The Insanity of Abortion in America

reply to post by spiritualzombie


Well, I think it does. I was there with my wife with the morning sickness, the fatique, the swollen ankles. I was there standing for 6 hours while she was in labor. I was there to see her face when she saw our son for the first time. I was there when we found out our second baby was lost. I was there when she found out that she was pregnant again.

So... direct experience NO... but I have definitly experienced what it is like to be pregnant, and I do have a very real sense of what the woman goes through. So yes my response was EXTREMELY relevant.

I'm probably in the minority of people on this issue that does not really have any strong leanings one way or another. In my opinion we have the paradox of both options being wrong.

On one hand it seems wrong and barbaric to force a woman to have a child against her will, along with all the physical, chemical and emotional consequences that go along with it.

On the other hand it seems wrong for a woman to have her baby terminated and deprive it of a chance at life, considering that it was her actions and mistakes that were responsible for the life being created in the first place ( obviously with the exception of rape ).

If babies were created entirely by accident, then I'd fully support abortion, but I'm still undecided on this issue due to the fact that no pregnancy is truly 'accidental', unless the people involved are ignorant of the reproductive process.

I think a lot of the problem comes from attitudes, especially in this day and age, when sex is viewed as almost entirely as a pleasurable activity, and the consequences and responsibilities of sexual intercourse are viewed as an easily corrected inconvenience.
Of course, you're always going to get unwanted pregnancies and a demand for abortion, but perhaps if more women had a greater appreciation of the responsibility that goes with their gender, then abortion would be far less prevalent, and maybe frowned upon by more people as the glorified birth control that it is in many cases.

No man should be able to tell a woman what they can or can't do with their body. I am a male myself, and not some child hater or anything I have a daughter and my wife is currently pregnant again. But I am completely pro choice, some people such as teenagers...etc are just not fit to have a child, I don't have any problem with abortion.

reply to post by trueperspective


With respect to everything you have experienced, it is still in no way comparable to the difficult decision a woman faces when choosing whether to terminate a pregnancy.

I respect that you have experienced the joys of child birth as well as the intense pain from loss and my heart goes out to you for that...

The difference is the choice. No man can ever truly know what it's like to face the choice, all that implies, and experience the act of abortion. It is an agonizing decision that a women has to live with forever...

I say this as a man... and I know... what with male dominance over women throughout the ages... that if men were the ones to give birth, this would not be an issue. It would be every man's right and to hell what anyone else says.

Can you imagine if males gave birth, and all these women were protesting our right to end a pregnancy? We would pretty much tell them all to 'F'-off. It's our body.

This is a woman's rights issue. Any other argument about right or wrong is subjective and a distraction.

reply to post by trueperspective


Look again. Read Isis' post. Especially this part:

Originally posted by Isis_Is_I
I have nothing else to add, just remember that you do not and could not possibly understand what a woman goes through before making such a decision.

Have you made the decision to abort? Then you have no idea what it's like for a woman to make that decision.

You didn't even take the time to read and understand her post before getting on your defense to convince us all how much you know about what it's like to be pregnant. :shk: BTW, I'm not convinced that you know a thing about it.

You're not making any points here.

[edit on 4/14/2010 by Benevolent Heretic]

Originally posted by trueperspective
reply to post by ItsAgentScully

 

Wait a minute now. NO one said anything about religion. And as the topic starter I don't want it to be descussed. It is not about religious beliefs AT ALL. It is about the rationale between protecting a already-is OR soon-to-be human being and climbing a tree to protect that instead.

Please don't make this a religious thread.

The rationale is simple: peoples opinions vary and not everybody cares about the abortion issue.. that horse was been beaten to pablum a long time ago. These days imo there is no abortion issue to "discuss", attempts to do so degrade into heated, and sometimes entertaining, flock Vs flock shouting matches over which opinion is "right"... it's always the same boring arguments too.

I could care less about what legal medical decisions strangers make, it's their personal business that doesn't affect my day. I currently also dont care about any particular trees, but I might if the city powers decided to bulldoze the park I enjoy..

Different strokes for different folks man, some people care about trees, others about what strangers do... the world is big enough for more than one opinion.

Lest we forget the true insanity of illegal abortions in America.

When Abortion Was Illegal: Untold Stories

From Danger To Dignity: The Fight For Safe Abortion

The FRAGILE PROMISE of CHOICE: Abortion in the U.S. Today



[edit on 14-4-2010 by Lilitu]

The fact is, you can legislate the issue to death (no pun intended) but people are still going to get abortions. Whether they go to Mexico or Canada, or do it themselves.

Legalization and regulation are the only sound options.

I find it rather interesting that a fetus (future human) is not considered a "baby" or "a human". Yet, a small amount of marijuana seeds (not a marijuana plant) is illegal to possess because it's, well, marijuana seeds, "future" marijuana plant.

Notice: I do not condone possession of marijuana, seeds or their use. Also, I do not condone possession of humans, fetuses or their use.

Who cares whether it feels pain? Hell, who cares what it feels? A person does not have the right to use another person's body against their will without consent, for any reason. Ever. Consenting to sex does not equal consenting to pregnancy, and certainly doesn't equal consenting to have your body used as an incubator for the next nine months. A woman should be able to abort the baby at any time she feels like it.

It is no stranger a dichotomy than that between the rabid pro-death penalty evangelicals and the same anti choice wackos. Such rational disconnects can only result from mental defect or religion. But I'm being redundant.
Edit to add - Or the disconnect between Catholics, who want to prohibit aborting a baby but think it's fine to rape them.

[edit on 14-4-2010 by 4nsicphd]

Did you really just compare a convicted felon to an innocent baby? If the pro-deathers are wiilling to put the unborn baby on trial, and convict them of 1st degree murder, I suppose lethal injection/gas chamber would be appropriate....

Anyhow, please think logically people. Everyone saying "late term is wrong... but earlier abortions are ok", ask yourself what is the difference between what you consider to be a late term pregnancy, and the day before, or a week before, or even a month before. Regarless of how far back you turn the clock, it is still a human infant. Level of development, ability to feel pain, location of residence, ability to take care of itself etc. has NEVER been a criteria for being a human, so why make exception in the wonb?

at one time one of my neighbors who lived in the same apartment building as me told me a story...I have no reason to disbelieve her. she was mentally ill, but really emotionally distraught over this.

she had to take the medicine she was taking to keep her mental capabilities intact, unforunately, that medicine wasn't that friendly to developing babies. so much so, that when here doctors found out that she was pregnant, they immediately went to a courthouse and got an order to give the girl an abortion. they forced this girl to abort her baby, because they knew it would be born very badly deformed!

okay, so those of you who think that all abortions should be outlawed, umm....
what would your solution be??
for the girl to stop taking the meds, let her go completely insane, for the sake of the child??
or let the child develope, exposed to the chemicals that were causing it's body to develope malformed (that in itself sounds a little painful!!), and well, you have no problem sharing a little of your paycheck to raise this deformed baby into and beyond adulthood, pay for it's medical care, ect???

to absolutely ban all abortions after 20 weeks, or whatever, well.....you better be prepared to chose one of the two options I listed above! are you prepared to allow the death of a mother, on the chance that the baby can be born alive? are you prepared to share you income with that baby so that it can be cared for?

the abortion issue is just too complex, there is no easy law that you can pass that will regulate it justly....

and, well, try convincing some of the anti-abortion group that a developing fetus is a danger to the mother. they'll try every argument they can think of to convince you that yes, it is possible for both to be fine!! even it they are talking about a very young rape victim who is carrying twins and there's a group of doctors saying that it is very, very, unlikely!!

which leads me to this statement!!
motherhood, bringing babies into our world, is treated with the honor that it should be treated with to begin with. no one appreciates the sacrifices that mothers make during pregnancy or the 20 or so years afterwards that she spends nurturing that young person to adulthood. there's no monetary compensation, and well, if that mother happens to find herself in need of help from welfare, she's treated like the lowest of low!!
motherhood, housekeeping all that, well, it isn't considered work, oh no....why isn't this person out working!!!

well.....why have kids in such an environment??

it's okay. Let them kill babies

We cannot stop another person from doing things. Especially females who had sex in the first place

let em do it...We have important things to worry about

I could not care less....I would NEVER personally abort a fetus due to my personal views and would NEVER ASSIST in acting as an EXECUTIONER for some dumb bimbo

reply to post by trueperspective



You cannot judge someone until you have walked a mile in their shoes.

reply to post by trueperspective



Whilst I support early abortion, I consider late-term terminations to be grotesque and insupportable

A woman knows ... or should ... by eight weeks, if she's pregnant and if she wishes to continue the pregnancy

If she leaves it later than that (imo only, of course) then too bad -- she should go through with it and offer the child for adoption

Far preferable, of course, would be for people (all ages) to be educated in birth control. Maybe that needs to be compulsory, every 12 months ? Currently, people are walking around with something far more dangerous in their knickers than loaded guns