The Catholic Amendments to the Constitution of the United States

Originally posted by mkultraangel
reply to post by concernedcitizan

 

I like the way you are thinking....especially the part about communities falling apart because of lack of cohesion...so of course they would never be a "Catholic led gov't" because that would require Italians, Irish, Latinos, and a whole mix of people (that have notoriously bad tempers) to get along

Hey, I resemble that remark!


I think its horrible how the Federal government uses our supposed "Freedom of Religion" to prevent societies built on religious principals from coming into existence.

Freedom my fat hairy *SNIP*

Originally posted by FortAnthem
To me the idea of living in a country that reflects my belief system sounds wonderful.

You left one out:

Church of Rome priests are allowed to choose 2 children a day for any sexual purpose the priests desire, and no one can stop them.

as indicated by the majority of readers with the topic scoring a total of 0 stars, i give such narrow minded opinion a thumbs down.

i was sincerely hoping the comment about heaven on earth was sarcasm, my deepest hopes were however, extinguished, as are the hopes for humanity. what your saying is basically you approve the idea of dictatorship and removal of freedom if the flag is that of the catholic church. if i could id be sick on your property

reply to post by FortAnthem


I'd like to answer your question in a respectful manner, as much as I disagree with some of your threads:

What I would like to ask the members is this: Wouldn't you prefer to live under a government that reflected your own belief system, whether that be Catholic, Baptist, atheist, secular or even satanist?

I'd rather live under a government that is not influenced in any form by any specific faith. In that case, I'd prefer a secular government that recognizes that people of every religion/faith have the right to build churches, mosques, etc and form their own schools, charities and think-tanks. After all, this is AMERICA and freedom applies to all Americans, regardless of whether a majority agrees with them or not.

Originally posted by FortAnthem

Imagine if we were able to set up our own provinces in which we had the freedom to live out our lives in accordance to our belief system, under a government that fosters and supports your beliefs. How great would that be?



[edit on 24-2-2010 by FortAnthem]

I'm sorry, perhaps I am a little slow...
Where do you live in the United States where you are unable to live out your life in accordance with your belief system, in regards to Roman Catholicism?

Originally posted by The Sword
reply to post by FortAnthem

 

I'd like to answer your question in a respectful manner, as much as I disagree with some of your threads:

I like when people disagree with my threads, it forces me to think and justify my position. Sometimes they have even made this hard headed Catholic change his mind on some subjects. Though, not many...

I'd rather live under a government that is not influenced in any form by any specific faith. In that case, I'd prefer a secular government that recognizes that people of every religion/faith have the right to build churches, mosques, etc and form their own schools, charities and think-tanks. After all, this is AMERICA and freedom applies to all Americans, regardless of whether a majority agrees with them or not.

Yeah, that's nice, we can build churches, schools and all of that BUT, try to carve out a piece of land where your faith is fostered and supported by your local government and the Feds will come in like a hammer to shut you down. Why is it illegal for a community to agree to support their religion through their government? Its like saying you have the freedom of religion but, then again, you don't have the right to form a religiously inspired community, even if everyone in that community agrees.

Edit to add: Thanks for adding me to your foes list, I haven't been foed in a while.

I was starting to think that nobody cared.

reply to post by thegoodearth

Where do you live in the United States where you are unable to live out your life in accordance with your belief system, in regards to Roman Catholicism?

You missed this part didn't you? : under a government that fosters and supports your beliefs.

That's where the Feds step in to stop you. Even if you tried to outlaw pornography in your community, the Feds would stomp on you for violating the right of "free expression" which they deem is more legitimate than the freedom of religion.

reply to post by FortAnthem


Are you suggesting that people be allowed to build communities like those at Ruby Ridge or Waco or perhaps Jonestown?

I was half-kidding there. Technically, I would think that mega-churches with bowling alleys, hotels and other amenities built in ARE communities in a way.

Originally posted by FortAnthem
Even if you tried to outlaw pornography in your community,

Why would you want to do that? if someone in your community wants to look at porn, what has that got to do with you?

reply to post by dereks


Also, it's not like a ban on pornography would actually work. Who would enforce it and how would they do so? Would they willingly violate the homes of their members to root it out? Wouldn't this border on fascism?

Originally posted by dereks

Why would you want to do that? if someone in your community wants to look at porn, what has that got to do with you?

Outlawing porn would support moral order in the community by removing the temptations to sin from the community. Sure, you probably couldn't keep people from surfing porn on the web but, you could prevent porn from being sold in the convenience stores and strip clubs from opening in your community.

Some places try to do this through zoning laws but they are often overturned by activist judges.

Originally posted by FortAnthem
Outlawing porn would support moral order in the community by removing the temptations to sin from the community.

Who decides this "moral order" Do you have the moral order police running around measuring how high girls skirts are, or arranging the stoning of people they do not like....

reply to post by FortAnthem


I think that if someone wants to open a strip club, they should be able to. The only thing is that it shouldn't be near a church or a school just out of common sense.

reply to post by The Sword


I believe that if a community wants to keep unwanted businesses out of their town, it should be their right, whether it be for moral reasons or even to protect the local businesses.

Communities are forced to accept anyone with the money to buy property to come in and do whatever they darn well please. If small towns were able to successfully stop the building of a Wal-Mart in their community, they would be able to protect their small community owned businesses from destruction. Instead, Wal-Mart comes in and destroys all of the small business owners and forces them to become wage-slaves to the machine. Sure, prices may have been higher before Wal-Mart but, all those small business owners and their employees could afford them before they were driven out of business by the big-box stores.

reply to post by FortAnthem


What if I want to spend my hard earned dollars in a strip club? Why should I have to contend with moralists that don't want a strip club within their boundaries? Where does it end? Will they ban the sale of alcohol next? Will they tell me that I can't listen to bands like Baroness and The Sword because they're the "devil's music"?

What if I pay taxes to live in that town? Shouldn't I have just as much of a say in what businesses can or cannot exist there?

It goes on and on and on.

Originally posted by FortAnthem
Wal-Mart comes in and destroys all of the small business owners and forces them to become wage-slaves to the machine. Sure, prices may have been higher before Wal-Mart but, all those small business owners and their employees could afford them before they were driven out of business by the big-box stores.

I suggest you watch Penn and Teller: Bull#! Wal-Mart episode

reply to post by The Sword


I think you're missing my point; I say people should be able to go off and create these communities somewhere if they wish and as long as everyone in that community agrees.

I'm not saying they should impose their beliefs on an already existing community if there are non-believers already living in that community.

Yes, there should be some limits to religious freedom as well; they should in no way condone violence against others like wife beatings, stoning and such. I discussed limitations on the freedom of religion here.

If someone violates a communities laws, they should be dealt with by the appropriate legal authorities, afforded the right to a fair trial and, of course be protected from cruel and unusual punishments.

Originally posted by Soylent Green Is People

Originally posted by FortAnthem

The following were created by Paul Blanshard, an anti-catholic activist, in order to outline what would become of the vaunted American Democracy if the Catholics were to gain political power....

Yeah...I don't think this would happen if "Catholics were to gain political power".

First of all, for most of this nation's history, the predominant faith for those in power has been Protestantism. The founding fathers were mostly Protestants, yet the constitution does not contain "strictly Protestant" laws and content. I don't know why Catholic lawmakers would be any different.

Secondly, there are a lot of Catholics who hold high office in this country, yet I have never heard of any of them suggesting "Catholic Amendments".

It seems to me that if Mr. Blanshard really believes this, then he is a radically-minded person who should not be taken seriously.

President Kennedy was a Catholic and he never pushed for any Catholic amendments and at the time being the first Catholic to become president, everyone was worried about this fact. When Kennedy met the Pope, instead of kissing his ring as is traditional for Catholics, he extended his hand to him to assert that although he was Catholic, his country and his people are not and will not bend down before any religion, regardless of personal beliefs.

As to the OP, I know I would rather live in a land that places a higher value on order, justice, and morals rather than a country ran strictly on religious beliefs. As long as the peace is kept, order is maintained and the general well being of the public is kept safe, then I wouldn't mind if religious leaders became political leaders and had statutes pasted that favored their ideology. However, I would be highly opposed to such laws that required religious exclusivity and elevated one religion over another as I see it as every person is free to worship or not worship how they see fit and although I might think my views are "correct" and "true", its not place to force them on someone else