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Originally posted by playswithmachines
reply to post by Amaterasu
TPTB will have you believe it's all nonsense, but it is there, & i have measured it, the 60gig number is not mine, but i see no reason to doubt it until i can do some more measurements.
Tom Bearden knows his stuff, believe me, he stated that if we can control ZPE, we can control energy & matter at will, we would literally become gods (i prefer the star-trek entity Q myself
Check out the only thread i have ever posted;
www.abovetopsecret.com...edit on 15-3-2011 by playswithmachines because: TypsetOne more thing, this technology is of course EXTREMELY dangerous, ever seen the film 'Forbidden Planet'? "Beware the monster from the Id"
Originally posted by Amaterasu
Interestingly, the plenum energy is negentropic in extraction. Temperature drop in the proximity of the extraction device is the characteristic signature, rather than heat production.
Originally posted by OnceReturned
Originally posted by Amaterasu
Interestingly, the plenum energy is negentropic in extraction. Temperature drop in the proximity of the extraction device is the characteristic signature, rather than heat production.
But heat is a measure of energy. That's why all energy sources are also heat sources. Petroleum products are burned, nuclear reactors heat water, solar power comes from the sun, and wind and hydro come from the friction of fast moving water and air (the friction produces heat when the molecules contact the turbines).
Temperature is proportional to the average kinetic energy of the molecules being measured. Higher kinetic energy is higher temperature, and lower temperature is lower kinetic energy. When a system cools off, the kinetic energy is decreasing and being converted to something else. The way that we extract power from systems is by exploiting a differential; the energy always moves from the component with higher energy/heat to the component of lower energy. As soon as something drops in temperature relative to its surroundings, it becomes an energy sink, not a source.
It's not possible for spontaneous cooling to be the same thing as energy production. Getting energy from anything increases heat in the extractor. High energy mechanical sources like wind and water heat up whatever is extracting energy from them by the transfer of kinetic energy. High energy chemical sources are always dependent on the breaking of high energy bonds, which releases energy. Even solar power heats up the solar panels. High energy electrons moving through wires heat up the atoms that they interact with. Nuclear energy - both fussion and fission - extract energy from matter by E=mc^2, when matter is converted to energy the energy heats up the surroundings, always.
The link between energy and heat is at the heart of all of the physical sciences and has been observed countless times without fail in every system that has ever been examined. Cold (relative to whatever the energy is being transfered to) energy sources don't exist. Energy would always flow into them instead of out of them: when you put something cold in a warmer environment, the cold thing warms up and the environment cools.
If the system doesn't produce mechanical energy, chemical energy, electrical energy or radiation, what does it produce? All of those energy sources are exothermic. The act of measuring a temperature drop consists of putting a thermometer into the target system and having the thermometer read a lower temperature. The reason that this happens is that the liquid in the thermometer loses kinetic energy and therefore decreases in volume. That energy goes into the thing being measured. This means that what is being measured is by definition endothermic. Endothermic things take energy in, they don't give energy off. Anything that cools down is an energy sink.
Without directing me to read a book, how does ZPE account for this fundamental contradiction?
Interestingly, the plenum energy is negentropic in extraction. Temperature drop in the proximity of the extraction device is the characteristic signature, rather than heat production. Rather than go chasing every Joule, it would be so much better to balance entropy with negentropy - and get phenomenal energy to use.
Originally posted by Chett
The problem with idealistic plans
is there always people about that will take advantage.
I truly believe the vast majority of people would love to simply live free and not bother anybody else, or be bothered.
But there are still those who will wish to insist that you follow their 'one and only true religion' or whatever their cause is.
Even the actual well meaning busy bodies cause nothing but trouble.
Case in point prohibition. Those that wanted to ban alcohol won and so came the mob etc.
Today so many are dull and mostly brain washed by mass media and bad education I am not at all sure they could even be taught decent ethics.
Guess I been around too long all I can see are dark clouds.
Originally posted by daviddiss
Wow, Amaterasu. That's going to take some time to digest fully. Still, if it's been fifty years in the making for you, a little time exploring around the topics you present seems a good idea.
Do you know of / can recommend any books on this topic to get a good overview?
There's clearly two main strands of thought being woven together here - and that's always where I start putting my skeptics hat on, which (sigh) usually means lots of research needed.
I.e.
- Possibility of drawing on energy without depleting resources
- How the disruption of the power bases (currently centered around finite energy resources) would lead to a fairer society
Thanks very much for giving a great introduction to the first point - I'll start exploring based on this, and the fascinating posts relating to active experimentation that have followed. Exciting stuff.
On the second point on how this would inevitably lead to a whole load of positive effects - well, people who crave power will find some way to ensure they have the upper hand.
The mentality of these people is such that if they lose control over finite resources of energy, they will find ways of limiting access to other resources, or create a 'need' for resources they can control.
Take a look at Apple - fabulous gadgetry, that a large proportion of people feel they 'need'. They then opt to control resources as much as possible, thus effectively inventing a power base.
Do I see them as evil? Well, having worked for them for a little while, they do resemble a cult, and those that do well there, find reasons to believe everything they are told. And they appear to have a policy of deliberate underresourcing to anyone who stays is willing to overwork to the nth degree. It was ultimately kind of creepy - a real experience. Still, that was back when I had my Windows Mobile phone (silly, I know, but it kept me sane - this was before Android came to prominence).
This is creeping into a separate post, so I'm just really making the point that while this is clearly an important area of exploration, it's one of a larger web of changes that are only now possible due to the amazing opportunity that the interconnectedness of the WWW gives us.
Open Source movement is now here to stay. Businesses and increasingly governments are being forced to change their model to a more open model. The ridiculous notion of building in a shelf-life when goods can be made to last for very little more is being questioned, and open source physical alternatives to machines (and I'm sure it will move to many other areas of our everyday lives) will start forcing businesses to subscribe to this model in order to remain profitable.
I'm not an expert on these technologies, but while it may seem like doom to some people, I have great hope for our future, because it's increasingly difficult to hide uncomfortable truths these days.
So thanks again for a great post, and leading me to a whole area of science I had previously not been aware of.
Originally posted by Khao5
Much applause to you!
I have enjoyed the read and am excited for what things may come of our world if what you say comes to fruition but I have a few thoughts when reading.
1, this energy source could take a very long time to be revealed so we may need to think of a plan until that time comes, if it comes.
, I can’t see how we can live having what we want for free and all be equal. If money becomes obsolete there will have to be another way to choose who gets to live in the manshion next to the great pyramids. What I mean to say is people will still want more than others but there has to be a limit.