How many have read FEMA photographer Kurt Sonnenfeld's account of 9/11?

Originally posted by GoldenFleece
Yeah, you professional debunkers don't have a vested interest, do you? Which is why you spend your lives on ONE forum -- spinning lies and deceit and attacking anyone who tries to tell the truth.

I invite anyone to check it out for themselves:

Trickofthe Shade

iamcpc

Soloist

GoodOlDave

Despicable.

Sorry, but these juvenile antics aren't working for you anymore. I invite you (or anyone else for that matter) to explain why anythign I post here is incorrect, and here you are, with this golden opportunity to prove I'm a liar, and what do you do? You yell, "it's all a pack of lies" before running away giggling. I don't need to tell you this isn't the hallmark of someone genuinely interested in finding the truth behind the events of 9/11, do I?

Joel Meyerowitz was a photographer who published the photos he took of ground zero and unlike your videographer who only has his word to rely on, Meyerowitz' work is easily obtainable, and the things he records directly show your "videographer who said he saw suspicious things at ground zero" to be nothing but unsubstanciated rubbish. You really have to want to believe in these ridiculous conspiracy stories to take the word of someone who can't produce even a microbe of proof to back his claims up over someone who shows his photos to anyone who wants to see them. If you don't appreciate that we're constantly pointing out that you conspiracy people are posting paranoid nonsense like this, then stop posting paranoid nonsense. It ain't a trick question.

BTW this infatuation you have with us and our posting habits is kinda creepy, dude.

Now that I have responded to each of your claims I can voice my opinion.

The truther movement has a lot of expert and eyewitness testimony and evidence to support its many different theories.

Then people like you come to these forums and you really do a disgrace to the truther movement. Your name is liebuster but you come here spouting a lot of things that, according to my sources, are lies (Mobile phones don't work too well on planes). If you have never been on a plane I'll buy you the ticket. We can call each other and call our friends and families mid flight with no reception problems. Then you go back to the sources that are spoon feeding you inaccurate information and tell them that the truther movement will never achieve it's goals as long as disnformation pollute the waters.

I suggest you get with one of the well researched truthers on this website who can point you in the direction of the most accurate truther sources. The biggest are richard gage and steven jones. An architecht and a professor who have both started websites supported two seperate truther theories. Richard gage supports the demolition via explosives theories and steven jones supports the thermite/thermate demolition theories.

"I invite you (or anyone else for that matter) to explain why anythign I post here is incorrect"

Here's one: your spelling of the word "anything" is incorrect.

"BTW this infatuation you have with us and our posting habits is kinda creepy, dude."

Not as creepy as some people's infatuation with supporting one massive BS story after another.

"I notice that Meyerowitz didn't murder his wife, and as a result, he's not on the lamb and his photos haven't "suspiciously gone missing" and are freely available to anyone who wants them."

Although you have already judged Mr. Sonnenfeld as a murderer, last time I checked he has not been tried and convicted of murdering his wife. Seeing that you are not much of a supporter of due process of law, your stance on 9/11 is predictable, to say the least.

And here's a book you can buy from Mr. Meyerowitz the photographer called:

"Aftermath: World Trade Center Archive"

www.amazon.com...=1-1/qid=1172615522/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/103-8123359-3952613?ie=UTF8&s=books

Isn't it interesting how some people have a huge problem with truthers making money from 9/11, but when it comes to Official Story supporters exploiting and making money from 9/11, they do not say a word? But then again, this hypocritical train of thought is consistent and expected from the OS believers.

Next time I read another post from you criticizing truthers for profiting from 9/11, I will remember the words of praise you have for Mr. Meyerowitz, someone who is shamelessly profiting from 9/11.

Originally posted by SphinxMontreal
Isn't it interesting how some people have a huge problem with truthers making money from 9/11, but when it comes to Official Story supporters exploiting and making money from 9/11, they do not say a word? But then again, this hypocritical train of thought is consistent and expected from the OS believers.

There is no hypocracy here becuase a) he's not manipulating and distorting his material to get you to believe what he wants you to believe, like the conspiracy theorists are doing. He simply shows the photos and says, "here they are", and b) unlike the work of the conspiracy people which is 100% material they scour off the internet, Meyerowitz' work is entirely his own production. What you see in the photos is what he himself created. Not to mention c) there's a huge difference between wanting to share the story of a woman operating a steam shovel who covered the remains of a WTC victim with her bucket until they found a flag to cover the remains in, and a bunch of college kids making internet videos in their dorm room wanting to get everyone all paranoid over the gov't being out to murder us all.

This is neither here nor there, as you just shot yourself in the foot with letting people know of Meyerowitz' work. His photos show the cleanup process in stunning clarity and NONE of the wreckage shows any such evidence of controlled demolitions. If the only thing you're getting out of Meyerowitz' work is that he's publishing his photos, then you shouldn't be complainign when I say you have an ulterior agenda to get people all paranoid over shadows, rather than any desire to learn the truth behind the 9/11 attack.

Originally posted by GoldenFleece
As far as you know. Conveniently forgot about the guys who found the black boxes, didn't you?

No. I said he's the only one to make these kind of claims - ie claims about the condition of the buildings, the metalwork and so on. And as you're dishonestly managing to ignore, he didn't make any of those claims at the time. They've suddenly surfaced as he fights extradition to face a murder trial. How convenient.

As for Bellone and DeMasi, I don't trust them. They're crooks.

Yeah, you professional debunkers don't have a vested interest, do you?

I've never hidden the fact that I'm employed by the US government to debunk claims on conspiracy websites. I just passed GenRadek by the watercooler and we had a chat about the Yankees.

[edit on 20-5-2010 by TrickoftheShade]

Originally posted by SphinxMontreal

last time I checked he has not been tried and convicted of murdering his wife.

Yeah. Because he's hiding in Argentina and cooking up a load of nonsense to try to stay there.

Answer me two questions.

Why do you think Sonnenfeld only started making his claims about his photos and videos a long time after 9/11 and when he was re-indicted for the murder of his wife?

Why has Sonnenfeld not released his videos?

Looks like the professional debunkers have jumped all over this thread with their lies and BS, continuing to call Sonnenfeld a murderer even after he was completely acquitted, even after it was proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that his wife left a suicide note, had an extensive journal of suicidal writings and had a family history of suicide. How despicable.

Looks like the government (and their agents) realized he knew too much, had damning evidence and had to be neutralized. Typical.

Originally posted by iamcpc
Your name is liebuster but you come here spouting a lot of things that, according to my sources, are lies (Mobile phones don't work too well on planes). If you have never been on a plane I'll buy you the ticket. We can call each other and call our friends and families mid flight with no reception problems. Then you go back to the sources that are spoon feeding you inaccurate information and tell them that the truther movement will never achieve it's goals as long as disnformation pollute the waters.

Talk about lies and disinformation. Have you EVER tried this? I have, many times, from many different planes and many different cities. The signal ALWAYS fades between 3-5,000 feet, after a couple minutes of flight. If I can, I watch the seat back flight monitors so I know the exact altitude the signal cuts out.

I challenge ANYONE to try making a cell phone call above 5,000 feet. Go ahead iamcpc, don't rattle on about "your sources". Try it for yourself. I dare you.

Be sure to report back now, OK?

Originally posted by GoldenFleece
Looks like the professional debunkers have jumped all over this thread with their lies and BS, continuing to call Sonnenfeld a murderer even after he was completely acquitted, even after it was proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that his wife left a suicide note, had an extensive journal of suicidal writings and had a family history of suicide. How despicable.

He was acquitted, but then re-indicted. At that point he began talking about 9/11.

Interesting that he had all this dynamite information but didn't begin discussing it until several years later. Do you think he bears some responsibility for not helping the Truth Movement as soon as he could? Why was he keeping knowledge of the murder of thousands out of the public eye?

Not a rhetorical question, btw.

Looks like the government (and their agents) realized he knew too much, had damning evidence and had to be neutralized. Typical.

So they thought he "knew too much", despite the fact that he hadn't even mentioned 9/11 or an "inside job" when they reopened the case?

reply to post by TrickoftheShade

Acquitted, but re-indicted? You're full of it. Guess you've never heard of double jeopardy.

That's quite the novel defense for a murder rap: "9/11 was an inside job!"

Why don't you explain again why firefighters/rescue workers found the black boxes in the WTC rubble, but the government claims they were never recovered? But this time, do it without lying by claiming the workers weren't sure what they recovered.

What do you think were on those black boxes that the government doesn't anyone to know about? Maybe that the jets were remote controlled?

Originally posted by GoldenFleece
Acquitted, but re-indicted? You're full of it. Guess you've never heard of double jeopardy.

You think I'm making this up? You're wrong. Sonnenfeld was rearrested in 2004 having been acquitted in 2002. He didn't mention 9/11 until after this second arrest. It's a transparent attempt to escape extradition, and you have to be pretty gullible not to see it.

That's quite the novel defense for a murder rap: "9/11 was an inside job!"

It's a defence against extradition, not the murder charge itself. Are you sure you understand the details of this case? You seem quite ill informed.


I'll answer your other questions after you explain why Sonnenfeld is a trustworthy source, and why he kept his apparently shocking evidence quiet until he needed it to attempt to avoid returning to answer his case. You could also explain why he is still keeping his tapes secret.

Originally posted by TrickoftheShade

Originally posted by GoldenFleece

It always amuses me when the debunkers accuse authors and researchers of trying to get rich off the 9/11 truth movement.

It always amuses me how you guys stumble over yourselves to trust these people.

It amuses me that people like you believe the official story so willingly, when there are so many things wrong with it.

This is the problem, people like yourself are sucked in by everything the media tells them, everything the government tells them, and never question anything they say, no matter how ridiculous their stories are.

But you'll happily mock people that do scrutinise these stories, people who do thoroughly investigate what is going on. This is why they get away with all the things they do, there are too many folk that cannot see what is really going on!

reply to post by thegameisup


You picked up a two-year-old thread in order to write a content-free ad hominem attack? And at the same time to big up your own incredible powers of enquiry?

Look, you may think you are the most fair-minded individual to ever live, and that you have a unique insight into something called the "OS". Trust me, you're wrong.

Partly this is because you're biased. And partly it's because you're making a repeated category error by creating something called an "OS" and then ranging everybody on one side or the other. Certainly I don't think the things you ascribe to me, and I don't accept the government's full take on 9/11. Perhaps you could bother to acknowledge that, given your vast fair mindedness and ability to deal with evidence?

Since you've returned to this thread, have a look at the exchanges above. Do you notice how Golden Fleece is unable to answer my questions, but just responds with a general insult and innuendo? Is that really redolent of someone who is thinking this through properly and considering every fact and angle?