Does a Killer Live in Your Home?

Originally posted by Silcone Synapse
reply to post by DaMod

 

Its funny we claim to have domesticated cats...but I have to wonder-do they think that they have domesticated us?

I cannot rule it out.

You have just figured out one the biggest conspiracies on this planet...
Cats rule and dogs drool.I was afraid to mention this...pssst,the cats
are sleeping right now so,I can talk.I am owned by my cats and they
keep me a prisoner in my home.They make me sift their litter everyday.
They make me feed them fancy feast cat food three times a day.If I
am too slow in feeding them,they try to knock me off my feet by rubbing
against my legs.I nearly fell one time because of this.Help me please,
the cats are taking over the planet.I have to go now,I hear them
stirring ,it's almost time for their dinner...

Originally posted by JIMC5499

Originally posted by bookreader


What actions would you be willing to take to protect wildlife?

Killing cats. Don't get me wrong, I'm not out to kill someone's pet. Where I live we have way too many ferral cats running around. I believe that a cat should be licensed, just like a dog. I have no problem with returning someone's pet to them. If it doesn't have a license, it should be fair game. I know of five local kids who have had to under go rabies shots because they were bitten by cats. If a dog had done the same thing, there would have been a search and charges filed against the owner.

I agree about the licensing.

We have three cats (one with three legs) and make sure they are inside each evening, and make sure they are well fed. They are great at catching mice, of which we have an infestation (running along the sideboards, in the oven, behind the fridge) and don't stalk our four cockatiels. Our three dogs see off any other cats that happen to venture onto our property.

While we can't absolutely control our cats, we try to offer them all they need, keep them occupied, play with them etc and they don't appear to be interested in birds, only mice. I can't say that with any certainty however, just through observation.

It is important, also, I believe, to neuter your pets 9unless you intend to breed from them) as there are more than enough 'surplus' pets at animal shelters etc.

It is also very important to ensure your cat is immunised from feline AIDS as once they get this there is no return.

My partner is an emergency Vet Nurse. We get to lookm after many recovering animals (have a 4 day old Cocker Spaniel purebreed at the moment that we are hand-raising).

Ceretainly however, in New Zealand we do have a great problem with feral cats/dogs etc marauding our native bird population, which is also why I believe it is important to neuter your pets so as not to add to the feral population.

I have my cats testicles in a jar and dog testicles and uterus in other jars. Fascinating, and a great topic of discussion

Originally posted by aorAki

I have my cats testicles in a jar and dog testicles and uterus in other jars. Fascinating, and a great topic of discussion

So about the...

on second thoughts I cant actually start the conversation.

Not happening, my mind has stopped functioning

Just joking.



[edit on 22-3-2010 by XXXN3O]

Yep, you're absolutely right. We have two "killers" in our house. They kill rats and mice, and the occasional snake. I tried to discourage them from killing snakes, as snakes take down rodents also.

yep, we feed and care for and love two "killers". They kill. It's their JOB.

I have a neighbor who has 4 cats. She's always calling me to help her corral them. I tell her point blank that only an idiot tries to herd cats. Of course I'm telling her this while I'm out there trying to do just that!!

Zindo

heh yeah cats are the bane of wildlife... my ass.

You want to know what animals do the most harm to ecosystems, especially here in my own country.

Domestic dogs, ferrets/weasels, rats and possums in that order. Feral cats come in a distant number 6.

I own 9 cats (neutered and spayed), on a large property, 4 of our cats are rescued feral kittens who are now adults and hunt every night. They catch roughly 2-6 birds amongst all 9 of them once ever couple of weeks... that is in a property covered in trees and absolutely saturated with bird life due to lots of fruit bearing trees (figs, apples, peachs, blue berries etc). During summer and spring they catch a good deal of baby fledglings and hatchlings but it hasnt effected the bird population in the property.

They catch on average 2-3 mice every fortnight amongst em, with the occasional butterfly. Along with 1-2 rats every 6 months or so, 1 rabbit on occasion and we once found the leg of a large sea bird on the back lawn (no idea how they got it).

Despite this number, the birds still nest in the trees around the property and still dig for worms and raid our fruit trees within feet of sleeping (and awake) cats.

The thing with cats is, in the wild where food is scarce and the cat has to hunt continuously to survive (ie no rubbish bins or hand outs) they are solitary. Have very large, spread out territories, high infant mortality rates and are very territorial ie if you release a 'catch and release' neutered or spayed feral cat back into its territory it will continue to keep other cats out until it dies of old age (which tends to be longer when neutered)... with out being a breeding issue. Which is ultimately the best way to solve feral cat problems... catch, neuter and realize, thankfully its an idea thats catching on.

Incidentally our food storage area and garage got over run with over 100 mice last year, and it took me personally 8 months to finally get rid of them with the help of the cats and mouse traps... and thats the thing, cats often keep the other real pest in check, mice and rats who WILL eat bird eggs and reptiles.

And lets not forget that little black plague incident a number of centuries ago interesting that it happened after and during a period of time when the cat was being persecuted and eradicated to the point of stupidity because of superstition.

As to the article... that naturalist is an idiot.

In the newsletter, Barrett wrote: "Outdoor, free-roaming cats and feral domestic cats stress, injure, maim, orphan and kill incredible numbers of native wildlife species ranging from insects (butterflies, dragonflies) to small mammals (mice, voles, chipmunks, squirrels) and of course birds."

Oh please... butterflies?, the acrobatics a cat requires to hunt them is astounding, and only a very few can do it with any real impact and I know this since I have a cat that is a expert butterfly hunter, plucking a monarch out of the air with one paw after leaping 5 foot straight up is no easy feat for ordinary cats. Their worried they kill mice and voles?!... the cats natural food source. As for birds... birding is NOT a natural hunting practice for cats, its also harder than mousing. The impact on bird life is minuscule compared to rodent.

feral domestic cats?.. a feral cat IS a wild domestic

Barrett says it's wrong to let domestic cats outside, where they attack birds, get into fights, risk being hit by cars and spread disease.

He also argues that neutering feral cats does little to reduce their numbers, and cites arguments by animal experts that neuter-release programs are inhumane because they expose released cats to neglect, abuse and death by trauma.

Again, only some cats hunt birds and its far less successful than mousing. Cats define territory by fighting, and fighting only happens when the regular non contact stand off fails or its two cats that havent meet before in a territorial dispute.

Hit by cars?, like hedgehogs, birds, mice, foxes, possums, badgers, snakes, insect swarms, kangaroos, elephants (ok that ones stupid) but sheesh... it happens (We lost one of our own cats to a car 4 years ago). Its unavoidable.

So, to Barrett taking an already feral cat that hunts and lives on its own merit and is un tamable, removing its ability to breed then returning it to its previous life exposes it to neglect, abuse and death by trauma... isnt that what its already had to put up with and survived. Only now it can deter new feral cats into the area with out increasing the population directly with reduced aggression, and also because females no longer go through the male attracting yowling period every 6 months, wandering male cats pass on through.

Disease?.. what the handful of diseases that only effect cats like feline HIV?

Barrett wrote: "Neuter-release programs perpetuate and reinforce the misguided belief that it is OK for pet owners to allow domestic cats outdoors, when in reality indoor-only cats typically are healthier and live longer lives."

Bollocks... pure and simple. The life span is no different between a neutered indoor and a neutered outdoor cat, death can come on suddenly regardless of where they live. But the quality of life between the two is different, the outdoor cat can be a cat, the indoor one is nothing but a prisoner. So to preserve nature, the 'nature' of a cat, who itself is part of nature, has to be suppressed?

Ive seen these types of arguments many times before, and its usually brought up by people who have never owned a pet, are ignorant to the reality and history with animals, and who think that nature should play fair and PC like humanity does.

Leave cats alone damn it! I just find it bizarre that this Barrett person is against the only real logical and proper solution to the feral cat issue... namely 'neuter, catch, release'... they are either stupid, or deliberately ignoring the benefits that it implies, to ensure that cats are made to vanish from the canvas of their pristine fairly land nature they see each morning through their kitchen window.

Yes I have a feline bias .. but im also a lover of all animals, I just subscribe to reality.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by BigfootNZ]

reply to post by ZindoDoone


Good man,get out there and HERD those cats.

They got you good brother.

Hehee they control US it seems.
_________________________________________________________________

Originally posted by mamabeth
You have just figured out one the biggest conspiracies on this planet...

SSshHH! Do not spill the beans Bro!
What you speak of is classified-and you WILL recieve a visit if you continue to expose the reality.

The cats it seems are not what they seem,never mind the owls.

Originally posted by BigfootNZ
but im also a lover of all animals.

Of course you are, you're a Kiwi

How are those velcro gloves holding up?


I agree with most of what you have said. The bigger problem is humans.




[edit on 22-3-2010 by aorAki]

Originally posted by aorAki

Originally posted by BigfootNZ
but im also a lover of all animals.

Of course you are, you're a Kiwi

How are those velcro gloves holding up?


I agree with most of what you have said. The bigger problem is humans.


[edit on 22-3-2010 by aorAki]

Eh velcro gloves? havent a clue what your on about... seriously.

But yeah the real big problem are the humans, the idiots that get a kitten, dont have it neutered due to some stupid reason, they end up with a litter of kittens which they then dump, or they dump the pregnant mother... which is sort of how we got our last cat... as a kitten from the bottom of a long drop toilet at a beach (i mean who dumps a kitten into a long drop toilet!). Or they find it to hard to look after so they dump the cat at the side of a country road in the middle of no where... which is oddly how we got our 3rd cat of our recent 9, 8 years ago.

I just have a problem with these 'naturalists' who spend all their time looking at birds and butterfly's through binoculars, and think that creature that kills little furry things or pretty birds and insects is bad for nature. Its a bizarre set of reality blinders I tell ya.

An they usually have some ulterior motive to justify.

Edit:- oh and I mean it... what do you mean by velcro gloves?

Edit2:- Errr ok just read your 'testicles in a jar' comment... really? dang.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by BigfootNZ]

Rodents are in no danger of dying out any time soon. Nor are birds.

I have had cats and always let them roam. Cats hunt and that's all there is to it. The neighbours with very nice gardens do not mind the cats keeping the bunnies away from their veges. They put up with the odd carcass by burying it in their garden.

I've never seen a cat kill a squirrel. I doubt it happens very often. The cats I've had were all different personalities and tastes. One like birds. One like rodents and rabbits. And a third only liked to go fishing in a neighbour's goldfish pond. Never saw him eat a mouse. This is the only one we had problems with complaints because apparently this guy paid money for those fish.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by TheComte]

I have cats. I have had live birds in my house, little mousies, big huge rats (dead) and twice a little live baby possum. I finally put bells on their collars so they will warn the wildlife they are out and hunting. No more critters after the bells.

My mama cat will bring me things like rubber bands, plants and leaves, and one time it was pouring the rain and she was at the window looking out. I said to her, "if you are going out please bring me back a worm. (she had also brought me worms before) well she went out the window and a half hour later she was back, soaked to the bone, with a huge worm in her mouth! She dropped it at my feet and I thanked her and then took the worm out to the garden. The point is - she listened to me! Blew me away :-)

Year 4,003,521 AD:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/79b85dd8c1c7.jpg[/atsimg]

Regardless of how brutal their killing methods may seem it's still a lot more humane than a glue trap. Have you ever seen a mouse that's been stuck to one of those for a week? They also keep other introduced species like rabbits in check. My neighborhood would have been overrun by those cute little furry eating machines. And some of my neighbors who use poison have inadvertently killed protected animals like owls and eagles which prey on squirrels and rabbits.

I'll take cats over inhumane traps and poisons any day. They provide a service and earn their keep. It's a symbiotic relationship.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


oh oh oh god someone messed with my friends in catland

just stop please ; if an animal is well feed, it doesnt need to kill randomly ...

ooops

[edit on 22-3-2010 by aorAki]

damn NZ internet.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by aorAki]

Originally posted by BigfootNZ


Edit:- oh and I mean it... what do you mean by velcro gloves?

Edit2:- Errr ok just read your 'testicles in a jar' comment... really? dang.

[edit on 22-3-2010 by BigfootNZ]

Re: velcro gloves: it's a common 'insult' from Aussies who like to suggest that we have unnatural relations with sheep and use velcro gloves to hold them steady, to which I answer: "In New Zealand we shear sheep, while in Aussie they share them".

Re: edit 2: yep, I'm fascinated by natural history etc and figured this would be interesting, which it is. Also have a large bone collection including a couple of purchases off medical students ...Human skull anyone?

Originally posted by Faiol
reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

 

oh oh oh god someone messed with my friends in catland

just stop please ; if an animal is well feed, it doesnt need to kill randomly ...

Define well fed, for some people well fed is a McDonald's hamburger, for other its caviar.

Variety is the spice of life and honestly if someone gave me a choice between a bowl of Fancy Feast Cat Food and some fresh raw road kill that would be a hard decision for me. At least you know what's in the Road Kill!

We as a species spend so much time trying to be civilized and pretend our own animal primordial origins shouldn't be a factor in our behavoir and that we know better than nature that we are literally destorying entire ecosystems in the process and the planet along with it.

Mankind has hunted more creatures to extinction than any other single species and we are really going to sit here and say cats must learn to be nicer to other creatures while our tax dollars rain high explosive bombs down from the sky like candy half way around the world.

Personally I think humans could learn a lot more from animals they can learn from us.

What they do is natural to them, what we do is so unnatural it requires a lifetime of education and training and about 600,000 laws to regulate it!

I can't believe someone actually siezed upon this nonsense as nothing but a MONEY MAKING idea.

My little snowball would never do such a thing. 94 cats to kill 5,000 birds... thats a hell of a lot of killing these cats are doing. surely it can't be just cats, i'm sure there are other factors involved that arent being mentioned.

reply to post by theknuckler


That's only 52.631578947368421052631578947368 per cat.

What I want to know is what happens to the 95 birds who have been crippled and only are 0.36821052631578947368421052632 still in tact?

It seems to me that if the bleeding hearts of the world really wanted to help it would be doing something for these poor crippled birds who now have to face the rest of their life at only 0.36821052631578947368421052632 of optimal performance!