Solution: Eliminate all taxes / allow unlimited govt spending

The fascists already won dude. We're living in the Brave New World headed for 1984.

The only solution is collapse and reset. The former means war and the latter is perhaps beyond the means of the average American to do correctly.

I knew the country was dead with the chant "Oba-ma, Oba-ma."

I'll take care of myself and my family and hope the rest of the country gets an effing clue ASAP. Not holding my breath though.

Did you see what Kim Kardashian did?

Originally posted by tetrahedron

The only solution is collapse and reset.

To return to the correct course you may be right.

All vision has been lost.

On a more positive note: My wife took it upon her own inititive to purchase an American flag (MADE IN AMERICA, I might add, even though it cost more than the other ones) to hang upon our house, just in time for memorial day.



[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

reply to post by Freedom or Death


LOL,now I know you are being sarcastic. Good one.

Well I see or COLLECTIVE future as going something like this. We will get taxed for healtcare, carbon emissions, and illegals will get amnesty while they still let them pour though the border. They will institute a VAT tax, which will cause the price of food and everythng else we need to live to increase drastically. Also, its a nice tricky way of taxing food without telling you that they are.

Most people are living on the edge financially now. The increase in taxes and expenses related to these new regulations will cause the economy to collapse. Foreclosures will increase drastcally, when people use there mortgage money just to eat and keep the house warm in the winter and by gas to go to work, if they have a job left.

The masses will become more and more dependent on government. Our government will then use parts of this tax money to help subsidze our COLLECTIVE friends in poorer countries with the hopes that we can all be equally poor and they will have control over everyone, for our own good of course.

The strange thing they dont seem to get is that we have thrown tons of money at these poor countries yet they are still poor. This is because they are poor because their leaders are corrupt and syphon the money off before the people get it. No amount of money will make a poor country better, it just makes the corrupt richer.

But really there isn't much you can do when your leaders suffer from the delusions that are known as progressivism. I guess we just have to wait until the next elections. Hopefully, there will be enough people with the good sense to say SCREW THE COLLECTIVE.

reply to post by sporkmonster


If America is going to stop being the world's police and do other things you mentioned, that would lead to a cut in government spending...correct?

In particular, if America is going to stop being the world's police force, this would lead to cuts in defense spending...correct?

There is nothing racist per se about calling for cuts in government spending.

Think of what it would take to actually reign in the fed.

It'd have to be like the Pope moving against the Templars.

Or else they'd collapse the economy.

reply to post by Freedom or Death


Abundance thinking is what got us into trouble. Abundance thinking is when the people and the government say, "let's go ahead and buy it...we will just put it on the card."


Fiscal responsibility, both on the personal level and at the government level, involves spending within your means. One way to be responsible is to curb your spending so it fits within your means. This is what you may call scarcity thinking.

Perhaps we may both agree that another way to be responsible is to increase our means so our spending can fit within our means. This would involve the government increasing the revenue it takes in. This could be accomplished by raising taxes, although it is possible that decreasing some taxes could, under the right circumstances, lead to an overall increase in revenues.

For example, many economists say if the US corporate tax rate were decreased, this would lead to increased investment in the US. This would in turn lead to more jobs and more income tax revenues, with the income tax revenues more than offsetting lost corporate tax revenues.

A third approach to responsibility, would involve a combination of cutting spending and increasing revenue.

Originally posted by tetrahedron

If you gave every US citizen one million dollars (we're all rich now!) the purchasing power of $1 ml would be greatly reduced.

The value of a $ (in theory) is based on the supply of available dollars and the demand for dollar denominated assets. Thus, if you increase the supply of dollars dramatically without any other variables in the economy changing, the cost of things rise in proportion to the money supply increase (so we're not actually rich).

The value of the dollar is based upon whatever we think has value.

Why must the value of the dollar be tied to (shiney rocks and gooey liquids) gold or oil?

Why can it not be based upon a diversified hand basket of items?

i.e. - Diamonds
- KW of produced power (Weighted towards clean power)
- Efficiency of Information and Power distribution networks
- Volume of clean drinking water in stoarge
- Number of star systems researched
- Natural purity of the air that we breathe
- Number of Physicians and Scientists educated
- Percentage of Americans that think they are free
- Number of space ships capable of exploring distant planets and star systems designed and built.
Etc

The list could be long and diverse to incorporate all kinds of things



[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

reply to post by Freedom or Death


LOL, that is classic.

Heck we could even value the dollar on things like:
Number and quality on Pop Art paintings by Andy Warhol.
How many celebreties with nice butts we have vs the rest of the world.
How many Happy Meal toys our kids have.
Variety of womens shoes.
Variety of purses over $200.

Also, the value of the dollar could double if Lady Gaga is actually proved to be a woman as opposed to a tranny.


[edit on 30-5-2010 by Three Legs]

Originally posted by tetrahedron

There's no such thing as free health care (free energy however, or zero point, well that's a different story).

You see a doctor. With that doctor comes a nurse, an orderly, a pharmacist, a janitor, an IT guy, etc. All those people get paid, or you no longer have a healthcare system.

Why must they work such long hours?

Why can they not work less, enjoy more recreation time and be under less stress to pay thier bills if the basics are provided for them?

i.e. - Forgiveness of medical school training
- Clean water
- Clean food
- Clean air
- Abundant energy


[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

reply to post by Freedom or Death


I hear ya brother. Really why should Doctors and nurses work at all when the basics are provided. I think we are all suckers for working, when we live in a country that wll provide us with food, shelter, etc for not working but then punish us with taxes for working. I feel like Homer Simpson, when he realised while riding in a wheelchair that he had been a sucker for walking all those years.

Originally posted by Three Legs

I think we are all suckers for working ...

What is it that we are working for right now?

The right to pay more taxes?

The right to have more rules and regulations implemented upon us?

The right to work more for less?

The right to not be listened to?

The right to accumulate more worthless pieces of paper?

The right to be extorted and blackmailed?

The right for dummies and idiots to be in charge of our future?

[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

reply to post by Freedom or Death


Yeah that pretty much sums it up. I mean really working people are probably seen as evil doers by the Obama admin. They always talk about the evil CEO's in this country.

Obama probably views working people as people who take from the poor because we make more money than they do.

I am pretty sure if I were to start any sort of business it would not be in the USA where the government sees you as some sort of disease to be quarantined. China would be much more friendly.

[edit on 30-5-2010 by Three Legs]

Originally posted by ararisq

It sounds a bit like the woman on illegal immigration that was on the Savage show the other day. ".. because they are all Americans too...and have rights, and there are no borders..."

She was on welfare if you remember correctly, I'm not.

Why should I not have a say in how my taxes are spent?

Why should anyone be forced to pay taxes at all?

America has essentially become ungovernable and visonless, all worshipping greed and stupidity as thier god.

Everyone attempting to cling onto a dieing system.

Why are you against the premis of my argument that all tax collection should cease and the government should spend whatever they deem neccessary?

[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
reply to post by sporkmonster

 

If America is going to stop being the world's police and do other things you mentioned, that would lead to a cut in government spending...correct?

In particular, if America is going to stop being the world's police force, this would lead to cuts in defense spending...correct?

Why must defense spending be cut?

If the government is alloweded to spend whatever they want, then they can actually increase defense spending and it won't be an issue.

We can manufacture and drop better more efficient bombs and then tend to the wounded and rebuild thier country.

Aren't we doing this anyways?

Haven't we always done so?

[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
reply to post by Freedom or Death

 

Abundance thinking is what got us into trouble. Abundance thinking is when the people and the government say, "let's go ahead and buy it...we will just put it on the card."

True abundance thinking is acknowleding that we don't need a card or credit limit.

Free energy is the solution.

Who created the 40 hour work week paridigm that we have all built our lives around anyways?

Free energy could lead us to a 20 hour work week.

reply to post by Freedom or Death


If the government spends whatever it wants, without collecting revenues to offset the spending, the deficit increases.

If the deficit increases to uncontrollable levels, all hell will break loose. The government will have no money to spend on vital programs because its entire budget will have to go towards paying interest on the debt. It will not be able to go into more debt because in order to have a debt, there has to be another party present to loan the government money. No party will loan the US government money if its debts are too high. If the US' debt is too high, it will also have to pay high interest rates just as somebody with bad credit has to pay higher rates on loans. This in turn puts strain on the investment sector as private investment will be forced to compete against the government.

The government could, as you suggest, just print more money. This would however, lead to out of control inflation.

The sensible thing is for the US government to be fiscally responsible. This can be accomplished by decreasing spending and/or increasing revenues.

Originally posted by hotpinkurinalmint
reply to post by Freedom or Death

 

If the government spends whatever it wants, without collecting revenues to offset the spending, the deficit increases.

If the deficit increases to uncontrollable levels, all hell will break loose. The government will have no money to spend on vital programs because its entire budget will have to go towards paying interest on the debt. It will not be able to go into more debt because in order to have a debt, there has to be another party present to loan the government money.

No party will loan the US government money if its debts are too high. If the US' debt is too high, it will also have to pay high interest rates just as somebody with bad credit has to pay higher rates on loans. This in turn puts strain on the investment sector as private investment will be forced to compete against the government.

The government could, as you suggest, just print more money. This would however, lead to out of control inflation.

The sensible thing is for the US government to be fiscally responsible. This can be accomplished by decreasing spending and/or increasing revenues.

I really don't understand.

Why must America be forced to be the worlds slave state?

Why must America work more and achieve less?

Ever since the Bretton Woods agreement after WWII, europe has had it easy.

The IMF is just a money shell game that allows for one state to create immaginary wealth by purchasing the imaginary debt of another country.

The sensible thing to do would be to base the value of the dollar on something more innovative (Diversified handbasket of different infinite expanding, worthwhile ideals, goals and materials) like I stated earlier in this thread, instead of finite depletable resouces like gold or oil.

[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

You know in Canada the vast majority of fire fighters are volunteers, they get paged at 3:00 AM drive their ass down to the fire dept in their own vehicle, go fight the fire risking their lives and get paid absolutely nothing for their efforts.
And you have to apply for this position...most get rejected.

-All politicians should be volunteers.
-All civil servants should receive minimum wage.
-No welfare for anyone unless you prove you are disabled to the point you can't even answer a phone for a call center...no free money.
-10% income tax for ALL...you make a million per year, you pay 100k in taxes.
-No tax shelters, you want to leave the country...go ahead we don't want you.
-Let anyone in trouble fail...or they'll never learn.
-Prisons should be growing are food.
-University and college tuitions should be cut by 75%...If professors don't like it, go work in another country...good luck with that.
-unions should be a thing of the past...they are killing us.
-People should be paid what they produce, you produce nothing you don't eat...and i don't mean producing illusionary profits at a big bank or corp, i mean physically producing something meaningful and useful.
-Interest on ANY loan (car, mortgage, cc) should be .05% or lower, anything above would be considered usury...punishable by hanging.

Originally posted by helltick

-All politicians should be volunteers.

-All civil servants should receive minimum wage.

-No welfare for anyone unless you prove you are disabled to the point you can't even answer a phone for a call center...no free money.

-10% income tax for ALL...you make a million per year, you pay 100k in taxes.

-No tax shelters, you want to leave the country...go ahead we don't want you.

-Let anyone in trouble fail...or they'll never learn.

-Prisons should be growing are food.

-University and college tuitions should be cut by 75%...If professors don't like it, go work in another country...good luck with that.

-unions should be a thing of the past...they are killing us.

-People should be paid what they produce, you produce nothing you don't eat...and i don't mean producing illusionary profits at a big bank or corp, i mean physically producing something meaningful and useful.

-Interest on ANY loan (car, mortgage, cc) should be .05% or lower, anything above would be considered usury...punishable by hanging.

At last a believer.

Welcome good sir.

I hope your faith in the depression holds out until all objectives are achieved.

Free energy, clean water, clean air and reasonable basic medical care for all I might add.

We should all be working towards the 20 hour work week.


[edit on 30-5-2010 by Freedom or Death]

You should know I don't want a depression, but i think it's inevitable.
The govt should be 1/10 the size it is...we should atleast try to trim the fat.
Rules, regulation, bureaucracy, red tape...that in my mind should be common sense.

There was a time when common sense prevailed...you didn't need some dick head down at city hall telling you right from wrong, treating you like a child, making 80k per year.

-Free energy for sure...look at geothermal heating and cooling.
-clean water..you can piss in a pot and get fresh drinking water through distillation.
-Big oil wants our business, than they can build and maintain our roads at their expense.
-35% taxation to anyone keeping\hiding money in offshore accounts.
-35% taxation to anyone leaving the country with their fortunes.