Young Aussie genius whipping NASA in Moon Hoax Debate!

reply to post by FoosM

Think about it, you are on the moon, a once in a lifetime experience and opportunity.
The Earth is above you and you only take two photos of it ?
You would risk such a chance with only two photos?
You wouldn't you at least bracket the shots?

They had a whole week to do nothing but take pictures of Earth: For example. Is that enough Earth photography for you? Because the Earth was nearly directly overhead on most of the missions, you wouldn't be able to get the Earth and the moonscape in the same shot. I'm not sure why you think taking the photos involved any risk, but the fact they they took two photos in rapid succession suggests that they were bracketing.

And what setting would allow both the Earth and LM to be in focus?

Uh... you think maybe "infinity" would do the trick? It works just fine on Earth.

reply to post by CHRLZ

By the way, as for your '10x' bigger comment, UNLESS you are specifically talking about area and mention that fact, LINEAR ratios are always used in relation to enlargement. Maybe YOU need to become a little familiar with the topics, or do a little research:

No CHRLZ, I'm talking common sense..
Yes the Earth is roughly 4 times wider but it is also 4 times taller..

So tell me then..How many times bigger would you say it is???

reply to post by backinblack

So tell me then..How many times bigger would you say it is???

Personally, I'd opt to let the Moon's radius = 1, in which case the Earth would appear to be (Pi)4^2 times larger than the Moon does. Let's call it 16 times bigger.

Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by CHRLZ

 

By the way, as for your '10x' bigger comment, UNLESS you are specifically talking about area and mention that fact, LINEAR ratios are always used in relation to enlargement. Maybe YOU need to become a little familiar with the topics, or do a little research:

No CHRLZ, I'm talking common sense..
Yes the Earth is roughly 4 times wider but it is also 4 times taller..

So tell me then..How many times bigger would you say it is???

A little under 4 times. ~4X. Just as magnification is rated LINEARLY. Just as every zoom lens is rated LINEARLY (eg a 10x zoom lens), Just as every single reference to 'magnification' or 'enlargement' is stated. LINEARLY. Just as you would work it out - you are looking at an insect 1cm long, how big will it be if you add a 3x magnifying lens? Will your answer be in square cm's, or cubic cm's? NO. Of course it won't be, unless you are talking about widening a pipe and calculating the throughput, or working out the capacity or weight of something. When you are LOOKING at the object and comparing sizes, that is always stated LINEARLY. Ask ANY photographer, scientist, cartographer, illustrator, architect...

You really haven't spent any time whatsoever with people like those, or topics like these, have you?
And there's no shame in that. The shame comes when you try to portray your 'knowledge' as fact, and criticise others who are in fact using the exactly correct terms and methodologies.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by backinblack

 

So tell me then..How many times bigger would you say it is???

Personally, I'd opt to let the Moon's radius = 1, in which case the Earth would appear to be (Pi)4^2 times larger than the Moon does. Let's call it 16 times bigger.

edit on 23-2-2011 by DJW001 because: (no reason given)

Thank you DJW...

reply to post by CHRLZ

You really haven't spent any time whatsoever with people like those, or topics like these, have you?
And there's no shame in that. The shame comes when you try to portray your 'knowledge' as fact, and criticise others who are in fact using the exactly correct terms and methodologies.

So if I have 2 objects..
The first is 1cm X 1cm..
The second is 1cm X 4cm..

How many times bigger is the second in relation to the first CHRLZ??

reply to post by backinblack


In fairness, however, it would only be four times wider, which is what CHARLZ is talking about. The Moon appears to be about 1/2 degree wide from the Earth, the Earth is about 2 degrees wide from the Moon. It covers sixteen times the area, though, and reflects something like forty times the Sun's light. (Much higher albedo.) This is why there is so much blue "fill light" in some shadowed areas of the photographs.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by backinblack

 

In fairness, however, it would only be four times wider, which is what CHARLZ is talking about. The Moon appears to be about 1/2 degree wide from the Earth, the Earth is about 2 degrees wide from the Moon. It covers sixteen times the area, though, and reflects something like forty times the Sun's light. (Much higher albedo.) This is why there is so much blue "fill light" in some shadowed areas of the photographs.

Yep I know all that..
It just does look so much bigger in the shots from the LM while in moon orbit..
You know, the earth rise shots..

The very few pics taken while on the moon show nothing like that size..
I don't for a second think they are fake pics as I don't think NASA would be that stupid..
But some good, large earth pics would have been nice..

Now someone like ww will jump up and down telling me they didn't go there just to please me..

reply to post by backinblack

The very few pics taken while on the moon show nothing like that size..

Yes, they do....IF you understood the optics.

Using the same camera/lens focal length, and photographing the Moon from Earth....then you'd see an apples to apples comparison.

Originally posted by DJW001
reply to post by FoosM

 

Think about it, you are on the moon, a once in a lifetime experience and opportunity.
The Earth is above you and you only take two photos of it ?
You would risk such a chance with only two photos?
You wouldn't you at least bracket the shots?

They had a whole week to do nothing but take pictures of Earth: For example.
Is that enough Earth photography for you?

You mean from orbit.
Thats still different than from another planet.
Has another sense of meaning.

Say, did any of the astronauts even make any comments about seeing their home world from the moon?

I'm not sure why you think taking the photos involved any risk, but the fact they they took two photos in rapid succession suggests that they were bracketing.

You see a change in exposure in those two photos?
I sure didnt notice any.
And doesn't bracketing usually comes in three shots?
But yeah, it appears that photography on the moon is so easy.
Gee, how wonder how many photos you make without looking through
viewfinders and double checking your settings.

And what setting would allow both the Earth and LM to be in focus?

Uh... you think maybe "infinity" would do the trick? It works just fine on Earth.

You tell me. Is that all they had to do?
Is that what the photo shows?

reply to post by weedwhacker


Nothing visual like this.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c49fc47035be.jpg[/atsimg]

That's what I mean..

Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by weedwhacker

 

Nothing visual like this.
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/c49fc47035be.jpg[/atsimg]

That's what I mean..

Is that a full frame image or a cropped image, if its cropped the earth will look bigger in relation to the picture size.

reply to post by wmd_2008

Is that a full frame image or a cropped image, if its cropped the earth will look bigger in relation to the picture size.

Not really sure but it's appolo 8..
I'll have a look at the original..

reply to post by wmd_2008


I think its this one and if there's any cropping it is minimal..

AS08-14-2383

reply to post by FoosM


>sigh<

Say, did any of the astronauts even make any comments about seeing their home world from the moon?

You do so much "research", but......?

'I put up my thumb and it blotted out the planet Earth'.
Neil Armstrong

'It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small'.
Neil Armstrong


Read more: www.brainyquote.com...

'The Earth reminded us of a Christmas tree ornament hanging in the blackness of space. As we got farther and farther away it diminished in size. Finally it shrank to the size of a marble, the most beautiful marble you can imagine. That beautiful, warm, living object looked so fragile, so delicate, that if you touched it with a finger it would crumble and fall apart. Seeing this has to change a man, has to make a man appreciate the creation of God and the love of God'.
- James Irwin, USA

Yuck! He had to throw "god" into it?!? Oh, well.....guess he "faked" all of that emotion, too?
And Irwin's quote counts....view of Earth from the surface, or orbit, of the Moon is the same relative size.

'Suddenly, from behind the rim of the moon, in long, slow-motion moments of immense majesty, there emerges a sparkling blue and white jewel, a light, delicate sky-blue sphere laced with slowly swirling veils of white, rising gradually like a small pearl in a thick sea of black mystery. It takes more than a moment to fully realize this is Earth . . . home'.
- Edgar Mitchell, USA

www.solarviews.com...

Originally posted by weedwhacker
reply to post by FoosM

 

>sigh<

Say, did any of the astronauts even make any comments about seeing their home world from the moon?

You do so much "research", but......?

'I put up my thumb and it blotted out the planet Earth'.
Neil Armstrong

'It suddenly struck me that that tiny pea, pretty and blue, was the Earth. I put up my thumb and shut one eye, and my thumb blotted out the planet Earth. I didn't feel like a giant. I felt very, very small'.
Neil Armstrong


Read more: www.brainyquote.com...

Thanks Weed, but did you notice those were recollections that you posted? Recollections that can be rehearsed, by the way.

Im more looking for, "Wow, Buzz, can you see that? Earth! Its right up there! Houston, Im going to try to take some photos of you guys, but its going to be hard with the tears that are swelling in my eyes... LOL (ok, I admit, LOL woudn't have been used)"

Anyway, from the statements you did provide I couldnt help but notice the words used to describe the size of our big blue planet:

tiny pea
the size of a marble
small pearl

Now, I can understand that the planet would be smaller from the moon.
But, in relation to have always seen a the small moon from Earth, seeing a larger object like the Earth from the moon should not have gone unnoticed.

These comes from NASA:

(February 22nd, 1990) – A model of a baseline lunar surface roving vehicle and accompanying astronauts on Extravehicular Activity (EVA). Part of the scene utilizes actual imagery. This view, as part of a study by the Johnson Space Center’s Lunar and Mars Exploration Office does not depict existing or currently budgeted hardware.

This one not, but its cool:


At any rate, one gets the distinct feeling like the Earth would not be the size of a pea, marble, or pearl.
Or that it would take more than a thumb to blot it out of the sky... more like a fist.


spacegizmo.livingdazed.com...

reply to post by FoosM




Obviously someone forgot to tell them they couldn't see stars..

Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

I think its this one and if there's any cropping it is minimal..

AS08-14-2383

That photo was taken with the 250mm lens, which has a field of view of about 13 degrees. The earth would appear about 2.05 degrees across, so you should be able to fit roughly 6.5 earths across that picture. And that's exactly what we find:



The images from the surface on Apollo 11 were taken with a 60mm lens with a field of view of about 53 degrees. So about 25.5 earths should fit across the picture. Again, things line up pretty well, within .5 earths:

reply to post by FoosM

At any rate, one gets the distinct feeling like the Earth would not be the size of a pea, marble, or pearl.
Or that it would take more than a thumb to blot it out of the sky... more like a fist.

Pay attention, FoosM! Just three or four posts ago I pointed out that the Earth as seen from the Moon is about 2 degrees wide. How wide is your fist when your arm is outstretched? I leave it to you to look up for yourself, as it could save your life if you're lost in the wilderness. (How to estimate time remaining until sunset.)

As for the rest of your post, it is all imagination; either you imagining what you would say and do if you were on the Moon, or pictures that are the product of artistic imagination.

Originally posted by nataylor

Originally posted by backinblack
reply to post by wmd_2008

 

I think its this one and if there's any cropping it is minimal..

AS08-14-2383

That photo was taken with the 250mm lens, which has a field of view of about 13 degrees. The earth would appear about 2.05 degrees across, so you should be able to fit roughly 6.5 earths across that picture. And that's exactly what we find:

So what you are saying is that if the astronauts on the moon had used a 250mm lens, then the Earth would have appeared larger in the photos?