Obama Arrives: Health Premiums Jump 20 Percent

Originally posted by airspoon
reply to post by suicydking

 

Lets just say that the insurance lobby is telling the truth and the higher premiums are up because not enough healthy people are buying individual plans. Then how on earth will the HCR bill do anything to curb those higher premiums when the gap between healthy and unhealthy gets even larger once the so-called "reform" comes into effect?

Also, it's quite foolish to think that premiums are so high due solely to medical costs and a lack of healthy people to even out the 'benefit to cost' ratio. It would be even more foolish to assume that a lobbying group would be truthful about their respective operating procedures. The health insurance industry is there to profit, not to be a public service. Their premiums are going to rise to whatever they feel they can get away with, as to benefit themselves and their investors, not the public at large. This article relates to the HCR bill in that this is only a microcosm of what's to come, since the motive of the insurance industry will remain the same, with the only difference being that people will be forced to patronize them, i.e. a larger customer base to profit from.

--airspoon

[edit on 22-6-2010 by airspoon]

That's a lot of 'if's & 'when's. Most of those points have already been debated ad nauseum in other threads.

What I want to know, is how has Obama caused these rates to increase since he has been in office?

reply to post by suicydking


When he signed the biggest bailout to the insurance companies, mandatory private insurance or be fined.

What companies do they hike prices prior the bill comes into effect. . .

Because Obama forgot to allow regulations on premiums affordable is an oxymoron with Obama HCR



[edit on 22-6-2010 by marg6043]

reply to post by suicydking


This plus...do we have any charts that shows trending before he arrived. That would help to know. You know. Before I use this cool little icon I just found again

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by suicydking

 

When he signed the biggest bailout to the insurance companies, mandatory private insurance or be fined.

What companies do they hike prices prior the bill comes into effect. . .

Because Obama forgot to allow regulations on premiums affordable is an oxymoron with Obama HCR

[edit on 22-6-2010 by marg6043]

Lots of contradictions here. Let's try to sort it all out.

First, we have a post that states that premiums have gone up since Obama took office, therefore he is bad for us and our premiums.

Then, we look at the article used to support this claim. The article states that in fact, yes, premiums have gone up since Obama took office, although it doesn't list him as a cause.

The article also states that the insurance lobbies fought against the reform bill.

Then, we have someone who says that the HCR bill is going to be fantastic for the insurers.

Then, that same person states that the reason why premiums have gone up during the Obama administration is because they are trying to make a buck before the HCR goes into effect.

Why would they be scrambling now if they were about to hit the big time in 2014 when the bill takes effect?

What are the reasons why Obama signing a HCR bill halfway through his first term would cause a steady increase in rates since day one (as is implied in the OP)?

What are the direct effects of the HCR bill on current premiums?

Again, I'm not arguing in favor or against the HCR bill. I'm just trying to resolve the connection between the source article and Obama causing premiums to increase since he took office.

Just because rates have gone up since 2008 doesn't mean that it happened because of Obama. No connection has been shown, not even a casual one.

Edit: misplaced my quote tags, grammar

[edit on 22-6-2010 by suicydking]

[edit on 22-6-2010 by suicydking]

reply to post by suicydking


Obama is the president of the United States. He has taken it upon himself and his administration to put the responsibility of health care access on the government, in effect saying that it is the business of government to do so. I am not arguing whether this is right or wrong. Because Obama himself sees that it is government's business to control health care costs, when health care costs rise, as in insurance costs, then it is his fault, due to his own undertakings.

I can't say that the cleanliness of my office is my responsibility, yet when my office becomes dirty, I blame someone else.

Either health care costs are the responsibility of government or not but if they are, then Obama has to own it regardless of whether costs go down or up. You can't claim responsibility only when things are going your way. This is not that hard to understand.

--airspoon


[edit on 22-6-2010 by airspoon]

reply to post by airspoon


I could bite here, and say that instead of this being Obama's fault, it's the fault of his opponents. It's Sara Palin and her shovel-ready grandma comments that stopped Obama from passing beneficial reform. It's Rush Limbaugh and his cries of Socialism that stopped a good bill from being passed.

That would be silly, though. Why? because you still can't show a connection between anything Obama has done so far and the rise in premiums. Instead, you imply that it's due to what he hasn't done (see my points above).

The problem with that is that the HCR bill will not be fully implemented for another four years. Any reform or changes that are a cause of his actions will be realized then, and only then. Until then, all we can do is speculate.

To pass the time between now and 2014, you post an article that states that the insurance industry is fighting against Obama's reform. Then, you make a statement which directly contradicts the point of the article (the increase in rates is due to a lack of enrollees) and say that it's Obama's fault. How is it his fault if his policies aren't even in effect yet? I would think that a lack of regulation from previous administrations would be more relevant at this point, at least until the HCR Bill is rolled out.

edit: my keyboard hates vowels.

[edit on 22-6-2010 by suicydking]

reply to post by suicydking


First of all, we here in ATS dissected the bill, found out that the ones that actually wrote the bill where a usual the insurance companies lobbying groups, Big pharma prior to the bill were already having closed doors meeting with Obama with all kind of goodies so they will not go against the bill.

So as you see what it was something made to take care of the gouging of the insurance companies turn in crap when the mandatory BS was kept from the original proposed bill the mandatory was our gift from Insurance companies themselves.

Now I did a research on why the insurance companies wanted a bailout, and is posted in one of my threads.

This corrupted companies did a calculation like any other corporation about how much the baby boomer's were to take away from their profits in the next ten years.

The whole thing that they where against the HCR is nothing but lies, they promoted the HCR and wrote the bill, my friend, all that came out of the whole HCR after the fact.

Obama public option was signed the week after the bill was signed to expand Medicare to cover for those that can not be forced into private insurance, at the expenses of tax payer.

At the last moment the regulations that would control insurance gouging were taken out of the bill because the morons in Washington believe it was against capitalism.

If you didn't know anything of what was going on behind the scam of the HCR then like many Americans in this country you fell for the lies.

We did our research on ATS and is many threads that tells what is all about.

Since this is EXACTLY what happened in Massachusetts,

Why would this be a surprise to anyone?

unless you are an idiot.

I am sorry I wrote in my last post, Medicare is Medicaid the one that is to become the public option hat, has nothing public in it as the Federal government will back the state 100% until 2017 when the states (many already bankrupted) will pick up the bill again probably taxing the citizens even more.