly. learn to post without resorting to Personal Attacks.
same goes to your reply to azrael36!

now. "palestinian cant arm themselves bec..."

all i hear are EXCUSES!!. LOSERS make excuses.
WINNERS rise above obstacles in their path.

WINNERS dont cry about the big bad wolf to the world looking for sympathy.
WINNERS get organized and get to work.

LOSERS just give excuses. they go on and on about why they cant do this and that.
LOSERS deserve to be treated like rats in a sewer by WINNERS.

who wants to be a winner?

Well, you want to be - unfortunately you appear to be simply another loser - so, because you recommended the treatment, perhaps I should treat you like a rat in a sewer?

Regarding your reference to personal attacks, apparently you are not a winner, but a whiner? Crying about the big bad wolf etc - boo fkn hoo - if you are going to make ignorant and stupid comments, expect them to be called stupid and ignorant.

You talk a lot about winners, but obviously fail to understand that amoral use of force does not imply a winner - it implies a childish bully.

Superior might does not create moral superiority - defending your home and family against oppressors is a just cause, and why Palestinians, while oppressed, are the true winners. The mass media is largely controlled by the same interests that control Israel - and why you and many others have a distorted opinion.

I don't see Palestine on its knees begging, they fight and resist - they have limited means, but apparently great courage.

Valor, justice, courage - these are immortal values that leave an indelible mark on history - long after the men themselves have gone.

Three hundred Spartans defied the hundreds of thousands of Xerxes Persian hordes - the tale of their courage has lasted thousands of years, and may endure for all the ages of mankind.

Israel is a petty bully, and we can hope its evil regime will, as Ahmadinejad expressed; "Vanish from the page of time." Such is the lot of losers, and vermin alike.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Amagnon]

reply to post by LittleSecret



I was bullied "that" badly. I went to a shrink too. But then I realized something really young. Must have been 2nd grade. I asked myself "why?"

Why do I care what others think?

Why do I need to respond?

Responding gets a punch. Not responding gets a punch. Why do I have to do this game?

Why do I have to listen?

Why do I have to speak?

Why do I have to pick a side at all?


This wonderful question posed by the mind of a child, my mind of a child, freed me. Because once I realized the mighty powerful phrase "I don't care", I no longer was bound to such idiocracies of other children.

-JINX!
-I don't care

-Give me your money
-I don't care

-fattass!
-I don't care

etc etc.


So you see. I of had not asked that question, I WOULD be one of those depressed children. But because I asked myself "why feel sad at all?" I stopped feeling sad all together.

It got too much to one extreme one time. A student died. I asked myself "why cry?" as I saw everyone else was. I stopped feeling sadness all together. The other students did not like this and became angry and my questions now posed to them by myself! Thus I became an emotionally mute student. Absolute Stoic Cool.

I would not realize I was becoming stoic for quite some time, but it basically was Stoic coolness.

Eventually by 8th grade I realized I had crossed over to one extreme, and allowed myself to laugh again. So today, I do not feel sad or anger too often at all. expect, you know, scenes like the end of gladiator.

In the end, I realized one thing. Emotion is a choice. And I understand that many have no control of emotions, I also realized it is because they do not know it is a choice, because emotions are human nature, and we are born and experience them since birth. Why would one question their absolutism? Well, I did. I don't HAVE to feel angry or sad. I don't anymore on a wide variety of issues. I still cry when I see a good movie ending, I correct the wrongs of racism and biased society to those I know. But that is because I know them to be wrong. I don't have to feel an emotion to know that.


So what with me acting like a Vulcan now, I'll stop there. But basically, I was bullied that much. But where's the rule that all children have to respond the same way?



reply to post by Amagnon



That's great. You have statistics. Lets look at reality now, mmkay?

Both nations require military involvement from their citizens.

Like I said, both nation have blurred what exactly is innocence.

Because of this blurring, to win the war, both sides do not have "soldiers and civilians". They have armed and unarmed. Everyone is a potential threat on every side.

And, children DO fight in these wars on both sides. because 18 is considered adult.l And as young as 13 and 14 year old boys are fighting. I think something like 16 to 17 year olds in israel.


So, the reason why there are so many children dieing in Palestine side is quite simple. They, and Israel, are barbarians using young 13 through 18 year olds as soldiers.

And also suicide bombers seldom.

It's simple. A man who has lost everything, is capable of anything. Including killing his own children for war.

www.hrw.org...

Israel used to do it quite frequenting, but not as much anymore.

Like I said, that's why I am color blind to the two sides. They are more alike in their barbarianism than anything else.

It;s funny. Cause they learn from each other, copy and pasting each other's moves. Like cancer cells dividing, they grow worser as time goes on, each one eve more daring towards death.


reply to post by LittleSecret


Actually. I demand more than that. I want no one there to have their own country. They do not deserve it. They bicker and fight. The only time that area has seen peace is when neither side controlled it. Weather it be rule by Saladin or the British. it seems that the locals have an incapacity to not kill each other.


So go ahead and be pissed off, in the end there are 3 options to this war. 3 eventual ends. Israel either exterminates Palestine as a whole, a nuclear bomb glasses it all, killing both, or a new nation is UN-stamped over both and they STFU and all lose.

Communal losing seems to be the only solution to not dying.

[edit on 28-6-2010 by Gorman91]

reply to post by Gorman91


I agree, my only reason to take on decriers of Israel are when they depict Hamas in a purely innocent way.

Because really, if you're calling a spade a spade then why don't you call the homophobic misogynists over in Gaza spades as well.

Although these days sniping at bias gets you called a Megaphoner.

reply to post by Amagnon


Absolutely great point about "how many." People who make blanket statements about all the "millions of dead Israelis" make me want to cry. But it just goes to show how powerful the propaganda machine is...especially in short-attention span America.

The same goes for the numbers used in the "war" on terrorism. Americans dead due to acts of terrorism? Go look it up. Deaths caused by America's disproportionate response to same? Go look that up too.

reply to post by ~Lucidity


Well I actually do not believe in appropriate response. bug dies from a hammer just as well as a tissue. So why not use the hammer and be sure you win?

And I don't believe in international law nor the Genevieve conventions, etc etc. All they do is say that if you dance the right way, you can kill whoever you want. I follow my constitutional laws very well of the US. Because I am in the US.

International law basically allows America to kill whoever they want and not get charged for much other than the rebuilding of whatever they blew up doing their work.

So yea. If I was getting bombed for a few months with Rockets, I'd probably bomb a good number of people.

Casualties are casualties. That is why War is bad, evil, and genocide. I really could care less who dies more or less or the ratio of children dead in war or not. All that is doing is making war pretty. As if a man dying is any more or less wrong than a child?

That's stupid. Death is wrong. Violence is wrong. War is wrong. There's not much of an exception to this other than Hitler and Stalin. Besides that, not really much reason for war. War is only good against an insane person who desires war. That is why before WW2, the US was smart enough not to have war unless it really was a bad enemy, exception there being the Mexican war, which was essentially a big lie.

Going back to the original point though, I simply do not care about your international law, or your Geneva conventions or your tears for the dead babies in war. More babies die from teenage couples getting abortions to hide their mistake than have died in this war.

So forgive my seemingly inhuman response.

I don't care.

For the real culprit is the very cancer that is war. A man who dies in war with a gun fighting for his nation is just as much a tragedy as a baby dieing defenselessly. It's a death. And therefore genocide.


I am not going to go around picking sides therefore. For both sides have killed, and both sides wanted war, and both sides turned to barbarianism and both sides turned to murder.

I could not give a flying pig zombie if one side started it or not. It's literally a senile old war over whose ancestor got almost sacrificed to God. Oh how God must regret the test of Abraham. For in choosing Abraham's decedents as his chosen people, he resigned his ability to interfere. For he cannot punish either son of Abraham, and in fact must remain true to his promise by letting them learn the hard way of how retarded their war is.


In the end. I don't care.

I don't care, because they don't care.

The Greek word used for love in the Bible is agápe. It means to desire the best possible thing for another person. to take any side is to violate that code, that powerful word. I can only hope that the slightly irradiated children of both sides look upon the burned, glassed valley that once flowed with milk and honey but now flows with cancer and death, and wonder to themselves. Why? why were they so retarded? Who cares who started it. Look upon the end results of whoever ends it! Let us never again attack and let us be as brothers in the days of old.


That is why I do not care about the war. because to care about he war would be to take a side. I am not going to. I am going to return to those children and tell them to remember their ancestors. But not to remember them as great men. But rather, to remember them as men of insanity and evil. To hate them and curse their name and their memories, to damn their very existence into the blackness of history, forgotten forever.