Reports: Israeli ships attack aid flotilla

Israel says its soldiers boarded the lead ship in the early hours but were attacked with axes, knives, bars and at least two guns.

"Unfortunately this group were dead-set on confrontation," Israeli government spokesman Mark Regev told the BBC.

"Live fire was used against our forces. They initiated the violence, that's 100% clear," he said.

BBC News

So, this is the official Israeli position on this mess?

Can they prove this to be true? Can they back it up? Or is it just "cheap propaganda"?

Anyhow, this happenned in international waters, how will the UN react?

I am now waiting to see what will come out of the emergency UN meeting pending to happen in the next hour. The ramifications of today's events may change the course of history IMO.

He joined a group that is antithetical to the very existence of Israel. If he was so deluded then he placed himself in harm's way. The sponsoring group is well know as a supporter of hamas.

Originally posted by D.E.M.

Ah Israel, showing its true colors as usual it would seem. I particularly love this little piece here:

Israeli warships stalked a flotilla carrying hundreds of pro-Palestinian activists, including a Nobel laureate and a Holocaust survivor heading for the Gaza Strip on Monday, edging closer to a naval showdown on the high seas.

That's right. The insane neo-fascist regime in control of that country is so out of line that it is willing to risk killing a holocaust survivor to stop this flotilla! Doesn't Israel use the holocaust to justify it's actions?

Really, the comparisons between a certain historical event and Palestine have been growing for a decade, but the irony of this situation has truly reached mammoth proportions now.

For those looking for a giggle:

CNN Int: Ben Wedeman: "It's a little hard to explain why it would be necessary to use this sort of violent measure"

news.yahoo.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

[edit on 30-5-2010 by D.E.M.]

Click here for more information.

reply to post by hey1212


Well its not thought that Turkey has nuclear arms at all. As for the second question Syria would most likely wage all out war while supporting Hezbollah who would be more inclined to stage guerrilla attacks.

I'm not a war mongerer but i have to say its going to a massive conflict if it ever happens. Lets hope it does not.

reply to post by nenothtu


The blockade is illegal according to international law.

reply to post by lucid eyes


Since when can they wire medicine and the likes over the digital highway?

I don't think the aid they were carrying would be billions of dollars, it's more likely to be medicine, clothing, tools, stuff that they actually NEED. Not the money that never ends up where it should anyway.

edit: typos

[edit on 31/5/10 by Romekje]

Originally posted by Dagar
Fact... ships were in INTERNATIONAL waters.

Fact... Forcefully boarding another ship in International waters is an act of piracy

Israeli government defends raids - Trascript

according to international law that question is irrelevant, because if you know your international humanitarian law, the San Remo memorandum states, specifically 67A, that if you have a boat that is charging a blockaded area you are allowed to intercept even prior to it reaching the blockaded area if you've warned them in advance, and that we did a number of times and they had a stated goal which they openly expressed, of breaking the blockade.

International Humanitarian Law - Treaties & Documents

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

SECTION V : NEUTRAL MERCHANT VESSELS AND CIVIL AIRCRAFT

Neutral merchant vessels

67. Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they:

(a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture;
(b) engage in belligerent acts on behalf of the enemy;
(c) act as auxiliaries to the enemy s armed forces;
(d) are incorporated into or assist the enemy s intelligence system;
(e) sail under convoy of enemy warships or military aircraft; or
(f) otherwise make an effective contribution to the enemy s military action, e.g., by carrying military materials, and it is not feasible for the attacking forces to first place passengers and crew in a place of safety. Unless circumstances do not permit, they are to be given a warning, so that they can re-route, off-load, or take other precautions.

Originally posted by jonny2410
reply to post by hey1212

 

Well its not thought that Turkey has nuclear arms at all. As for the second question Syria would most likely wage all out war while supporting Hezbollah who would be more inclined to stage guerrilla attacks.

I'm not a war mongerer but i have to say its going to a massive conflict if it ever happens. Lets hope it does not.

No I'm not looking for war but trying to understand the full picture.

reply to post by Sky watcher

Israel has got nothing but rockets in exchange for land so they will never get anything from Israel again.

And Gaza has learned the word "ceasefire" in Hebrew actually means: "Biding time while our Armed Forces rally to encircle the Strip and then break the ceasefire by bombing relief tunnels."

Just out of curiosity what was Israel offering the Palestinians in the first place?
Other than sheer hell on Earth...

[edit on 31/5/10 by The Godfather of Conspira]

reply to post by MorfeuZ


Whether they can back it up or prove it is irrelevant... They had absolutely NO right to board a ship in international waters. When they did they became pirates, and when they killed those aboard tried to defend themselves/ disarm the attackers... murderers.

They can prove it and back it up all they like... It still boils down to them committing piracy and murder in international waters.

Originally posted by odyseusz
I could say that Palestinian have luck that they don't need to deal with Russian because now we had been talking not about nineteen victims but about six missing ships which disappeared in mysterious condition. lol.

Good point, I thought of the Chechen slaughter earlier, but Israel is I hope held to western standards of humanitarianism, they should choose their bedfellows carefully and behave as such.

Originally posted by Thepreye
When you read this back to yourself do you realise the disgust it evokes in other readers and therefore the harm it does your cause, thanks for revealing yourself lucid eyes.

I'm glad you pointed that one out before it did.

All hear say and what if.

Facts remain the blockade of Gaza is ilegal and Iserail will not even let paper in as aid as if they are dealing with prisoners, which they are.

all this talk about checking for ilegal weapons is BS and people don't attack others with guns without being seriously prevoked.

This has been an act of war against a nato member in internatinal waters and they can spin all they want but facts remain the same and was planned in advance and obama would had given permission to attack the ships.

Does anyone know what happenned to these 6 vessels and it's passengers?

I heard a snip on cnn that a special emergencial "detention camp" was being set up to board the vessel's passengers. Did I hear it correctly? "detention camp"?

I must've heard it wrong. I hope I have.

EDIT: Just heard on cnn that 6 passengers were detained in an Israli prison.


[edit on 31/5/2010 by MorfeuZ]

[edit on 31/5/2010 by MorfeuZ]

Originally posted by Britguy
reply to post by Foppezao

 

Once again, they had no intention of entering Israeli territorial waters.
Their intention was to sail into Gazan waters to deliver the aid, but were hijacked before they got there. Israel is in breach on the UNSCR in blockading those waters, in other words, they are breaking international law!

Gaza has no rights to any waters anymore, They attacked Israel the same week that Israel handed over Gaza to the Pallys. This is war, thats what Hamas wants so thats what they get.

If suspected terrorist are onboard then any nation according to the UN can intercept and inspect the ship. How close would you let a WMD get to your shores?

This is nothing but a hostile act toward Israel from Anti-Semites and the Turkish Government.

Originally posted by makeitso

Originally posted by Dagar
Fact... ships were in INTERNATIONAL waters.

Fact... Forcefully boarding another ship in International waters is an act of piracy

Israeli government defends raids - Trascript

according to international law that question is irrelevant, because if you know your international humanitarian law, the San Remo memorandum states, specifically 67A, that if you have a boat that is charging a blockaded area you are allowed to intercept even prior to it reaching the blockaded area if you've warned them in advance, and that we did a number of times and they had a stated goal which they openly expressed, of breaking the blockade.

International Humanitarian Law - Treaties & Documents

San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

SECTION V : NEUTRAL MERCHANT VESSELS AND CIVIL AIRCRAFT

Neutral merchant vessels

67. Merchant vessels flying the flag of neutral States may not be attacked unless they:

(a) are believed on reasonable grounds to be carrying contraband or breaching a blockade, and after prior warning they intentionally and clearly refuse to stop, or intentionally and clearly resist visit, search or capture;
(b) engage in belligerent acts on behalf of the enemy;
(c) act as auxiliaries to the enemy s armed forces;
(d) are incorporated into or assist the enemy s intelligence system;
(e) sail under convoy of enemy warships or military aircraft; or
(f) otherwise make an effective contribution to the enemy s military action, e.g., by carrying military materials, and it is not feasible for the attacking forces to first place passengers and crew in a place of safety. Unless circumstances do not permit, they are to be given a warning, so that they can re-route, off-load, or take other precautions.

exactly my thought, and since its not too difficult to play the advocate of the devil on this site. They boarded after warning and were attacked and beaten up with knives and steel pipes[the footage is all over the internet], not really unarmed i would say[hell i would unload my clip too if 3 or 4 of them attacked me with knives and so on] ..There's a reason for this blockade people, its called Hamas who make PLO look like boyscouts.
I wonder what would happened if "relief" would make its way towards the Kurds in Turkey, this Erdogan should be really careful with choosing his words and actions... since they didn't acknlowedge the Armenian genocide those Turkish demolishing these embassies all over the world [here in Holland they already clashed with police] need to think who are they to judge about them...

[edit on 31-5-2010 by Foppezao]

A Jewish conservative talk radio host in Phoenix is saying that the commandos only had paint ball guns. He adds that only after they were attacked by armed occupants of the aid flotilla did they manage to wrest guns away from them and return fire. I do not believe this for one minute.

Yet more sadness graces the ATS boards.



Regards to all

To mods: Please don't close this thread; to users: please do not discuss who is "right or wrong". First let us try to gather all the information, then try to grasp the facts and non-facts and try to comment on such information we have at our hands. I know it is very difficult because it is a very sensitive issue, but consider me, thousands are protesting right now on the next street.
Let us share our opinions and informations.
Latest news i have is that chief of general stuff of israel himself telephoned chief of turkish general stuff and discussed the situation. Both side try to stay saway from a posibble war i think, but on turkish televisions, most of the retired general say this was a "war cause". I am little bit worried...

reply to post by Sky watcher

5 of 6 got inspected with no problem. Its obvious that the 6th TURKISH ship had terrorist on board

If that's true (which it isn't but I'll pretend to stick my head in the sand for a second), why would the Israeli Navy detain all 6 six ships when 5 of them cleared inspection?

You don't tug foreign boats back to ports and place them under confinement without probable cause.

You're going to tell me all six of them we're really packed to the gills with missiles and rockets?

I think even Hezbollah would know how to defend a ship better than with some hatchets and pipes.
Particularly if it were really carrying precious "deadly cargo" for the Hamas war effort.

Even Israel has signed & ratified the United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, which prohibits foreign governments from impounding vessels of other governments within their territorial waters (the most that is afforded is mooring the vessel off-shore in Int. Waters).

[edit on 31/5/10 by The Godfather of Conspira]

reply to post by Dagar


Couldn't agree with you more. Israel won't be able to wiggle out of this one