Is AREA 51 still considered Restrictive?

I have heard that Area 51 does not test classified aircraft anymore since those projects were during the Cold War error....The new classified projects are now somewhere else.

If this is indeed to be true, then why is the airspace (R-4808 area) still restricted from the surface to almost to outer space for civilian airliners?

Can you still overfly Area 51, even though it is not classified anymore?

Thanks.

No, No, not at all, in fact myself and a few friends just got a great deal, on some used F-117's, as well as a few alien bodies in cryostasis, at the recent estate sale last week, giving away all kind's of "no trespassing" signs, lot's of deals, I think it's going on this weekend too......


Of course it's still restrictive, what do you think????

Just because the military isn't using a facility for R&D anymore doesn't mean that they're going to open it up to the public or anything like that.
It's still a military installation and stuff still goes on there that they don't want people snooping around looking for.
Still a classified facility my friend, and it's likely to remain that way at least for this generation.

Originally posted by darpa999
I have heard that Area 51 does not test classified aircraft anymore since those projects were during the Cold War error....The new classified projects are now somewhere else.

If this is indeed to be true, then why is the airspace (R-4808 area) still restricted from the surface to almost to outer space for civilian airliners?

Can you still overfly Area 51, even though it is not classified anymore?

Thanks.

psst... cold war ERA...

only way you can fly into their airspace is if you fly one of the janet planes.

btw you can listen to liveatc.net and hear them on there. you can look up the different callsigns to see where the flight is going too

www.liveatc.net...

so i dont know why they would unrestrict a military base, known or not. even lowly class g uncontrolled airspace has restrictions.

I think that if you cross the border without permission you would be in big trouble

Lines

[edit on 23-3-2010 by Pockets]

Its shoot first, ask questions later at Area 51. Be it by land or air.

Also Area 51 is not the only place where secret projects go on. You probably will not hear of them unless you have a high enough clearance level.

1. So civilian airliners CANNOT fly near Area 51 at all????
If so, are the altitude restrictions over Area 51 are from the surface to almost outer space? What are the altitude restrictions over Area 51?

2. Also, that restrictive area also called the R-4808 on the Nav maps, is not just there or meant to be there only because of AREA 51. Its also applied to be restrictive due to the Nellis AFB Complex used for Red Flag operations.

3. So, just to confirm, is Area 51 still restricted?

I am asking because I read somewhere that new classified testing has moved somewhere else now and that Area 51 is old news......


.

reply to post by darpa999


No civilian airliners can not fly near Area 51. I know that satellites can take photos of Area 51 so im not sure where the cut off line is. Then again satellites don't have to be overhead to take photos. It would be something you would have to look up.

And yes it is restricted. You can't get onto the base alive unless you have the proper clearance.

Sure I remember one of Gariac's threads saying that a British Airways jet had to fly through the restricted airspace of the test site as it got diverted...I'll have a look

Yeah I was right
www.abovetopsecret.com...

British Airways flight BAW282 flies within 17 miles of Groom Lake Probably due to odd weather near Las Vegas, BAW282 was routed over the Nellis range.

[edit on 23-3-2010 by Pockets]

I remember a video on youtube of two old ladies just barrelling into Area 51 being filmed by 2 or 3 guys in a SUV, kicking up huge dust clouds with their car being chased by a Area 51 goon in a SUV

RIP Grandmas



[edit on 23-3-2010 by star in a jar]

Oh yes....this reminds me of something else that i was once listening to on Live ATC under Los Angeles Center sectors 16 and 34...

It was this SWISS flight from LA to Zurich and the odd thing was, that LA Center handed them off to Nellis Control on 126.650.

This leads me to my question.....

Is Nellis certified to handle commercial traffic???? I did not know that they can open up their frequencies to commercial airliner traffic though...
That sounded very very odd to me since LA Center (Sectors 16 and 34) handle most of traffic from NE of Daggett through about the Bryce Canyon area....But this was my first time hearing LA Center to tell a SWISS jetliner to contact Nellis Control....

I thought that Nellis Control handles ONLY military and Janet flights up in that area including the Red Flag Operations....

So let me ask you guys this....Can Nellis Control open up there airspace or frequency to handle commercial flights in that area?

The SWISS jetliner did there routine route from LAX by going flying over DAGGETT, then LAS, so they did not overfly any part of the restricted area, but why would LA Center handed them off to the Nellis Control frequency???

I have the recorded file in MP3 format, I just wish I knew how to post it here with the ecaxt time of the hand off...

Thanks for the replies.

Nellis Control handles the civilian air traffic around the range. The controllers are military. I don't think the government would want civilians seeing the air traffic over the range. ;-)

Military and civilian flights both talk to Nellis Control. There is an additional control known as "control" on an unpublished frequency that control the traffic over the range for the Janets or whatever plane is landing at Groom. Ultimately, the plane gets handed over to Groom tower, which is known as "tower" on the radio.

The air traffic going along route 95 (just west of the range) is clearly under Nellis control. I haven't monitored the rest of the commercial traffic enough to know the boundaries. I have caught several commercial pilots attempting to talk to Groom tower over the years. I suspect they park a radio on Groom tower to snoop and then use then use that radio by mistake when attempting to talk to ATC.

While I'm at it, I have to say once again there is zero evidence that the charter of Groom Lake has changed. It is not shut down and moved elsewhere. If anything, it has been expanded over the last two years. Just witness the large triangular tower and the new hangar.

photo of Nellis ATC station on this page

Janet audio

red flag audio

i love listening to klas on liveatc.net (am right now actually).

ive heard the janets a few times, depending on what code they tell is the direction they are going.

i have found a site which tells all the details of it, but I cant personally confirm this information for obvious reasons. you can find it easily on any major search engine.

just because its a military base, doesnt mean they cant talk to civilian flights. its just a frequency, posted on faa sectional maps non the less.

what i found really funny (disturbing, derranged, or just for fun) was that on microsoft flight sim x, you can actually fly one of the janet planes to area 51, and details all flight plan and everything for you on how to get there and where to turn... everything (i guess its real, its a sim). only thing is when you are flying to, you keep seeing ufos (obviously alien craft), and upon entering area-51 airspace, you see a whole lot more. you actually park on the tarmac beside giant motherships.

its probably for fun more than disclosure, but i found it odd. there's another mission where you take of from (i believe) nellis to intercept alien ufos.

who knows? i love it tho.

check out liveatc.net

1) Just because they SAY it isn't being used for that anymore, doesn't mean it isn't...It is still perfectly capable of performing this role.

2) They've added (and continue to add) new facilities, runways, etc. there...so they are definitely doing something there.

3) It's still got the same security and restrictions around it.

4) Just because another location is being used for it, doesn't mean this one isn't also. I know, right? Having two test locations? I'd wager there are even more...

I had just flown that mission on FSX. The only thing that is, that the controller tell you to desend to 6000 feet before the airport which would be at least 15 miles out.....Way too too low.....

Originally posted by darpa999
I had just flown that mission on FSX. The only thing that is, that the controller tell you to desend to 6000 feet before the airport which would be at least 15 miles out.....Way too too low.....

yeah i thought that too.

i thought the alien ships were creative though

here is the entire fly-through in the sim... with radio and everything. your "co-pilot" even tells you to not talk about what you see.

Yes, I had gone through that flight on FSX game. I am getting addicted to it!!! But, mine is not a B737....Its a Dassault Falcon 7X......
You can change the type of aircraft you want....

So does anyone know please on what the restrictive altitudes over the Area 51 complex?

Is it from the ground-up to 100,000 feet?

thanks.

[edit on 1-4-2010 by darpa999]

I'm only guessing but I presume the restricted airspace altitudes will be as high as what the F-16's can manage which are currently in use there.

Therefore F-16's can do about 30,000–40,000 ft, so a educated guess would be around this range.

Difficult question to answer.

reply to post by darpa999

reply to post by chrisbowman1990


The F-16 ceiling exceeds 50kft. Beyond 50kft, the sources all differ on the ceiling. The F-16 wiki has it as 60kft, but you know how that goes. The ceiling itself is a funny number since planes have often exceeded the ceiling, such as the F-104 exceeding 100kft.

The thing is with overhead observation is at some point you leave what they call breathable atmosphere. The atmosphere is what makes photography difficult, not the altitude itself. So beyond 2.5 to 3 miles, it's all the same, so just use a satellite.

Some amateurs in the UK have been doing their own version of the early recon weather balloons that the US until the Soviets got one and made a stink. Balloons keep rising until they break, maybe 100kft. KDRA releases weather balloons near the range at least daily. I found one of the radiosondes hiking around the area near Hancock Summit.

Im sorry, but Area 51 is not considered to be restrictive anymore.
That was back in the 60's through the 80's.