Crop Circles, 2010 & Beyond: Ignore Denial?

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More than half a century have people been debating about the next
'compelling' case_X, photo_Y and footage_Z relating to UFOs/ETs.

Rather unsatisfying really as the validity of any testimony
depends on the credibility of the source, the obvious problem being
that 'officials' generally don't talk about ET.

Due to the inherent dynamics of the internet and open discussion boards,
'mere' pictures and videos can and ultimately will be 'debunked'.

Far-fetched unsubstantiated theories about so-called 'aliens',
'reptoids', 'insectoids', alleged 'abduction', and so on..
interwoven with a myriad of hysterical 'end-time prophecies',
have ultimately buried the quest for ET in ridicule.

This points to a curious paradox, namely, that on the one hand
it is maintained that extra-terrestrials do not exist;
i.e. the official stance of the international governments,
while they are simultaneously being presented
as hostile to the inhabitants of Earth?

The fact that extra-terrestrials are visiting our planet
has been publicly known since the 40's of the previous century.

Hadn't it been known, there would have been no need for a cover-up.

There would have been no need for 60+ years of controversy.




There is no need here to point out to the many crimes perpetrated
against Humanity by generations of corrupt and incompetent 'leaders'.

One of these crimes certainly is the fact
that they are withholding information regarding the presence
of highly civilized extra-terrestrials who seek to engage "Contact".

The official stance regarding ET is:

"There is no official stance regarding ETs
because extra-terrestrials do not exist".

Very clever, no need to answer to any question.

Indeed, a lie of Cosmic proportions.

Could crop circles have anything to do with this?

So, what about crop circles?


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Crop circles appear out of the blue, across the globe, they are physical,
they can be visited, their designs can be studied.

During the past few decades thousands of intricately designed
crop circles have mysteriously appeared, while neither their origin
nor their creation has ever been adequately explained.

Only a tiny percentage of all documented crop circles
have been convincingly attributed to be made by men of Earth.

Strangely, even some self-proclaimed CC 'authorities' maintain
that supposedly at least 80% of CCs would be man-made?

No wonder, many people move along while ignoring the facts.

So, what about the facts?

Truth is, that so-called 'non-believers' have no credible facts to offer
to substantiate their belief/theory that all crop circles would be man-made.

A very poor appeal to "basic common sense"
is all that is being offered by the crop circle skeptic?

During the dark ages the idea was maintained that the Earth is flat
merely because 'it seemed flat' and the Sun was said to rotate
around the Earth merely because 'it seemed' to be so.

Are all crop circles man-made,
merely because 'it seems' they are?

It is often said that it is up to the 'believers' to prove
that crop circles are made by extra-terrestrials.

A fair point, so it seems.

Nonetheless, the fact that no one has been able to offer this proof
to such an extent that it will satisfy the CC-skeptic does not
imply that the origin of the crop circle phenomenon has been explained.

Ignoring the facts does not answer any of the questions
and can neither be considered rational nor scientific.


[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0eda997fe5a3.jpg[/atsimg]

To me, there is not a single doubt that the CC phenomenon
is of extra-terrestrial origin.

Crop circles represent the most tangible evidence that members
of a highly advanced technological superior civilization
are seeking to disclose their presence
in a delicate, gradual and non-intrusive way.

Would it surprise you if it turns out
that visiting extra-terrestrials are Humans?

May I ask then:

Are we 'extra-universal'?

We inhabit a Solar System.

Earth is one among other sister Planets,
like Venus and Mars.

We are Cosmic.

How did Humanity evolve?

Nature creates in abundance.

Are we a loan?

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/e902da11dc6d.jpg[/atsimg]


[edit on 16-4-2010 by Sol12]

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Meeting a friend in the corridor,
Ludwig Wittgenstein said:

"Tell me, why do people always say
that it was natural for men to assume
that the sun went around the earth
rather than the earth was rotating?"

His friend said:

"Well, obviously, because it just looks
as if the sun is going around the earth."

To which the philosopher replied:

"Well, what would it look like
if it had looked as if the earth were rotating?"

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Man-made?

www.abovetopsecret.com...


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reply to post by Sol12


Why are crop circles ever discovered in remote locations? Why is the crop circle phenomenon not as old as UFO reports?
www.circlemakers.org...
Can you pick out man made vs. "real" alien ones?

[edit on 16-4-2010 by zaiger]

You suggest that the weakness of the skeptical position is self-evident, and that it is "obvious" that ET's are behind crop circles. The fact is that the only confirmed explanations for any crop circles have been human beings. All the rest are of unknown origins. So, we have this large set of crop circles and we want to know where they come from. We know for a fact that some of them come from people, and we don't know where the rest come from.

You think that we can justify the assumption that they were made by aliens? How? Isn't it far more likely that they were made by humans, and the people just haven't come foward? Even if you make a very strong case against the possibility that humans made the crop circles, all you are left with an unknown; a block box inside which is the explanation for the crop circles that can't be explained as human activity. You can fill this black box with anything you want. You choose ETs. Is this choice rational? No more rational than the choice of the ancients to explain UFOs as gods.

The strongest case that can possibly be made from crop circles is that their origins are unknown. Their origins could be human hoaxers, or some as-of-yet unidentified natural phenomenon, or gods, or ETs. You can't really make a positive case for any of these explanations. You can try to rule out humans, but it's not like once you rule out humans the only thing left is aliens. You can talk about radiation and how the stalks are bent in a wierd way and how the crop circles appeared suddenly, but there's no reason to believe that those are signs of extraterrestrial involvement. With the exception of alien creatures and space ships, no one has any idea what "evidence" of ETs would be. Radiation and stange stalk bending is not known to be the product of aliens. Again, you can only say that the cause is unknown, and then believers will fill that unknown with anything they want: humans, gods, ETs, natural phenomena, whatever. In order to make a rational case for any of these explanations, you need to be able provide evidence which can only explained by one of the proposed theories.

There's not a strong case to be made connecting difficult to explain observations with ETs. Because we know that humans create some crop circles, the human explanation is by far the simplest and most likely explanation for all crop circles. If you can somehow completely rule out humans, and it's not clear that you can, then what you are left with is an unknown. It is a leap of wishful thinking to fill that unknown with an alien being. If I choose to fill the unknown with an as-of-yet unidentified natural phenomena, or with the magic of a wizard, or with something spiritual, how can you prefer the ET explanation over any of these other explanations? Is there any evidence which prefers the ET explanation over all other conceivable theories?

Cool post S&F

Remember Doug & Dave?

They claimed they made the Crop Circles here in the UK With a Plank of Wood LOL.

They may well have made some Less Complex Circles But Definately Not The Complex Ones.

Last Year Was a Great Year For Crop Circles With Some Fantastic Designs.

Its Not Just Fields of Crops that the Circles Are Found.

There's Been Circles Found in Sand & Snow and also on Frozen Lakes and Ponds.

crop circles are man made people..... Do some research and open your mind to other possiblities. The whole thing started with two dudes in England that used 2x4s and a rope.... It takes up to 3-4 hours to do some of the most elaborate ones......
here is a wikilink en.wikipedia.org...
look up somemore info....

reply to post by judge360


The argument from complexity is nonsense. Just how complex, exacty, is too complex for humans? Where do you draw the line, and why there? Certainly these shapes are not beyond the ability of human beings to draw, why should they be beyond the human ability make into a crop circle? Have you ever seen the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel?

Many pieces of art and construction are orders of magnitude more complex that crop circles. Humans are clearly capable of making complex things; we've driven a car on the moon. Every time a person sets out to debunk the complexity argument by making a complex crop circle, they are able to do it. There's no reason to believe that crop circles are so complex that the only possible explanation for them is aliens; that's nonsense. Even if you believe in ETs, what makes you think they are remarkably skilled at drawing stuff in fields?

I think the crop circle phenomenon is one of the most compelling things of our time and apparently other generations before. I feel it is an attempt by someone or something to communicate with us on a level of pictures and symbols much like our first voyager spacecraft carrying the picture disc with info about us and our home. I had a theory on how the crop circles are made here if anyone cares to take a gander. Starred and flagged to the OP.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by judge360
Cool post S&F

Remember Doug & Dave?

They claimed they made the Crop Circles here in the UK With a Plank of Wood LOL.

They may well have made some Less Complex Circles But Definately Not The Complex Ones.

Last Year Was a Great Year For Crop Circles With Some Fantastic Designs.

Its Not Just Fields of Crops that the Circles Are Found.

There's Been Circles Found in Sand & Snow and also on Frozen Lakes and Ponds.

Sorry but that's just nonsense!

reply to post by big_BHOY


Tell me what nonsence about it?

reply to post by Reign02


Garbage in, garbage out. Fantastic link! Great research!
Come on for goodness sake! I'd have a lie down if I were you.

mclinking

reply to post by OnceReturned


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Originally posted by OnceReturned
"In order to make a rational case for any of these explanations,
you need to be able to provide evidence which can only be explained
by one of the proposed theories."

The actual available evidence is: crop circles.

Man-made or ET-made?

It is a matter of connecting dots.

No one has been able to prove that
all CCs would be man-made.

On the other hand, some will argue that as long as ET
is not landing in front of the White House, the CC phenomenon
can't possibly be of extra-terrestrial origin.

Originally posted by OnceReturned
"The strongest case that can possibly be made from crop circles
is that their origins are unknown."

I agree, the debate is still open.

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I have to say this to the humans that say they did/do these.

Prove it. They can take any complex design, assemble a team and go out at night and in a few hours make one.

Then the next morning, we'll see what it looks like. I bet my last dollar (which isn't far away) that they would NEVER look like the ones we see here.

And, I am not talking about the ones that the landowner hasn't been to that part of his property in a while. The ones when they say I was just here yesterday, came back this morning and .........

Also, and I don't know for sure, but I did read recently that in England at least, military helo's show up and apparently take overhead photos/video and leave without ever landing. That shows me they know who made them-no need to investigate-just obtain the message and get it to who needs it. Has any of you actually seen a military helo show up over these?

reply to post by Sol12


The problem with stating crop circles are from ET is there are tons of videos out there showing how humans make them. Crop circles are easy to make and the simplest of tools are used in doing so. The designs go to show the creativity at hand.

Since there is one real explanation out there, the extraterrestrial explanation does not hold as much water. Could they actually be making a few trying to communicate? That is not known, but until more solid evidence is gathered, I am going to stick with crop circles being a man made phenomenon.

reply to post by kidflash2008

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"tons of videos"?

Truth is, there are far more unexplained crop circles
than available videos of some folks in the dark with stomping boards,
purporting to be creating (all of) them.

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Originally posted by Sol12
To me, there is not a single doubt that the CC phenomenon
is of extra-terrestrial origin.

Crop circles represent the most tangible evidence that members
of a highly advanced technological superior civilization
are seeking to disclose their presence
in a delicate, gradual and non-intrusive way.

It could be done by satellites using microwaves that humans from earth designed.
Any ultra-advanced-tech, decades past what we have been shown we can achieve... developed in secret, then revealed to the public.. would look like it's alien in origin.. including the tech that has the ability to make crop circles from a satellite.

crop circdles aren't proof of humans.

sure it's fun to think that it is..
and it does in NO WAY make me LESS interested in them!
i am very interested in them and i'm sure many of them hold secret mathematical algorithms, or blueprints.. or esoteric meaning.. i love learning abotu them..

doesn't mean they are from beings that are not of earth.
it would be cool ifthey were.. but ..

imo.. advanced military or private tech could pull those thigns off..

they are mathematically accurate.. and they DO NOT WARP when going up and down hills if looked don on..
i don't know how other to explain this but it's impossible to achieve with boards.

i also think that people who come to the conclusion that people with boards made all the complex circles out ther.. i think those people are some of the most ridiculously foolish people in the world and i feel sorry for them.

i think humans from earth made them with satellite technology.
probably Masons.. because of the inclusion and focus on sacred geometry and esoteric symbolism.

Would it surprise you if it turns out
that visiting extra-terrestrials are Humans?

no.

i forgot the term for it.
something like.. climax.. or apex evolution...
i think that having five fingers.. opposeable thumb.. 2 arms..
everything spaced along the golden mean.. 2 eyes..
is prety much the apex of the mind-world interaction apparatus.

you could invent other ones.. but some parts would be removed due to tediousness of their presence..

i think the humanoid form. .and human in general may be a very common "vehicle" that develops for intelligence to wear...

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reply to post by prevenge

Masons.. because of the inclusion and focus on sacred geometry and esoteric symbolism.

Care to share ANY shape or ANY combonation of numbers that somehow cannot be said to be realted to the masons?

Come on then Debunkers

Did Men With Boards Do THIS:

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[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/cfebb5586e81.jpg[/atsimg]

Dont Think So But You Lot Will Have Some Excuse I'm Sure LOL

reply to post by judge360


www.circlemakers.org...
Nothing special.
People are saying it can be done with boards, they are not saying they are done with only boards. There are many other things that circlemakers have the ability to use.