Strange Rock Carving

I have to admit, I'm perplexed.

A few days ago, a gentleman was walking in the woods, in an undisclosed location in WV, when he happened upon a curiously carved rock. This particular gent has been all over this ground, for years, and had never noticed this rock carving before.

He came back and reported the find, and so far no one else has ever noticed it before either. Keep in mind these gents have been all over this territory hunting and such, and are keen observers due to that pursuit. No much gets by them, but no one has noticed this rock before.

I went out this morning in the company of one of them to see this rock for myself, as I was not a little dubious.

This is a photo I took of it a little after noon today:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/1fabd6a7039e.jpg[/atsimg]

The rock itself is embedded in the bed of a small mountain stream, around 200 meters or so away from the nearest road, up a small hollow. The stream I think is mostly dry, but has had some water running in it lately due to heavy rains. The area it's in is little frequented, and mostly uninhabited.

The circle is 22 inches wide at the inside edge of the circle, and 21 1/2 inches tall at the inside edge of the circle. The depth that the circle is cut to is between 5/8 and 3/4 of an inch. The orientation of the stem of the central "tree" is east by north-east.

I did a cursory search of Google images (just the first 20 pages) and found similar,but not identical, figures. They were the Norse "World tree" (Yggdrasil), the Celtic "Tree of Life", and a Buddhist figure somewhat resembling the carving. None of these explains how THIS carving would be found in the middle of nowhere in West Virginia, with this obvious patina of age.

The "branches" of the central "tree" vaguely resemble the layout of the surrounding hollows. There has been some lively discussion today of whether or not this could be some sort of "map" of the surrounding one or two square miles. Some say it most likely IS, others are equally certain that it ISN'T. So far, no theory has been advanced as to why anyone would take the time to rock-cut a map of such a small area.

An idea has been advanced that it is some sort of Indian carving, but no purpose for it has been suggested.

Why the "tree"? Why the circle? Why in the middle of nowhere, off the beaten path, in an uninhabited area? Why in the middle of a stream bed? Who would take the time to carve it, and for what purpose?

Any ideas? Explanations? suggestions for further research? I have to admit my perplexity in the matter once again.

reply to post by nenothtu
Why 'undisclosed location?' Map? Coordinates? If not....for whatever reason...how about an image in context? Object to add scale...tape measure. Dimensions?

Without these things, it's just an image with a story...

Edit: (no exif data in image?)



[edit on 30-3-2010 by Kandinsky]

reply to post by Kandinsky


Well I think he did provide some basis measurements...

It would be great knowing where exactly this was taken OP. But from a layman's observation it does look like a tree within a circle, usually used as representation of the Tree of Life/Tree of Knowledge. It is meant to symbolize limitless knowledge through the circle, sometimes even God.

More details would be good, thanks for sharing.

My first thought before reading you mentioning it was a map too.

If I were you Id check out the areas that would represent the distinct areas of the left and right, on both sides you can see a kind of square marker on the circle outline... see if in real life it translate to a physical marker of some type.

Then, you wonder why someone would map it on the rock. Is the rock obvious to see? Maybe they forgot where they hid something in the hollows but always know where the rock is, and use it to find whatever they hid.

If no one has noticed it before I would suggest it is new. Because I am sure they had to see the rock before. You cant overlook that carving it looks so out of place.

It is not close to Yggdrasil that was my old avatar
[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/38f93c8bf395.jpg[/atsimg]
A world tree has to have distinct separate roots and branches

reply to post by Kandinsky


It's an "undisclosed location" to protect it from vandalism. The general location is central West Virginia, somewhere in Calhoun or Roane counties. I'd really rather not get more specific than that just yet, in an open internet post.

There's no exif data in the image probably because it was cropped, using IrfanView, and pasted from the clipboard. The original image is 12 megapixels, 3000 by 4000 resolution, and contains the exif data. I took 4 pictures today, each around 5 megabytes, and I'd be happy to e-mail the originals to you if you'd like them. Just shoot me a U2U with your e-mail address, and I'll send 'em right out. The cropped one above has the toe of my boots in it for scale. There are only 4 images, and no tape measure in them, mostly because it was raining, so we didn't stay there long.

I may go out and take more tomorrow, and if I do, I'll be sure to include the tape measure.

By "in context" do you mean you want a picture of the rock as it sits in the stream? it's at the lip of a slight falls in it.

I can post another with slightly more of the surroundings, but I didn't take any wide-angle shots. Give me a few to shrink the picture, and I'll post it too, with the exif info.

If no one has noticed it before I would suggest it is new. Because I am sure they had to see the rock before. You cant overlook that carving it looks so out of place.

I don't know about that , I know where some Aboriginal rock art is and I doubt the Aboriginals of today know about them. Unless you stumble across something like this, your eyes aren't looking for it

Wally

I'd be out there with a shovel and a metal detector. I smell treasure.

reply to post by nenothtu


It looks like it could be a rune, but I cant seem to find a match on the web ...maybe someone else can find it...

Here's a slightly wider view. This picture was taken from the downstream side of the rock, you can see the water flowing around the edges of it, and some of the leaves. the exif information should be intact in this one, since I just shrank it to fit an ATS page, and didn't crop or copy and paste it from the clipboard into IrfanView:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/344c72ff1fe7.jpg[/atsimg]

They've had a bit of flooding here recently, and I'm wondering if that may have only uncovered it recently, but I'm not prone to think that to be the case, due to the weathering evident.

If I go out tomorrow and get more pictures, I'll also try to get some close-ups of the interior of the carved channels themselves, so you can see what I mean.

Edit: I checked it, and the EXIF info didn't save when I resized it, so I did it again, and forced an EXIF save with the file. I'm reposting the new and improved picture here, to try again.

Second edit: I've tried twice again, and the EXIF info is saved to the resized copy I have here, but it's not making it through the upload transition for some reason. I can Either copy and paste the EXIF here, for those interested, or the offer to e-mail the originals still stands.



[edit on 2010/3/30 by nenothtu]

reply to post by nenothtu
Hey sorry if I came off a bit harsh. I'd just read some of the posts on the 'Hidden Artifacts' thread and was irritated. I know twelve year olds who have a better grasp of BS than some of our established members

Thanks for posting the glyph. I'm off to work now. I've u2ued Byrd (moderator) she's a trained professional in North American rock art. If there's a straight answer...she knows it. I suspect a modern origin...very modern. The patina looks recent and it doesn't reflect familiar symbols of NAs. Guess we'll see...I can stand being wrong.

Originally posted by Kandinsky
reply to post by nenothtu

 

Hey sorry if I came off a bit harsh. I'd just read some of the posts on the 'Hidden Artifacts' thread and was irritated. I know twelve year olds who have a better grasp of BS than some of our established members

Thanks for posting the glyph. I'm off to work now. I've u2ued Byrd (moderator) she's a trained professional in North American rock art. If there's a straight answer...she knows it. I suspect a modern origin...very modern. The patina looks recent and it doesn't reflect familiar symbols of NAs. Guess we'll see...I can stand being wrong.

No problem, I wasn't offended.

My family has lived in that area for over 150 years, and it was an uncle that found it, just last week, when he was out looking for some wild greens. I'm genuinely perplexed by it, since it doesn't really look like any Indian art from this general area that I'm familiar with. The rock paintings on Paint Lick Mountain just south of here in Virginia where I was raised myself lean towards animal figures - thunderbirds, turtles, what looks like a beaver to me, sunrises, and stick figures in canoes, that sort of thing. Nothing like this. The house my dad was raised in is around 500 meters up the hill from this particular carving, yet no one has ever reported it.

No one has lived in that area for probably 50 years or slightly more.

The first image you posted; which looks more like white stone than the second, looked similar to some glyphs I saw in a long dream once.
There were various symbols carved into white stone(one was like a nautilus shell, others seemed to be moon phases) jutting out of the ground at a backwards slant; in a very watery area.

It could be a cover of some kind revealed by the water eroding the dirt but I don't think the rock should be moved until we get an expert analysis here in the thread. D:

Maybe this is the work of potheads.

This is the spot they all get stoned at and they carved a peace sign into the rock.

Eventually the potheads decided to expand the work and it is now on it's way to becoming a marijuana leaf (evil weed).

Time will tell. If only we could see this thing a year from now.

Originally posted by TheBloodRed
It could be a cover of some kind revealed by the water eroding the dirt but I don't think the rock should be moved until we get an expert analysis here in the thread. D:

I don't plan on ever having it moved. It would be pretty difficult, anyhow. It would require heavy equipment, possibly blasting (like I said, it was raining, and I didn't check it very closely to see if it was separated, or bedrock), and clearing out a fair bit of forest to get all of that up there.

Not to mention the destruction of natural resources. I'm not up for all of that, and that's one of the reasons I won't pinpoint the location, in case someone else IS.

Originally posted by Exuberant1
Maybe this is the work of potheads.

This is the spot they all get stoned at and they carved a peace sign into the rock.

Eventually the potheads decided to expand the work and it is now on it's way to becoming a marijuana leaf (evil weed).

Time will tell. If only we could see this thing a year from now.

Potheads doing all the work to carve that out? And leaving no other traces of their presence in the immediate area to boot?

I take it you've never been a pothead, then.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Potheads doing all the work to carve that out? And leaving no other traces of their presence in the immediate area to boot?

Correct.

You were unable to find other traces of their presence - for some reason.

reply to post by rangersdad


You wont find it because its clearly not a Rune. Not to mention the Norsemen did not just carve single runes on runestones, the whole point of it is to commemorate or tell a story.

reply to post by Exuberant1


It seems there is a very olde message connected to stones like the one you've found here.




Go ahead and say it.

I know I'm a big cornball.
FnSn

[edit on 30-3-2010 by randyvs]

( I give to you appalachia as I too share that branch) I spent 10 years of my youth in the burbs of WV. You referenced hunting in your post. "Huntin" is a prevalent past time as is " Keepin ur opinion to urself ". The seldom known wonder of these hills is a freedom ("Dem hills provide"). WV is a lost outpost of free thought, ("Tree huggin hippies") deep faith ("Fire and brimstone") and rebellion ("This is my land, my life") Judging by the patina on the actual carving compared to the surrounding rock, I imagine that perhaps some 50 years ago a young man went out huntin, found himself bored and at odds with his "kin". Instead of " keepin an eye out ", he spent his time sitting quietly, carving an inscription that encompassed his loathing of senseless violence, love of nature, and respect for what it is to live. ( A circled tree- serenity- balance- strength) What’s lovely about this observation is no matter the time, place, person or perspective the inscription delivers the same definition. Truth is always just beyond what we see day to day. Truth is what catches the eye and motivates the heart to share. Perhaps another young man, years later came upon "good cover" and found himself thinking the same thoughts.

[edit on 30-3-2010 by MsAmen]