BOYCOTT: American Job Exporters!! The List

Doesn`t the US Govt make the rules for businesses?
Doesn`t the US Govt hire people for their facilities overseas that are not US Citizens? I guess we will have to boycott the whole country except for the little mom and pop stores.

Did we ever wonder why jobs are being exported? Quality up and prices down... hmmmmm Japan is having the same problems as the US. Msu think about why people are outsourcing, the try to fix it. Not just blame others for exporting without fixing the problem.

How about come up with solutions of why our qality is not so great and the price is more expensive instead of just saying boycott the companies. If you boycott them, then they will have to look for even cheaper labor... Where is that.. Overseas... Then you just drive them completely out of the country. FIX THE PROBLEM FIRST..... Making idle remarks of how things do not work well or are not the way you want does nothing about How will YOU fix it. How about put a real plan out there.

It is not easy folks for everyone involved......

Originally posted by JCMinJapan
Doesn`t the US Govt make the rules for businesses?
Doesn`t the US Govt hire people for their facilities overseas that are not US Citizens? I guess we will have to boycott the whole country except for the little mom and pop stores.

Did we ever wonder why jobs are being exported? Quality up and prices down... hmmmmm Japan is having the same problems as the US. Msu think about why people are outsourcing, the try to fix it. Not just blame others for exporting without fixing the problem.

How about come up with solutions of why our qality is not so great and the price is more expensive instead of just saying boycott the companies. If you boycott them, then they will have to look for even cheaper labor... Where is that.. Overseas... Then you just drive them completely out of the country. FIX THE PROBLEM FIRST..... Making idle remarks of how things do not work well or are not the way you want does nothing about How will YOU fix it. How about put a real plan out there.

It is not easy folks for everyone involved......

First of all the quality of american products is just as good as anywhere else. And just like everywhere else we have some products that are not so great. What these companies have done is built their names and products and reputation on the backs of american workers. Than they sold us out to the lowest bidder, to people who can work for 15 cents a day with no potty breaks and still maintain their standard of living. Not only can we not compete with those prices why would we want to? Do you want to live in a mud hut? I have a great idea of how to fix the problem, BOYCOTT THE TRAITORS. How's that for an idea! They used americans and than tossed them in the trash, humiliated them by making them train their replacements or be fired without severance pay. How disgusting is that, these people have families, mortgages, kids to feed. You don't just do that to the people who made your company into a living breathing prosperous entity, it's traderous and should be dealt with as such. As far as the US unemployment rate being expectable compared to other countries in the EU, this isn't the EU. We don't eat haggis, we don't lay down when terrorists attack us and we certainly don't find it acceptable for americans who are the life blood of a company to be discarded like this. Maybe that's good enough for germany, or Japan but it's not acceptable here. Like I said, if they want to sell their products here they should have a tax on those items that is comparable to the difference in labor costs, before we have to live in mud huts because minimum wage has been lowered to 15 cents a day so we can be competitive with India.

Let me just say one thing.

The United States had a "Protectionist" policy with its economy before, and guess what, it destroyed Germany's economy giving rise to Hitler.

It is proven that had the Smoot-Holly (correct spelling?) Act not been enforced, that Germany could have recovered from WWI, basically the Marshal Plan is the opposite of Smoot-Holly, which raised tariffs and the like to protect American industries and every action has another reaction.

It was also a leading cause of the Depression.

So why you are all wanting to be so "protective" I don't know...do you really want reduced trade? Depression? Inflation? Instability in other nations because work they were getting and trade they were getting by making US products and trading them to us, suddenly disappears.

No you don't, if you do then you better have a good plan for becomming the next Napoleon or Hitler after the upheavals it creates, other-wise you've no real justification.

The reality is we'll find NEW jobs to have, as we expand our economies in other specialized areas that other nations do not or can not do.

Read a book (I forget its exact name because it's a pretty big name) called something like, "The Wealth of Nations".

That book sums up everything that our world economy is based on today in short, and that book was written in the 1700s about how every nation would become rich if they all specialized in doing specific things.

Such as England produced coal, germany produced steel, france produced finished products.

Then England trades with France and Germany for finished goods from france which are used to mine coal, Germany uses the coal to power other mining opperations and processing opperations and France uses the coal to power their industiral opperations and ships those products back to germany for mining opperations.

And the big cycle works, because that is exactly where things are starting to head towards, and so far the over-all world economy has only been growing. Where as under the imperialist system (which is what you are promoting by keeping industrial jobs and other labor jobs in America) has only caused depressions and inflations and war.

Originally posted by FreeMason
Let me just say one thing.

The United States had a "Protectionist" policy with its economy before, and guess what, it destroyed Germany's economy giving rise to Hitler.

It was also a leading cause of the Depression.

So why you are all wanting to be so "protective" I don't know...do you really want reduced trade? Depression? Inflation? Instability in other nations because work they were getting and trade they were getting by making US products and trading them to us, suddenly disappears.

No you don't, if you do then you better have a good plan for becomming the next Napoleon or Hitler after the upheavals it creates, other-wise you've no real justification.

The reality is we'll find NEW jobs to have, as we expand our economies in other specialized areas that other nations do not or can not do.

Read a book (I forget its exact name because it's a pretty big name) called something like, "The Wealth of Nations".

That book sums up everything that our world economy is based on today in short, and that book was written in the 1700s about how every nation would become rich if they all specialized in doing specific things.

That is the most ridicules thing I have heard all night. Next you will accuse the US of crucifying jesus. If you're going to make ridicules claims such as it was the US's fault that Hitler came to power you better have some proof to back it up or you're just running your mouth. Yes I think reducing the 5/1 trade deficit we have with China is a VERY GOOD THING. Yes we have to expand, yes we have to create new jobs and new specialties but that doesn't mean we should forget why people are losing their houses and going on unemployment in record numbers. You think thats not a drain on the economy? We should take some of that money back from the companies who caused the problem. Maybe if we lived in the 1700's a book on economics in the 1700's would be useful, but we don't and it's not. I think your doomsday prediction is not only absurd but reads like a sci-fi perversion of history.

Originally posted by J0HNSmith
That is the most ridicules thing I have heard all night. Next you will accuse the US of crucifying jesus. If you're going to make ridicules claims such as it was the US's fault that Hitler came to power you better have some proof to back it up or you're just running your mouth.

I obviously have something to back it up, I told you, Smoot-Holly Acts, protectivist economies, THE WEALTH OF NATIONS...read this stuff and know it well. It is why we had the Marshall Plan after WW2, and not a repeat of Smoot-Holly.

Thank you.

Originally posted by J0HNSmith
Yes I think reducing the 5/1 trade deficit we have with China is a VERY GOOD THING. Yes we have to expand, yes we have to create new jobs and new specialties but that doesn't mean we should forget why people are losing their houses and going on unemployment in record numbers.

These people need to be accomidated by helping them find jobs in the new specialties because we can not become a protectivist economy.

Originally posted by J0HNSmith
You think thats not a drain on the economy? We should take some of that money back from the companies who caused the problem. Maybe if we lived in the 1700's a book on economics in the 1700's would be useful, but we don't and it's not. I think your doomsday prediction is not only absurd but reads like a sci-fi perversion of history.

Uhh GOD FUKING DAMN IT

The Wealth of Nations was written by a GENIUS in the 1700s and it describes nothing of their Imperialist times.

It is the "communist manifesto" to free-market liberals.

It describes TODAY.

Only unlike the Communist Manifesto it PREDICTS today, the communist manifesto's predictions all failed.

Originally posted by FreeMasonUhh GOD FUKING DAMN IT

The Wealth of Nations was written by a GENIUS in the 1700s and it describes nothing of their Imperialist times.

It is the "communist manifesto" to free-market liberals.

It describes TODAY.

Only unlike the Communist Manifesto it PREDICTS today, the communist manifesto's predictions all failed.

You really need to calm down and keep it clean. I strongly disagree with your points and think although the past events will always intertwine with the world of today it does not predict the events of today in the manor that you're suggesting. I also think reducing the trade deficit by adding tariffs to the products these companies (who betrayed the american people) is not going to damm our country or economy. You're a bit over the edge on this one and maybe it would be best to think on it a bit longer before you respond. I assure you the world will not end and the economy will not collapse, hitler will not rise again and a book from the 1700s on economics will not find jobs for the people who lost their house, their retirement plans and their families.

Ugh you just don't get it.

Adding tariffs will say make our goods cheaper and other nation's goods more expensive.

Ok, so let's do that for ALL imported cars.

Well Japan will go into MASSIVE recession.

Mexico will be severely and probably utterly ruined.

And while Japan could probably make it through it, Mexico with its abundance of poverty would doubtlessly errupt into Civil War or Revolution.

Or worse, blame America for their problems and try something stupid.

Tariffs on imported clothing, well there goes a growing source of revenue for Russia, if we added tariffs for software and oil from russia to protect oil industries in Arabia, well Russia would probably be communist in a year.

We can make ourselves great, but at an expense that might cost us wars we don't want to fight. Or wars that ruin our business and thus end up harming our economy more than we protect it.

The Smoot-Holly Acts was a leading factor in the cause of the Great Depression.

By protecting our industry the nations of Europe did not rebuild their economies, we over-produced and suddenly had surplus that meant we no longer needed laborers...instant 25% unemployment.

I agree that this discussion needs to be kept clean.

Although I support outsourcing, I also support making a list of outsourcing companies for consumer information. Two ways I can think of:

(1) Get list of all publicly traded companies and subtract Lou Dobbs's set. The list of all publicly traded American companies is here:

www.nasdaq.com...
(at the near-bottom where it says "Download Security List", get NASDAQ, Amex, and NYSE)

Automating this task would be necessary, but some kind of heuristic/fuzzy search would probably be needed because the companies' names might be slightly different on Lou Dobbs's list from the market listings. Maybe this task could be outsourced to a code monkey in India

Another problem with this approach is the degree of focus -- the companies listed at NASDAQ's site are all companies, including holding companies, resource companies, and others that don't sell products directly to the public. Maybe Lou Dobbs' list won't have the same degree of focus. What is the appropriate degree of focus?

(2) Categorize Lou Dobbs' list (like banking services companies, automobile companies, etc.), and then figure out the missing entries (i.e. the companies from that category that don't outsource)

Both of these, especially (2), would probably need many people involved to work. I am not volunteering right now as I don't feel very passionately about this, though I acknowledge that it is important.

Originally posted by FreeMason
Ugh you just don't get it.

Adding tariffs will say make our goods cheaper and other nation's goods more expensive.

Ok, so let's do that for ALL imported cars.

Well Japan will go into MASSIVE recession.

Mexico will be severely and probably utterly ruined.

And while Japan could probably make it through it, Mexico with its abundance of poverty would doubtlessly errupt into Civil War or Revolution.

Or worse, blame America for their problems and try something stupid.

OK see, you're tossing out the baby with the bath water there. You're taking what I said and distorting it than attacking the distorted version. I DID NOT SAY TO PUT TARIFFS ON OTHER NATIONS GOODS, the tariff list was comparatively very short and specific. I am really sick of repeatedly explaining this to you like are a child. I'm not going to say it again, scroll up and read. If you have a problem understanding what I am saying than maybe this isn't the thread for you and it's a bit over your head. What I am saying will not cause a war and any reasonable person can see that. It will not rune another country or their economy. Please take your misleading and misguided drama somewhere else, you have not addressed any of the issues here, you have made up nonexistent issues and for some reason decided that they were relevant.

Originally posted by FreeMason
Uhh GOD [XXXXXX] DAMN IT

A little less adversarial there counselor. Debate is fine, as are heated emotions...but you're pushing the envelope.

Ugh no you still don't get it. For that reason I have re-created this thread, by introducing a new thread that discusses EXACTLY the concept of "protectionism" versus free trade.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

This thread should actually be closed down, it is 3 pages of fluff with little guidance.

The problem I'm having with you in my discussions is that you say ONE thing but believe you are saying another.

Tariffing any company will always have affect OTHER countries.

I don't know which company you're talking about but let's say...it's a steel processing company.

It gets its Iron ores from some african country and it gets its carbon products from another african country.

I use the african example because simply they have such small economies usually they are dependent entirely upon one company.

We tariff products produced by goods of those companies in other nations, to compensate this company reduces its native labor in those two african nations, and increases foriegn workers to manage a growing "automated" method of extracting what they need.

This in turn causes both nations to explode into civil war and to control their resource rights this company hires mercenaries to fight and advise the side that they want to see maintain control in the regions they are mining and clear-cutting (to produce charcoal and carbon by-products for steel production).

You may think maybe that's rather extreme, but it's not, the causes are different but I just described the Beglian-Congo civil war. It was fought largely by Belgian corporations supporting a side to maintain their rights to minerals in that region.

You may think that tariffing our companies for sending jobs over-seas is a good thing.

But think of this, then when those jobs pull out of those countries to be free of the tariffs, America has its jobs, those countries are left poverty-stricken and fall into revolutions.

The result can be terrorists, genocides, you name it.

And the fact you keep shrugging this off, and shrugging off Adam Smith's predictions in his book "The Wealth of Nations" shows that...you don't really know what you're talking about.

As such again, I urge everyone to go here:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

And ignore this thread which really has no credible discussion since it is completely in the dark about the issue.

instead of worrying about barriers and protectionism, we would be better served to focus on invention, developing new technologies, new products, new services etc. that is what keeps our economic machine going. to dricv that a great place to start would be to lower both taxes and government spending.

when products or services become more economically viable to offshore, thats what we do. why? because if we dont companies from other countries will. our economy is not an economy unto itself. its part of a global economy. that means trading partners as well as competitors.

us consumers buy products often on the basis of price, as do consumers in other countries. it is undeniable that protectionism would raise prices for us consumers and limit choices. there are many of us who could give a hoot if its produced here, in mexico or in china just so its of decent quality and priced right. and we vote too.

now the one thing i dont agree with is the extent to which companies are bending the rules by bringing foreign workers into the us on visas, when those visas were intended for skills/roles that were in short supply or unavailable in the us. it was not intended as a way to permanently import workers into the us that work for below us wages. i would really like to see the government crack down on this even further than they are. in this case it is a 1 for 1 trade off in many cases. if a company wants to use foreign workers thats their business, but then they should move their operation to that country.

If a person follows the Socialist mindset for this country and succeeds in offshoreing the vast majority of jobs and companies(I refer you back to the Thomas Register of "American" businesses). Then what you will have is a empty shell of a Nation devoid of research and development technology people, more and more bedrock manufacturers gone and a lingering mass of of humanity in this country unable to purchase goods and services they need. Do you think the money companies are supposedly going over to save on manufacturing costs and slave wages are going to be offered back to consumers left over here at discounted prices? Certainly those of you for all this madness we havenow can see that as all this proceeds most people will simply not have the revenue to acquire the simple basics they once used to have because they don't have the family income they once enjoyed that came from the high paying jobs that are being shutdown and moved overseas.

This is a direct attack on the citizens of America and if you still believe Socialism is not the enemy there is no hope for you. Try to do this! If your job leaves follow it over to where ever it goes and demand to have it back the way it was before; sorry Charlie!or whoever you are your job is gone forever the lines just get longer and longer for less and less.

i got out of manufacturing and transitioned into a service industry. it pays more too. the theory that you have to workin in manufacturing to make a decent wage is bunk.