Warning: Short to the point post ahead...

I believe we have reached CRITICAL MASS in America.

A Critical Mass of non critical thinkers. I am one of them. Do not be led astray. Retrain your brain (those of you who are not critical thinkers). But please don't take my word for it.


Mod Edit: All Caps – Please Review This Link.

[edit on 5-3-2010 by GAOTU789]

reply to post by recycled


What are you basing this belief on? I don't see that kind of shift in the streets do you?

Momentum does seem to be building, trends being more entrenched and established but I don't see a tipping point at this stage.

Simply an escalating trend.

What makes you feel we are at at this precise juncture of time at that tipping point?

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by recycled

 

What are you basing this belief on? I don't see that kind of shift in the streets do you?

Actually, check this out...

My niece is going to college. She took an astronomy course and needed help. She of course comes to me and we start. real basic stuff...

She first off was shocked to find out that we revolve around the sun...I thought she was joking at first, but nope...she was truely flabbergasted...needless to say, everything else was mind blowing to her.

She graduated high school with honors btw...

She then talked to her mother (my sister) on the phone and my sister was also blown away by this revelation...

There is something very concerning going on in...not sure, perhaps our school system...

How can a person lose their knowledge soo quickly? I know for a fact they both were taught the basics of astronomy and they both did well in school).

I am not one to fully believe in the whole chem trails are purposefully dumbing people down with stupid spray...but hmm, I might have to reread some of those threads...something isn't right...its like forgetting the alphabet order.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Critical thinking consists of three steps:
* 1. Becoming aware that assumptions exist
* 2. Making assumptions explicit
* 3. Assessing their accuracy

What Does the Absence of Thinking Critically Look Like?
* We blindly reproduce the damaging reactions we have learned.
* We blindly accept at face value all justifications given by organizations and political leaders.
* We blindly believe TV commercials.
* We blindly trust political commercials.
* We blindly accept and say that if the textbook says it it must be so.
* We blindly accept and say that if the organization does it it must be right.

the above copy pasted from www.livestrong.com...

TPTB have explicitly enacted a plan they have been working on for who knows how long. Some would say it started with the dawn of the industrial revolution, and implemented in the states with the adoption of the Prussian public schooling model, specifically designed to "train" consumers to bring America to the top of the food chain. I am one who adheres to this idea myself. I am a product of the American public schooling system, one in which critical thinking skills are indeed NOT implemented as part of the curriculum.
There are a thousand different directions I could go with the theory of "HOW", mass media MK ULTRA programing, the heroification syndrom our American textbooks seem to suffer from when teaching history, teaching to the test in public schools, lack of parental supervision, women's lib.

The point is, stop any random stranger on the street, ask them any question you choose that involves critical thinking skills and be amazed.

People are slinging dis-information left and right, and most folks can't tell their head from a hole in the ground. If they were able to think critically they would be able to objectively take in information, evaluate, review and research it form themselves before swearing it as reality. Do you think our nation got into the mess it's in because the folks on the bottom holding up the cake topper had their critical thinking caps on? I mean if they had they would have let go of the thing a long time ago.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by recycled

 

What are you basing this belief on? I don't see that kind of shift in the streets do you?

Actually, check this out...

My niece is going to college. She took an astronomy course and needed help. She of course comes to me and we start. real basic stuff...

She first off was shocked to find out that we revolve around the sun...I thought she was joking at first, but nope...she was truely flabbergasted...needless to say, everything else was mind blowing to her.

She graduated high school with honors btw...

She then talked to her mother (my sister) on the phone and my sister was also blown away by this revelation...

There is something very concerning going on in...not sure, perhaps our school system...

How can a person lose their knowledge soo quickly? I know for a fact they both were taught the basics of astronomy and they both did well in school).

I am not one to fully believe in the whole chem trails are purposefully dumbing people down with stupid spray...but hmm, I might have to reread some of those threads...something isn't right...its like forgetting the alphabet order.

Not only does your local (assuming it's local since you could 'assist' her) college need to be burned, so does your grade school. I can honestly say that I think this is either a load of bull, or she was home schooled by a bunch of plebians.

reply to post by Ecidemon


She was in Georgia and moved back here to Florida...I visited there and there were plenty of decent people but a bit backwards.

I have no answers to this beyond, something is up.

I went to private school for half my life, then public school...then university, travelled overseas to further my education, came back to a bunch of glazed over boob tube watchers...its a bit unnerving to tell the truth...but I simply put that down as being in the deep south.

Originally posted by Ecidemon
I can honestly say that I think this is either a load of bull, or she was home schooled by a bunch of plebians.

Ask everyone you know who graduated from an American public high school after 2001 if they know how to "carry the remainder in long division." Make a poll of it. If they say yes, then test them. If they reach for a calculator of some kind, or they can't write out an example, mark them as a "no". Keep asking, until you find someone who can. Then find out where they learned it. Cause it sure wasn't in a public school.

What passes for education in this country is a disgrace to all of humanity. Our predecessors would roll over in their graves to see the abomination that is the American public school curriculum. And for those who were fortunate enough to have critical thinkers in your immediate surrounding growing up in this country in the last 50 years, props to you. I believe our nation of people dropped the ball, fell for "freedom" in the form of washing machines, became believers in the pursuance of perspiration free lifestyles. Gone are the days of growing intellect in the name of prosperity. Now we grow suburbs.

Originally posted by davidgrouchy

Originally posted by Ecidemon
I can honestly say that I think this is either a load of bull, or she was home schooled by a bunch of plebians.

Ask everyone you know who graduated from an American public high school after 2001 if they know how to "carry the remainder in long division." Make a poll of it. If they say yes, then test them. If they reach for a calculator of some kind, or they can't write out an example, mark them as a "no". Keep asking, until you find someone who can. Then find out where they learned it. Cause it sure wasn't in a public school.

This I accept as a sad but predictable progression in our world...the more machines become part of our lives, the less people will be able to do what us old farts (above 30...heh) were forced to do naturally. I remember someone posting a thread here about a 8th grade quiz from 1893 or some close year..and it was just stupid hard...I realized even with my belief that I was educated, a educated person at the turn of the 20th century would look at me as lacking in some of the most basic factors of a well rounded education...granted, I knew more advanced stuff than them, but my basics alone was dodgy.

I wonder if in 100 years, people will be able to even add numbers together without a machine doing the work for them...yet meeting them, they would label me a idiot for not knowing how to...whatever the hell they do in 100 years...enter into 4 different virtual realities while having coffee with a friend at the same time or whatnot.

reply to post by SaturnFX


Yes machines are a factor but it is worse than that. When I discovered it and tried to quickly tutor the child in question on how to do it I was told.

"I'll get in trouble if I do it that way."

Nine years of follow ups, talking with parents, and grand parents. First Dispbeleif, then denial, then anger.... I saw one grandfather (who just _knew_ I was bonkers) a year later. He quickly came up to me with a long face.

"It's true."

He looked broken. I felt sad. Children who try to carry the remainder are reprimanded.

[edit on 5-3-2010 by davidgrouchy]

reply to post by recycled

People are slinging dis-information left and right, and most folks can't tell their head from a hole in the ground.

Good news I never went to public or private school so I am not affected by these limitations, but am in fact a life long out of the box thinker.

The plan you are referring to dates back approximately 2,000 years and were written by either Julius or Augustus Caesar but probably involved both.

Rome has faked its own death a half a dozen times since then, and currently owns all but 4 of the nations on the globe. All the rest are bound by the same system of international commerce, law and financial infrastructure.

The only thing that’s about to die is a whole lot of people Rome no longer needs.

Don’t worry though, I am on this, and plan to have it all taken care of by late summer.

Go back to sleep it was just a little nightmare you were having!

Critical mass with this herd? Not going to happen any time soon.

Just oversea experience: during my techno travels and encounters I realized that average Frenchmen is better educated than average Briton at least in terms of "factual" scientific knowledge (geography, chemistry, physics, astronomy ....). Solid data (and ability to distinguish them) are base on which critical thinking can blossom out.
There was communists reign during my elementary school years. If I compare it with results of "free" western education, the results are quite similar or better then in west. That is because humanities were conflicting with official ideology so the school system (teachers do not want to lie) was directed to hard scientific facts. Situation was quite same after 1989 when I attended high school (chemistry). Both type of schools were based on "fact" learning and both were not provoking critical thinking. First time I encountered critical thinking as goal of school was at university - and to be honest it is not prevalent direction even among universities here in Czech republic.
Back to OP: here, in Europe, I do not see critical mass forming. Now you are more oppressed in USA then in Europe I guess ... Maybe less then 10% of Europeans think about monetary system and real history of wars and money. MSM BS poisoned our consciousness.

I blame the TV, I have found one cannot hold a deep coversation with someone who is watching their favourite TV program, even if one id a visitor, it just cannot be done, augments starting with 'well, listen next time I tell you that bla bla bla' ( perhaps I should start with 'got a juicy bit of gossip for you)?

I do wonder what they are teaching in schools here in the US now. Basic science and geography seem to not be taught at all based on some of the new threads popping up here on ATS. I wonder if the quality of the teachers and the subjects being taught are so dumbed down in some areas of the country that the kids end up not knowing nearly as much as everyone else in other countries. I'm not sure though.

I remember when I was in High School I was surprised when one of the other kids called me a genius and I don't think he was joking. I was not a genius. I was probably more on par with what I considered normal by international standards assuming those standards haven't declined as well. I did think it was sad when at one time in High School, a friend and I ended up in an algebra class that seemed to have a dumb teacher. My friend told me I think we must be in the wrong class. He transferred to a different class. The teacher wasn't very bright. I must have said aloud that I could teach the class better after I got bored with the snail like pace of the teacher. The teacher actually let me do that for 2 or 3 days. The teacher told me I was doing very well. I thought to myself, what is this world coming to?

In college, it was very easy to see how far below par that High school was. Teachers were very good. I ended up with some of the hardest but very knowledgeable teachers. I'm not sure how that kept happening. I kept running into other students who told me so. They either were transferring out of the class to a different easier teacher or transferred in because in one case, he said he already took the course and made an A with a different teacher but said he didn't learn anything.

I took an Astronomy course as an elective (hobby of mine). Others in the class were taking it as a required course. I found it very interesting and never thought I would learn so much basic science as I did. I think it would be helpful if a lot more people knew some basic science. The teacher covered everything from fusion processes inside stars to weather circulation patterns. He went over different possible structures of the universe to analyzing spectrography of star light to determine what stars are composed of. There was an Astronomy lab with that course that involved telescope time. I enjoyed the views.

What will it take for America to reach the tipping point? I will list a few things that I think could do it.



1-Unemployment benefits stopping I think it is the most crucial one.


2-Very large scandal like the president being born in Kenya.


3-Collapse of the dollar


4-Taking away Gun rights


5-Large scale attack on home soil


6-If they decided to get rid of the constitution.


But aside from the reasons I just posted I don't think the apathy in America will grow into anything unless the standard of living really drops. I think they have us in a slow death spiral to soften the blow slowly. But I could be wrong. I think they will actually try and bring us together with war. It is the most logical thing to do at this point and enemies are a plenty. It a shame when all they really need to do is seriously invest in the American workers and everything would be fine. Like roads and bridges and building new schools.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
reply to post by recycled

 

Good news I never went to public or private school so I am not affected by these limitations, but am in fact a life long out of the box thinker.

Are you saying you never went to school, that seems almost imposible? your posts are well structured and seems to be writen by the hand of a well educated thinker...

He looked broken. I felt sad. Children who try to carry the remainder are reprimanded.

reply to post by davidgrouchy


Where in the H&%% did this happen? Wherever it is, you folks should raise a huge stink. This is not right at all.

I'm a public school teacher. I'm a critical thinker. I'm constantly trying to learn new things to bring to my students. And honestly, its so discouraging to read posts on how our education system is failing our students. It is, I agree. But some of us are doing our damnedest to change this, and its like fighting an uphill battle sometimes.

I just went through a very intensive course on teaching mathematics to elementary-aged children.... and one of the things this course was very determined to changed was the mindset that "there's only one way to do maths."

When we teach maths in my school, (and, honestly, by 'we' I mean the newer generation of teachers) we show the students several different ways to solve problems, multiply, divide, etc. The emphasis lies on the answer....not how the person got that answer (so long as the method used was a logical and correct method and not a lucky guess, that does happen).

To someone else's question about knowing the earth revolved around the sun.

In my fifth grade class this year, one of my students came to me and asked when the world became round. No lie.

Sigh.

I wonder if the quality of the teachers and the subjects being taught are so dumbed down in some areas of the country that the kids end up not knowing nearly as much as everyone else in other countries. I'm not sure though.

reply to post by orionthehunter


It's complex.

It's not that teachers or subjects are being dumbed down at all. But the problem is public schools measure student growth and achievement (and therefore school performance) using standardized tests.

Standardized tests do NOT accurately measure how much a child has learned. Why? Because there's no way to take out the emotional aspects of the tests. A child who knows the material, makes great grades in class, but has test anxiety will most likely bomb the test. I've seen it happen time and time again. And even when they retake the test and pass it with flying colors, only the first score counts.

Schools are tied to the government for funding. And the government requires the students to raise their scores a certain # of points each year. If they don't, then several things can happen.....including eventually shutting the school down or cutting funds.

That might sound like an ideal solution. If the kids aren't learning, it must be because the teachers aren't teaching, right?

Not necessarily. You see, our hands are tied behind our back. We're given the curriculum from the state and that is what we must teach. If its not in the curriculum and you get caught teaching it, you can lose your job.

We're also given students with widely diverse backgrounds and abilities, and they are ALL expected to achieve the same amount. But children aren't robots. They don't learn the same, don't have the same skills or interests, nor the same talents.

Now consider another factor. I'm going to describe a typical classroom in my district. This is a fourth grade class, 23 kids. Of those 23, approximately 18 will be on free/reduced lunch status...which means their household income is so low they qualify. Its quite likely they are one step above homelessness. And we do have homeless students in our schools. Perhaps as many as 20 will come from a "broken" home life; divorce, step-parents and sibilings, etc. In today's society, I can generally expect at least half the students to have a close relative in prison....and its considered a plus. About 5 of the students will be active gang members, with another 2 or 3 at risk for joining. Most likely there will be at least 1 who drinks, 1 who smokes, and 2 who use drugs. And 2 or 3 are sexually active (yeah, I know its 4th grade but you'd be surprised). Not to mention how many children witness or receive abuse.

Now, take all those things into consideration. Are you really surprised some students don't learn? Why should they care about simplifying fractions when there's all this other turmoil in their life?

The school system is broken....but I have hope we can still repair it. But teachers cannot do it on our own. We've got to have the help of parents, family, neighbors, and society in general. Its crucial to our kids, and to our future.

reply to post by smyleegrl


You are true hero. Situation in CZ is not so bad but going same direction. To be clear I give priority to public schools (I'm socialist/anarchist). Model, which work in France, is really appealing for me. It is rigid, state driven, centralist - but it somehow works. Earlier it was said: current high school is less than high school 100 years ago. "Nobody" need Latin or ancient Greek at present time - same as 100 years ago. Still there were good reason to teach dead languages. Students were confronted with different paradigms. And of course if you have basics of Latin than you can learn other "European" languages much easier. Bla bla - I'm bit tired know and can not find proper words - sorry.

I am in no way knocking teachers. I am very grateful for the teachers who "see" what is going on and do their very best to try to create solutions to the issues that American students face. The problem seems to lie somewhere in the grey zone. I was talking with my daughters music teacher last week about the lack of communication between the teachers and parent teacher organizations in the school. He informed me it is da$n near impossible to get any teaching done these days due to the implementation of new laws and regulations around every corner. P.C. is the main agenda these days it seems in the schools. Growing brains seems to have been an after thought. So much emphasis is placed on maintaining safe environments for the children to learn in, that they are leaving the day totally safe, and totally uneducated.