All Roads Lead to Rome

soooo basicly your saying earth day is a ruse to indoctrinate people to unify under a one world government that was planned out over 2 thousand years ago in ancient rome?

Originally posted by Ong Bak
soooo basicly your saying earth day is a ruse to indoctrinate people to unify under a one world government that was planned out over 2 thousand years ago in ancient rome?

Well I suppose that's one way of looking at it.

If you brought me a shiney Apple, I will mark your quizz an A????

reply to post by jackflap


This is some really great info jackflap.

The Sun Dial, which is found in the center of the Vatican reflecting the cross of the zodiac and centered by the phallus of Osiris (obelisk), is a straight up message that the created religion of Christianity is a reflection of the worship of the Sun (Son).

The worship of the Sun is the original religion, or so I have read.

It makes sense to me that this would be the case.

A more primitive or neolithic man would of course see the Sun (Horus, Son) as the giving God of life, and the night (Set, Satan), as the punishing God of suffering.

And of course the created religion at the council at Nicaea that made Jesus a demi-God (Son, Sun), would be reflected in this belief.
This is supposedly the entire goal of the Mystery Religions of Babylon, but this is mostly speculation on my part.

I will say that it is speculation based upon the literal tons and tons of world religions that all seem to copy one another.
And all worship the Sun, the morning star, Venus, Lucifer, Jesus, Horus, Mithra, Dionysus, Krishna, etc...

(I expect to catch some heat for equating Lucifer and Jesus as one, but did not Jesus call himself the "bright morning star"?)

This is such an outstanding thread with so many outstanding replies. Please pardon me if any of my questions have been covered. I get a bit excited to post when I read something that causes me to seek clarification.

But it seems as though the effort to conquer the world has been alive and well since the first dynasty of Egypt, and the consequential situation that we find ourselves in is the supposed "Luciferian Doctrine".
(Man from animal, which then becomes a God. This is supposedly the point of the design of the pyramids, but most importantly the Riddle of the Sphinx... Man from animal)

Is this the gist to which you are referring jackflap?

If you covered this then please point me to the place in the thread.
I am a bit overwhelmed with information at this point.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Are you referring to Dionysus?

Have you read much on the Elysian Mysteries?

The rites and the reason for them are eerily similar to the supposed creation of the worship of the Sun.

[edit on 4/25/2010 by Josephus23]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Whew, Pro Trav, how you do go on!

Of course, I have given ya a great big star and flag. I thought I was reading a modern version of The Nuremberg Chronicle ...HA! By the way, I have the pages of an original of that prized 1493 book relating to Rome's history framed and on my living room wall. Since it was written in German, I haven't a clue of what it says.

To be honest I wasn't able to read your entire post yet (but will). I noted you touched on one of my favorite philosophies of the Roman period, stoic philosophy. Unfortunately you did not go into great detail of the import of this philosophy in Rome's maturing under my personal favorite Roman Emperor, Marcus Aurelius Antoninus Augustus (26 April 121 – 17 March 180) Tomorrow will be his 1,889th birthday! Maybe you can do a thread sometime on Stoicism and Marcus's "Meditations".

Rome is a good example of where we are today and where we may be in the immediate future. The world could learn much about it's future by reading of Rome's demise. Your posts are always the best. Carry on!
...........................................

reply to post by Josephus23

Is this the gist to which you are referring jackflap?

I'll be honest with you my friend, you put the links together in your post. I knew that there was some kind of connection between all of these things and I couldn't explain it. It seems as though you have though.

I knew that there was something behind the scenes that the elite and secret societies worshiped and held dear but I just couldn't figure it out. I have heard it originated in the Pagan Mystery Schools.

I would love to know where they perceive that they get their power from. It is obvious also that sacred geometrical designs have been incorporated into art works and corporate symbols to invoke fear and reverence in the viewer thereby making the individual more susceptible to programming.

The rabbit hole goes very deep down this tunnel and you really have to have your wits about you when delving into it. At least that's what I've found out. Thanks for your awesome reply my friend you seriously made it clearer for me!

reply to post by romanmel


Thank you for the kind words my friend, I wish I could read German, I would love to read that book.

I bet it has some very interesting things in it.

Darn it, why didn't Germany read the war, we would be speaking German by now, and could read it.

!!!!!

Amazing post, my friend. It's so good I posted the link to this page on my MySpace truth website... It went out to 4,736 people on my friend's list.
Hopefully it'll attract more viewers for you!

Keep up the amazing work.

-alex

reply to post by jackflap


So I have read that they get their power from ummm....

Capturing energy through rite and ritual, and then they direct this energy through their architecture over certain places on the earth?
I have read several contradicting theories on this, but I think that PT hit the nail on the head with the discussion on the Knights Templar.

Modern Freemasonry is the worship of Lucifer, at least that is what Albert Pike wrote in Morals and Dogma, and...

We give up our power to them.
The Mystery Schools (modern day Freemasonry) capture this energy and use it to give them power through their architecture.

And to me, sacred geometry, which is rife throughout the design of Freemasonry architecture, is similar to, but more human (luciferian) than fractal geometry, the Mandlebrot set, or the Fibonacci sequence. (these are more natural, circular and feminine than the hard corners of sacred geometry)
(It is interesting to note that the modern day system of banking, at least the mathematics involved, was developed by Leonardo of Pisa, AKA Leonardo de Fibonacci of the Fibonacci sequence)

Supposedly these powers are given by both human and earth by way of the supposed ley lines that cross the earth.
And their architecture found at certain vortex points located on the earth allow them to funnel and direct this captured energy.
I believe this was what was discovered by the Knights Templar during their excavation of the temple ground.

This is all super speculation.
So, I would suggest a follow up yourself, but this is my understanding.

[edit on 4/25/2010 by Josephus23]

[edit on 4/25/2010 by Josephus23]

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by romanmel

 

Thank you for the kind words my friend, I wish I could read German, I would love to read that book.

I bet it has some very interesting things in it.

Darn it, why didn't Germany read the war, we would be speaking German by now, and could read it.

!!!!!

Thanks Pro-Trav...Just in case you think the Germans did not win the war...you may find this book, I recently read, interesting:

www.amazon.com...=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272225292&sr=1-7

reply to post by jackflap


Proof of the pudding's in the eating ... yes ?

And proof of the tree is in it's fruits


Just as the proof of the god is in its creations


Ok. So we look at those creations. And what do we find ?

To me, this world is similar to half a dozen painters let loose on the one canvas -- sublimely beautiful segment in one corner, perhaps. Then a heavy, muddy mess nearby. Mediocre dabbling here, black splotch there. Glorious snippit there. And so on ...

The turning-point for me --- the point where I could no longer feel or force belief in what religion preached -- lay in a newspaper report of the rape and murder of a little child. The rapist had stuffed the child's socks down its throat to muffle its screams

And my mind was screaming, trying to drown out what I'd just read. A vomit of disbelief, rage, disappointment, fear, horror and sadness kept rising in my mind's throat. None of the platitudes did a thing to relieve it. None of the Pollyanna BS helped. No-one had an answer which came anywhere close to explaining it away

Sure, I could accept that the rapist was a victim of something -- something which was responsible for his acts. But nothing could explain how any god worth the name could allow what had happened to the child -- a child with no physical defences, on whose behalf no-one intervened

'Don't tell me the rapist will go to hell ' I raged at those who suggested that. ' Don't tell me a devil, a satan or a lucifer was responsible ! Don't tell me the child is safely in heaven now. Don't tell me it is not mine to question ! I AM questioning ! I want to know what sort of god creates a situation where things like this happen ! What sort of 'loving' god ? So don't waste my time with nonsense about free-will. Unless you can tell me why the rapist's 'free will' was enabled -- and the child's was not '

I was terrified of what I was thinking. I was burning my bridges with God. It meant (if 'religion' was to be believed) that God would cast me adrift for my sin of rejecting him. It meant I was on my own. Or worse ... a victim of the debil, who'd put these rebellious ideas in my empty head

So I dithered and went back and forth for years, begging forgiveness and sliding back into the fold. Only to rebel again when the world sickened my soul.

Finally, I realised I didn't have to toss the baby out with the bathwater. It suddenly dawned on me that all this 'one god' stuff wasn't necessarily so. Sure, ultimately, the various gods would have to be reduced to one ultimate source. But I felt as if a great weight had been lifted from me at the same time I regained my 'religion'. Because I realised ... or decided (because I don't know which) ... that the god of this world was not GOOD enough to be my god. Simple as that.

I have higher expectations of god than to believe this world or dimension, is the best he/she/it can do

And it's more than just wishful-thinking on my part. I have reasons to believe my god is better than this. Because there are truly divine elements within humans. And although I don't know for a fact that this next is so --- I suspect that even within the most depraved child-murderer, there exists something divine. It may be the potential to be a self-sacrificing hero, should the opportunity arise. Just the potential. But that's sufficient, to my mind, to indicate that even the worst of us contains something that is more god-like than a god which will allow the darkness and suffering which exists on this planet, this dimension

Can the cake be superior to the cook ? Can the suit be superior to the tailor ? Can the creation be superior to the alleged god-creator ?

Isn't it more likely that the creation contains within itself the essence and evidence of its creator ?

It seems to me that humans, beneath the dross, are superior on some level, to the life they're compelled to endure, the god they're told is theirs. That's just my opinion and many will disagree. And yes, there's a lot of dross to be stripped. Spirits trapped in a material world, as it's described --- I can agree with that

Shouldn't we reflect the god which created us ? If so, DO we ?

Do we mirror our environment, the environment in which we're compelled to exist, whilst nevertheless retaining evidence of something better ?

If we and our environment were created by the same god, why throughout history, have we loathed ourselves and at the same time prayed and hoped for something 'better' (more in tune with our spirits) after we're dead ?

Is it a case of some of us being more strongly imbued with the spirit of a superior god and more able to resist succumbing to the environment in which we find ourselves ? For example, the child-soliders in war-torn Africa, who recently hacked off the legs of a woman they'd butchered, cooked the legs and forced her children (who'd witnessed the entire thing) to eat their mother. Some of the terrified children did so. One son refused and was shot on the spot. The child-solders and the children who obeyed them -- overpowered by the dark-god, creator of this dark world ? The son who chose to die rather than succumb to the darkness --- possessed more of his true god's spirit ?

'One god' they preach, 'One god who's a jealous, vindictive but 'loving' god. A god who will tolerate your having no god but himself. One god, one god, that's all there is. One god. That's all you have. One god -- obey and worshiop that one god or you'll go to hell. Thank that one god for everything you have, even if all you have is pain and excreta. Because it could be worse, puny human -- you could end up in a place even worse than this if you even consider there might be more than this one god whose works surround you '

So fearfully, we give praise for the beauty around us. We drive ourselves to be thankful for whatever sufferings befall us. We twist logic into pretzels. We send ourselves insane. We live in fear and loathing and we berate ourselves for not being more thankful, even when we hate our experience

We believe daffodils and rainbows are evidence of 'beauty' and 'god's love'. But really, with what do we compare them ? It's all we know. And for all we know, if life were a dream and we were to awake somewhere else and see this world from a truer perspective, we might realise that daffodils are actually horrific and sunsets a terrifying phenomenon similar to a Mad Max world

Where did we gain our compassion, our courage, our mercy, our ability to sacrifice for a stranger, a sense of justice, fairness and recognition of injustice ? Aren't they at odds with this physical world and with the god of the old testament ? Yet throughout thousands of years, we've taught these values to our children and we've aspired to them ourselves, regardless of whatever religion (if any) we were taught. Meaning we're more evolved than our physical selves and our world

Isn't it true that we don't 'fit' with this physical world ? And isn't that at least one of the reasons so many put faith in extraterrestrials and an afterlife ?

Isn't it also true that we have to learn to 'fit' with this world ? And isn't that the reason we're troubled very often by our 'conscience' ?

Would our conscience allow us to subject humanity to this world, for thousands of years, if we were god ? Would we subject our children to this world, if we had a choice ? Would we toss some of our children into a vat of depravity, filth, suffering and misery --- and gently place other of our children in luxury and oportunity? And if they protested (for their individual reasons) would we give them the one-size-fits-all explanation of, ' I work in mysterious ways' ?

Would we create an environment where everything exists at the expense of something else, knowing the chaos this would cause ? Would we ? Then why ? Why would we ? I wouldn't.

Do we choose greetings cards which portray scenes of bombed cities and people dying of disease and hunger ? Or do we choose cards which portray peaceful scenes of flowers, idyliic surroundings, kittens playing ? Sound a crazy question ? Or does it provide insight into how humans would like their world to be ?

So all of this, to me anyway, illustrates that we bear within ourselves evidence of our real creator, despite that we're compelled to survive in a world/dimension/environment created by a different god altogether -- a god who doesn't seem to like us very much

'God', to me these days, consists of a sort of light combined with a gently rhythmic pulsation -- an impersonal energy/intelligence which absorbs our essence after we've been purified and filtered possibly thousands of times. And maybe where we are now is where we have to begin, in this coarse slurry ? But I believe each of us has as much chance of working it out any of the 'religions'. And I believe it's our right to try to work it out, possibly even one of the primary reasons for our existence

S & F

This thread is without any doubt the #1 ATS thread of all time. You really have a godlike wisdom Proto.

Here is something very intriguing someone gave to me last summer about rome, more specifically about Julius Caesar secrets.

This is very good reading and took a lot of imagination, but since you surely know that i do not like when "wrong" facts are disregarded since they do not go with ones story - few corrections:
1) First recorded conflict in Human history was not Troyan war. It was Sumer vs Elam and happened thousand years earlier. And there areother examples,again - before Troyan war and in different regions. What it got to do with Rome?

2) In Troyan war Sparta and Troya were important. Athens was not, and its king (democracy, was it...) is not mentioned as one of 5 leading commanders of Achaeans. How it is symbolic?

3)Why Troy represents gods? Every side had their own gods.

4) How Rome was more multicultural then Athens that preceded it?

5) Why Hebrews were not semites and what famous Hebrew Masons roamed in Rome or outside it? Even first Temple was built by Phoenician.

6) Israelite kingdom predates Roman Republic and empire. And tribes were there before the kingdom. So how Hebrew tribes could teach Roman Republic anything if those are two totally different epochs? Like saying that modern Italy learned about usury from pre-Muslim Arabian tribes.

7) Why Romans needed to learn usury from Hebrews if it was known world wide from much much earlier times. Like laws of Hammurabi that mention it?
If Romans learned it from Hebrews, then their word for it would be the Hebrew word. Not Latin one. Modern European civilization learned stuff from Muslims , thus - Al-gebra, Al-cohol. Al-chemy and ctr. No neshek in Latin

8) Caesar died 50 years before Jesus is claimed to be born. "Jewish king" at the time was Roman official named Pilate. Since Judea (that later would be renamed to Palestine) was just a Roman province then. Not very hard to find out , really.

9) Judaism was not "little known religion" at the time, it had lots of converts in Rome and outside. Including some famous Roman patricians. Well documented , unlike totally unsupported theory that Jews demanded to burn Jerusalem.

10) Sacking of Jerusalem is depicted in Rome on original arch to this day,
there are coins and most importantly no biblical source mentions it. Since it happened much much later. Roman historians however do mention it, though not in such details as totally-non-semitic-looking Josephus Flavius.

11) Jerusalem was Jewish capital for almost thousand years, minus 50 years of Babylonian capture. There are numerous archeological evidence for second temple period. This is 500 years at least.

Well, here since you stopped mentioning facts and simply let your rich imagination take over completely - i stop asking questions. Just as i would not question Tolkien or Prattchet universe, i will not question yours.
I just do not get why you consider Jewish "overlords" so intelligent (creating all major religions and plans that work after thousands of years) and all others so dumb and incompetent. I do not think that even most hardened Jewish supremacists would go that far. But maybe it is just to get plot moving on, since otherwise it would simply crumble?

[edit on 25-4-2010 by ZeroKnowledge]

Wow S & F for you man. Amazing thread, thank you for putting in the time to compile all this information. Quite a bit different from the history of Rome I learned back in highschool, maybe one day my grandchildren will be learning this history of Rome. Eh probably not

Just been using this all the time now ALL ROADS LEAD TO ROME! Its the way its been without anyone realizing who is behind everything, what groups are all interconnected and exchangeable. Great Thread!

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


One quick question, I have read the post and it IS, as usual for you, quite fantastic and very complete, would you have this in book form?

I have several friends who are history teachers and I would like to get them a copy of this post. Great work again, will be back.

OP you should write a book and cash in on your knoledge
and reserch.

great read put it in print!

OP you should write a book and cash in on your knoledge
and reserch.

great read put it in print!

When in Rome do as the Romans do? This has got to be one of the finest threads I have seen put together in an attempt to give an origin to the concept of a New World Order. Much of Rome's legacy is alive and well today, through Western ideals, laws, and principles. We have similar laws, religious philosophies, Latin on every government building, bread and circuses, debauchery and decadence, rampant corruption in government, and other footprints left by Rome in modern times.

A civilization that was around for over two-thousand-years never disappears, and would endure after its demise for that period of time or much longer? I think where you are going with this, is that on the surface, the Roman Empire may have been destroyed when barbarians led by Alaric and his Visigothic warriors in 410 AD sacked the city for its final time, but in all actuality, it has gone underground with the original apparatus and system presently in place?

Now, I would have to agree with you that it appears Rome is alive and well with the people of Europe and the United States? Something as enduring as Rome never goes away, and its heritage carries on through the generations that follow. In the case of the US, they have Roman Fasce on the walls of the legislature, and Romanesque architecture around the Capitol. That is just one example, and there are many others as you have highlighted in your OP.

In my humble opinion, I think the United States is the new Rome, and it has all the hallmarks of going down the way its predecessor had, some 2,000-years-ago. More about US as the New Rome, it has garrisons all over the world like Rome, it is debilitated by corruption among government officials, most of the population is poor, and yet, a good football game, UFC, or American Idol keeps them content like with the Roman concept of "Bread and Circuses," and last but not least, a government racked with inaction, bureaucracy, and meddling from outside. The new Rome even has the list of so called "Barbarians at the Gates," we could refer to them as maybe the Russians, Chinese, Middle Easterners, or practically any group or country against the rule or governance of the New Rome and her international partners. I see the entire Western System rotting from within like what destroyed Rome. There is not much I can add, because this is the thread many have been waiting for from you, and what a outstanding thread it really is! Moreover, you certainly pulled out all the stops about your interpretation of the New World Order and her alleged origins. It was quite a fascinating read, and what a journey for Rome from antiquity to the present day. Keep up the good work, Proto!



[edit on 25-4-2010 by Jakes51]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Wow PT great information, and great thread, I'd give ya 5 flags and stars if I could

I will have to finish reading all of the info before I can make a intelligent post, but I will say the whole NWO stuff is very interesting and mysterious and you are shedding some light on it all. Good job.