Many worlds, many dimensions, many time-lines, lots of versions of us..

Great thread! I will have to watch those videos again though to try understand it better. S+F

Originally posted by Eye of Horus
Like I said this is a bit odd of what Ive been expriencing. If anyone has any idea if i'm visiting a parrell earth , or any other thoughts feel free you give me your insights.
Am off to bed now, being here its almost 3 am.
Thanks for the thread OP.

Mate - love your dream, it's great.

This is from another post I was writing elsewhere-

There are two things which I thing are prominent:


1. There are higher dimensions (I prefer to call these densities as they are different in frequency density)
2. There are parallel dimensions which are infinite but completely linked to you.



How the latter works is like this. Consciousness is like a never ending fractal, check out the mandelbrot for more info. The consciousness that is in you enables you to observe one reality that you are choosing to live, created by your beliefs, thoughts and your free will.

Every other possible reality is within your reach, just like the 'observer problem' in quantum physics explains. Each time you make a decision, there is an option which you decided not to choose, this in essence drives the reality you are in now and allows the un-chosen choice to stem another parallel dimension, but if you could see all potentials with your eyes, it would be like looking at yourself through a kaleidoscope, doing everything you could have possibly thought of. therefore there are infinite parallel realities.

If that is the case, then the process in which you think can control the dimensions from your point of view. Ok this may be a mind blow, but it's just my theory...

But from a higher dimension, time is not linear, so when you sleep, lets just pretend you go into the astral plane which is a space where time is not linear, you could possibly access your other potential realities which may be occurring whilst living in this reality. It's a cool concept!

Originally posted by Cosmicdjinn
Yes we have different timelines, and dimensions. But you are one entity, one energy, in the matrix you can exist unknowingly in all dimentions and times.

Yes, I learned this from Kryon. And I understand that we can learn to know these other selves/lives and access them. For instance, if you are experiencing poor health where you are now, but one of your selves in another dimension has perfect health, you can call forth the perfect health part of you.
Confusing? Somehow it makes perfect sense to me.

An ATS thread about the subject of a highly-promoted novel?

Coincidence? Viral marketing?

Hmm.

Transition by Iain Banks.

I have been thinking about this for a while. Just say there are millions of alternitive universes, and there are millions of me, and millions of everyone else on this planet. The thing that gets me is this.

That would have to mean that my parents got together so i could be here. Basically, that means we don't have a choice. I mean, the chances of my parents getting togther in another universe would be slim, as everything is by chance, unless, everything is not by chance, and there is a meaning to everything.

reply to post by Jay-morris

Actually, the Many Worlds hypothesis implies that everything that could have happened has happened in one of the many worlds. Most things have happened more than once, in fact.

So don't worry, you're not a statistical impossibility.

But you're right about one thing: free will seems to be a total illusion. Everything science tells us implies predestination.

reply to post by Astyanax


Thats what i mean. I will be what i will be , no matter what Whatever happens, will happen for a reason, and i will have little, or no say.

reply to post by Astyanax


I am trying to get my head around how you could believe in the many worlds interpretation and come up with determinism. Quite interesting. I guess I have heard some throw around the idea of the "block" (similar in some ways to physicist's "bulk") in which because everything has happened reality is completey 'filled", thus a "block". Science itself definately wants determinism - predestination is it's end goal. It wants to reduce everything that is to an elegant equation. Thus every scientific success is a success for determinism due to the nature of the way the scientific method developed. However at the current state of scientific accomplishment (as I estimate it to be) I feel confident in saying that it is far (far.) from being able to determine every physical result. Sure there was some talk of the T.O.E. a few years ago but... what happened to that? Gone. (Dark matter probably killed the enthusiasm for T.O.E.) but all along there was always Kurt Godel, lurking in the fringes (I hyperbolize), with his definitive proofs of the eternal internal flaws of mathematics.

Gödel's incompleteness theorems

His incompleteness theorums are much more destructive and disturbing than the Heisenberg Uncertianty principle (which didn't help at the time....). Generally accepted mainstream western consensus is that mathematics is the "...queen of the sciences". Most science attempts to use a mathematical method/model as its ideal. But according to Godel, this can only ever go so far- thus eliminating true predestination , at least according to any science as practiced by Western-ish humans.
Point is that science itself is still developing, and has a certian view of itself, which is not totally born out by the facts. Heh.

Originally posted by liquidself
I am trying to get my head around how you could believe in the many worlds interpretation and come up with determinism.

I didn't say I believed in the hypothesis. But could you explain the difficulty you perceive? Why should a many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics eliminate determinism?

Most science attempts to use a mathematical method/model as its ideal. But according to Godel, this can only ever go so far--thus eliminating true predestination , at least according to any science as practiced by Western-ish humans.

Could you explain why Gödel's incompleteness theorem eliminates determinism ('predestination' is a religious term I'd rather not use)?

reply to post by Astyanax


I m not sure that MW actually elimates determinism (no problem not using the term 'predestination' though that and determinism seem functionally similar) - I am a no expert on physics, just an enthusiastic layman. MW generally excites my sensibilities due to its description of a multi-verse, it seems to support an individual free will. If conscious choice has anything to do with/as a quantum event (and I believe Roger Penrose has done some work in this area) then their may be a literally infinite number of possible outcomes to choose from. So even though all possible events are actuallized, relative to my position their are more events availible than I could ever even concieve of. I think the difference is that MWI as a possible meta-theory may imply a solid block of total actualization, the personal reality of it is that that is what is called sub specie aeternitias, the big picture. But on the human scale it seems to me to allow for more choice than is believable. Also, I tend to believe that true time is simultaneous and that reality is dynamic, not static, so that new actualities are being continuously spawned. If MW were a TV, and has infinite channels, I still can only select one channel at a time. These other worlds are only probable worlds according to my relative position. I hope this makes some sense.

As for Godel, he simply showed that any mathematical system capable of basic arithmetic would always have irresolvable inconsistencies. Advanced physics is very dependent on intricate mathematics, Godel showed there would always be interpretation and paradoxes, which for me absolutely precludes a scientific determinism. This was a huge blow to big logic brains like Bertrand Russell and Wittgenstien at the time who were trying to come up with total logic systems for all human thought. A pure deterministic systme would have to also be a T.O.E. (Theory of Everything) but Godel showed that the T.O.E. is impossible. I don't know why people talk about it anymore.

Originally posted by liquidself
there may be a literally infinite number of possible outcomes to choose from.

And how is the choice effected? How do you choose between worldlines?

Most of the time, we have no apparent choice between the outcomes of events in our lives. Even when it seems to us that we do, how can our choices be rational ones if they are not predetermined by history and circumstances?

Do we really have a choice at all? Why does it seem to us if we do?

Godel... simply showed that any mathematical system capable of basic arithmetic would always have irresolvable inconsistencies. Advanced physics is very dependent on intricate mathematics, Godel showed there would always be interpretation and paradoxes, which for me absolutely precludes a scientific determinism. This was a huge blow to big logic brains like Bertrand Russell and Wittgenstien at the time who were trying to come up with total logic systems for all human thought. A pure deterministic system would have to also be a T.O.E. (Theory of Everything) but Godel showed that the T.O.E. is impossible. I don't know why people talk about it anymore.

What has this to do with determinism and free will? The universe goes its own way, indifferent to whether or not humans understand it. Why should the limitations of knowledge, as explained by Gödel, have any effect on this?

[edit on 30/8/10 by Astyanax]

...This goes on to prove that the thought of a parrellel dimension is not just a theory but a fact.. that beyond our Galaxy is the Realm of all Possible out comes of our(galactic/universe) repeating a never ending cycle along a different path...(and any galaxy mixed within this realm is merely a different version of us(our galaxy which traveled a different path meeting up with it self...so using this principle (when you look at other galaxys they inturn are you and just maybe ..you are there looking back.
(Dimensional-theory) .. we are the center of the Universe and the Universe is us .. (I think I heard this before)
my (Dejavu Theory)
...this means that .. the Galactic electromagnetic wave pulse emitting from the center of our galaxy is wave of which we can only scratch the surface of...A space time rift... which means this is a rift in time from the future and a version of your energy is carried within it =1 version of yourself in space time ... which will meet up with yourself =1 version .. (1+1)=2(a second version within space time) ..and you may not even remeber any of your past self.. for there can only be one of you at one given time meaning the 2 will merge =1(complete different version of yourself within time and you would never have known...the (black hole=god particle)a deminsional rift in space time
(Possible superwave timeline)
12,901/129thou/1.29mil/12.9mil/129mil/1.29bil
25,802/258thou/2.58mil/25.8mil/258mil/2.58bil
38,703/387thou/3.87mil/38.7mil/387mil/3.87bil+738mil=4.60billion/SOL
51,604/516thou/5.16mil/51.6mil/516mil/5.16bil
64,505/645thou/6.45mil/64.5mil/645mil/6.45bil
77,406/774thou/7.74mil/77.4mil/774mil/7.74bil
90,305/903thou/9mil/90.3mil/903mil/9bil+3.87bil+633mil=13.50bil/Galaxy
103,206/1.03mil/10.3mil/103mil/1.3bil/years ago
The Age of the Milky Way Galaxy 13.5 billion years old.
The age of the Sun is 4.6 billion years
The age of the Earth is around 4.54 billion years

..plese look to my posts for supportive links

[edit on 30-8-2010 by Vonour]

well i, for one, am glad to know i'm living large on my own planet with

salubrian harem girls as my bodyguards, an unstoppable reptilian army and

the finest tech in the known universe!



now i just have to figure out how to get there!

[edit on 30-8-2010 by fooks]

...this goes to prove because Solid matter is Part of the (Black hole - dimensional particle) and outside the Black Hole are + solid particles(which are still part of the Black hole) are still incontact with each other in space time and as the Black hole pulses out the + solid particles of space time(the Galactic Wave)...is a version of a future or (dimensional future self(energy the Soul)..of man..
the pulse of the Black Hole =9802 means this would be a future .. rift of 9802 years of space time headed our way .. so (I will see you in the Future)... at a certain time and place maybe .. somewhere in time
...



[edit on 30-8-2010 by Vonour]

reply to post by emeraldzeus


This is a tough subject matter, but I personally agree with your findings.

If there are many dimensions, many time-lines, lots of versions of us, then logic would imply that those are the different time lines that occur based on what we do or don't do in this time line.

If you are unhappy, lonely, frustrated, and generally cynical about life, then according to this many dimension finding, it stands to reason that somewhere else in another time line, you are happy, married, and generally happy with life in general. What is missing from this life can be found in another. Such is a world of multiple dimensions and multiple or many time lines. It is a interesting subject matter. At least I think it is. Since notable scientist theorize the same thing, that determination is good enough for me.

Thanks for the posting.

but why are we not writing from those places?


why am i still centered here on earth with an unbroken timeline?


why can't i access my other dimensional self?

what will it take for me to get to myself in that other dimension that is so good for me?

hey! i believe this stuff. why do i not have what i posted before?

of course there would be inter dimensional ATS but i don't see any salubrian
harem gals here.

so my question is......is there a primary dimension?

[edit on 30-8-2010 by fooks]

reply to post by fooks


the black hole is the sum of all things...
.. the God particle...
..but it will tear you apart and only send you back some where in time...
..being of the (negative particle)... all possitve particles would be ejected...
..But if you where to journey toward the black hole ..(you would move into the future).. and be stuck in time ..over and over .. in a never ending journey..Infinity...of being torn apart by the black hole....(not sure..but quite possible
..If you could figure out how to (Change your overall (charge) you may be able to enter .. but .. not sure if that is possible

[edit on 30-8-2010 by Vonour]

These theories about different dimensions and different timelines have been going on for quite a while.

There have been many movies and TV shows about this as well. Sliders, the first two seasons, is my favorite TV show dealing with the theory. There are too many movies to pick a favorite from, but “The One” had an interesting take on it.

The same theme that runs through these which is also part of the theory is that there is an earth prime, in which all realities sprung from, the question is, if this is true, are we living on earth prime, or is it in one of the other dimensions?

I always thought these theories were interesting.

reply to post by fooks

now i just have to figure out how to get there!

Yes, and get the version of you living there already to switch places with you in this reality.

Originally posted by Astyanax

Originally posted by liquidself
there may be a literally infinite number of possible outcomes to choose from.

And how is the choice effected? How do you choose between worldlines?

Most of the time, we have no apparent choice between the outcomes of events in our lives. Even when it seems to us that we do, how can our choices be rational ones if they are not predetermined by history and circumstances?

Do we really have a choice at all? Why does it seem to us if we do?

Godel... simply showed that any mathematical system capable of basic arithmetic would always have irresolvable inconsistencies. Advanced physics is very dependent on intricate mathematics, Godel showed there would always be interpretation and paradoxes, which for me absolutely precludes a scientific determinism. This was a huge blow to big logic brains like Bertrand Russell and Wittgenstien at the time who were trying to come up with total logic systems for all human thought. A pure deterministic system would have to also be a T.O.E. (Theory of Everything) but Godel showed that the T.O.E. is impossible. I don't know why people talk about it anymore.

What has this to do with determinism and free will? The universe goes its own way, indifferent to whether or not humans understand it. Why should the limitations of knowledge, as explained by Gödel, have any effect on this?

[edit on 30/8/10 by Astyanax]

If the universe goes it's own way without reference to how we understand it; I assume you are human. You are throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Your own characterization of 'the universe' is suspect. There fore everything you have said is only belief. Ergo the 'universe' could be paying attention to your every whim; how would you know the difference?