ATS Dump - Rant With No Steam

I had an uncomfortable moment today. In my job it is important for the people that I try to help to know that I do not sit in judgment of them. Of course I make observations and sometimes it is difficult to discuss an observation without it sounding like criticism. There are times in our conversation that I may make a critical statement but I try to always make it constructive. Needless to say I am not always successful and the more sensitive the person is about the observation the more likely my observations will appear as criticism and judgment calls. My post really doesn’t have a lot to do with my encounter outside of the fact that it put me in a particular frame of mind. It made me tired. It made me question why and how we got to this place where almost everyone is unhappy with almost everything in their lives.

I think our dilemma is the result of having too much. Too much junk and too much time. Our passion to horde junk and the uninspirational use of our time has made us malcontents. We are unsatisfied with our junk, we are never happy with the amount or quality of our time and we are obsessed with more. Half the time we can't even identify what the more is we just feel as if we don't have enough.

Life was simpler when people attempted to live within their means and placed their hopes of advancement on the backs of the next generation. They did the best they could and were content and proud of what they had accomplished because it was better than what their parent's had and they worked to make a better life possible for their children.

Now we fear aging and spend a fortune trying to hide the tale-tale signs that come with the process. A nip here. A tuck there. A little suction and a little injection. Who does it hurt?

We are unhappy with what we see in the mirror because some advertising agency told us what we should look like and we believe them though less than 1% of the population even comes close to looking like the people they project into our psyche.

I ask my clients to think about all the people in their lives that they love the most; the people that they would never want to live without. Then I ask them how many of them do they think would ever be placed on a magazine cover or a billboard. Even though they can understand that commercial beauty is not a requirement for love they still chase that roadrunner buying up everything that ACME sells in the process.

Contentment is harder to come by. Keeping up with the Joneses is an old battle but at least you knew who the Joneses were and had half a chance of getting in the game. Now people don’t even know the name of their neighbor and is trying to keep up with an imaginary lifestyle on HGTV and are no happier in the end.

What have we taught our children? What is going to be our legacy? My nine year old nephew asked me today after overhearing a news report on the radio, “Where is Oklahoma?” Of course this is the same child that at nine can play the expert level of Guitar Hero and can play almost anything else on Wii or the Xbox. Yet the land in which we live is a foreign country to him. It is sad that the level of education that our children receive is so poor, especially considering how much it costs. I don’t blame him. To be honest I don’t know who to blame and I guess that is part of why I feel tired. I don’t know what the answer is nor do I even know where to start or if there is a resolution to the ennui that seems to have crept in and taken up residence in so many lives. I keep thinking that we could have done better. That we can do better. I just don’t know where to start.

Maybe I am being too hard on my generation. Maybe we have given our children a chance to do better than us because they are going to have to live with a little less. Maybe they will learn the true value of family, friendship and community. Maybe they will learn that the things that money can buy are perishable and the true things of value have no expiration date. Maybe they will learn that happiness is not something that you have to chase; it is something inside you waiting to be let out. Maybe they will learn what we forgot.

I blame our education system. I'm all for capitalism and laissez-fair. But people are taught as opposed to saving money that they're judged by what they own, and, who they know. Our system has become quite perverted, and, I think a lot of it has to do in early education when people are learning about life.

reply to post by Frankidealist35

But a child receives its first education in the home. They learn what Mommy and Daddy consider valuable and we have taught them that love is displayed by the giving of gifts.

Mommy and Daddy often are not home because they are working hard to give them all the things that the babysitter has told them that they have to have. Mommy and Daddy love their children and they justify their actions both to themselves as well as to the child.

I am not dumping on parents. They did what they thought was a good thing. They remembered being a child and not having the things they wanted or that they thought all the other children had because their Mommy and Daddy always killed their joy with those dreaded four words. "We can't afford it."

Like every generation before they wanted to give their children more. Unfortunately their spending came at a hefty premium and now the ship is about to hit the shore. It may be a long time before we see smooth sailing again.

I agree with you 100%!!! I have quite a few friends who are always unhappy and on many different meds and I just dont understand why they feel they way they do. They have a job, a home, a family and friends and yet they are all miserable. They all do very well and they are never happy.
I am always content with what I have and I dont understand how these people value possessions over family or friends. I guess it was the way I was raised. I am not into video games or tv really, I read and self educate myself. My brother for example is a product of the video game era. He doesnt do anything but play those things and he doest do anything else. He should play games for a living yet he has no idea what is going on outside of his Playstation.


[edit on 1/29/2010 by mblahnikluver]

YEP! I agree totally..

When I was a kid growing up, Our whole family knew who our neighbours were and we all played together and got into trouble together. If I did something wrong at my Neightbours house, I would get the same punishement from their Parents as I would get at home. If it warranted aSmack on the Bum, My neighbours would Smack me on the bum without worrying about getting Sued or the Cops being called on them. Nowadays, you touch someone and you're GONE..

Life was so much easier then. We didn't have Gameboys, Playstations or the like. I do remember, however, when the Atari came out. Getting Colour TV was a big thing back then too.

We used to Live and Play outside, in the fresh Air. We'd go exploring the Abandoned Fort (house) down the road. We'd have our dog with us trying to prove it was as intelligent as Lassie. We didn't care if Next Doors Car was better than ours. A car was a car.. Although, none of us liked Jap Cars. I don't even think our Car had A/C. We did have the "Optional" Heater in our car but no Radio. The heater was more important.. lol

We were allowed to have BB Guns, Crossbows and Fireworks. You know what? None of us got killed. Even as kids we were responsible to have those things. Give a kid a BB Gun today and the first thing they're likely to do is shoot their Neighbour. Give 'em some Fireworks and there goes Next Doors Letterbox.

Time moved a lot slower then too. Don't ask me why, it just did. Weekends lasted an eternity. Monday was a drag. Couldn't wait for the weekend.

Times have changed so much. No one knows their neighbour anymore. We all want to sue each other to get a quick buck.
If someone dies in their house it takes 2 or more weeks to notice they're not around anymore.
We drive as though we are at war with car in front. Stick our middle finger up at someone for overtaking us on the highway..

Yep! Times have changed and how I wish I was a kid again in 1972.

Originally posted by SpiritoftheNightSky
reply to post by Frankidealist35

But a child receives its first education in the home. They learn what Mommy and Daddy consider valuable and we have taught them that love is displayed by the giving of gifts.

I agree. I dont have kids but I know how I would raise them. I have seen this many times with friends of mine. They dont want to discipline or say no and then they get walked on. I dont even like Christmas anymore because all anyone cares about is the gifts when it's supposed to be about family. They way I see it is that some parents now-a-days want to buy their kids love and that is really sad to me. I was raised with nothing and my mother always made sure we had what we needed. I never felt like I lacked anything and she taught us what was important and material things wasnt one of them.

reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky


I feel tired of it too sometimes, Spirit. I still occasionally have what amounts to existential dilemma's, and plain ole angst. But these for me are not born out of my personal or professional life.

It generally stems from watching the News. World news.

From time to time I read a post from an ATS member who believes their angst comes from ATS.

I know mine doesn't. It comes from CNN, and all the rest of them. The MSM. When I shut it out for a day or two, I start to feel better. I've always been a real "news junkie", so this is not always easy for me. Even when I'm here, the news is on behind me. Getting away from it helps me to get grounded again in my own life/self.

Sometimes the news can take you very far away from yourself, and usually to far worse places.

....and my remarks might have absolutely nothing to do with what you are talking about. Sorry, if this is the case.

reply to post by ladyinwaiting


Don't apologize. It is all connected. If you think the world is going to Hell in a hand-basket (and sometimes I think just that) it would most likely have an affect on how you feel and decisions you make.

News isn't what it used to be. Even the way it is presented. If they have an interesting story that they think people may want to know about, they titillate you with it throughout the whole broadcast until the very end to force you to stay tuned to their station. The anchors are entertainers and the more controversy they can stir up the better business is for them. I guess if it works they are not going to fix it.

reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky


Ah yes, they do all those things. It's infuriating. I think I even made a thread about it once, and swore off the news.

It didn't last of course.

Oh for the days of Walter Kronkite.......Just news. No spin.

I think another thing that might be wrong....is....it's January.
And February is worse. Nothing good ever comes out of February.
Except people's birthday's, of course, but otherwise it's just dark and damp and cold, and this alone drains my energy.

Maybe we'll all feel better when March arrives.

With the advent of industry and technology we have been able to live with much less effort and hardship than previously. The winter cannot easily breach our snug houses, we don't normally have to worry about obtaining our own food, and there are no predators, no significant threats of disease, no struggles. However these forces shaped our ancestors, and helped to refine them and give them a better understanding of nature and reality. In the struggle to survive in the elements, the hunt, they were able to see themselves within a greater structure. There is no 'evil' in the frost, the hunger, or death like most people think today. One should seek to utilise these to battle outside and inside themselves in order to find meaning in existence and grow. Much of what industrialism and technology have done is take us away from these forces. Within our simplistic but often dull lives, people place labels like 'good' on everything that brings pleasure and 'evil' on all that is pain, and seek to affirm the former while denying and destroying the latter.The ease of life that we draw up for ourselves with technology and industry only cultivates a confused and unrealistic worldview.

What meaning and fulfilment we can find in life has been here for ages past. If one reads the ancient Vedic texts, the Eddas of Northern Europe or the Qur'an, there is a definite sense of meaning that exists beyond passing fancies and trends. People did not believe that life would offer more fulfillment in the future than in the past, simply by virtue of the flow of time. They could always find direction and meaning by looking to the system they existed in.

reply to post by ladyinwaiting


We can't put the Genie back into the bottle but we can stop believing that the Genie is going to grant our wishes on command. We have to come to grips with the fact that the Genie has his own agenda and everything he does comes with a huge price tag or soul damaging consequences. Each of us has our own Genie and some Genies we share.

I am a step up to the plate, wipe up the milk, use what is left in the carton and establish a way to obtain a replacement, kind of gal. I hate feeling as if there is nothing that we can do. I think all of us are starting to believe that we no longer have the ability to control our lives.

My mother used to tell us if we have problems in life to give them to God. She is extremely faithful in her beliefs and she always encourages us to pray. My brother was having a streak of bad luck; he was angry and depressed. My mother, as always encouraged him to pray. He became angrier and told her that prayer doesn’t work because God doesn’t answer his prayers. My mother in a calm still voice said “Son, God always answers our prayers; you just have to understand that no “is” an answer.

I think we need to regress. We need to redevelop our two year old state of mind were our first response to everything was “no”.

We don’t have to wait until we are mad as hell to decide that we are not going to take it anymore. We can take the reins. We don’t have to take on the world. We just have to start some place and the first place to start is with ourselves, taking baby steps. Identifying those things that really matter in our lives and making changes that refocuses our time, energy and priorities. Being more conscience of how we spend our money. Maybe if enough of us make just one little change it will have the butterfly effect.

I admit that I am no expert and I don’t know if trying to do something will help but I know doing nothing won’t.

I think its a bit of a chicken/egg problem. We lack in people relationships, we try to fill the void with things. Then we are so wound up in the things there is no room to build relationships.
What came first? too much stuff or too little relationships?

reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky


Below is an excert from a very good, common sense, no frills simple logic book written by Lee Iacocoa, "Where Have All The Leaders Gone"

So here's where we stand. We're immersed in a bloody war with no plan for winning and no plan for leaving. We're running the biggest deficit in the history of the country. We're losing the manufacturing edge to Asia, while our once-great companies are getting slaughtered by health care costs. Gas prices are skyrocketing, and nobody in power has a coherent energy policy. Our schools are in trouble. Our borders are like sieves. The middle class is being squeezed every which way. These are times that cry out for leadership.

But when you look around, you've got to ask: "Where have all the leaders gone?" Where are the curious, creative communicators? Where are the people of character, courage, conviction, competence, and common sense? I may be a sucker for alliteration, but I think you get the point.

Name me a leader who has a better idea for homeland security than making us take off our shoes in airports and throw away our shampoo? We've spent billions of dollars building a huge new bureaucracy, and all we know how to do is react to things that have already happened.

Name me one leader who emerged from the crisis of Hurricane Katrina. Congress has yet to spend a single day evaluating the response to the hurricane, or demanding accountability for the decisions that were made in the crucial hours after the storm. Everyone's hunkering down, fingers crossed, hoping it doesn't happen again. Now, that's just crazy. Storms happen. Deal with it. Make a plan. Figure out what you're going to do the next time.

Name me an industry leader who is thinking creatively about how we can restore our competitive edge in manufacturing. Who would have believed that there could ever be a time when "the Big Three" referred to Japanese car companies? How did this happen -- and more important, what are we going to do about it?

Name me a government leader who can articulate a plan for paying down the debt, or solving the energy crisis, or managing the health care problem. The silence is deafening. But these are the crises that are eating away at our country and milking the middle class dry.

I have news for the gang in Congress. We didn't elect you to sit on your asses and do nothing and remain silent while our democracy is being hijacked and our greatness is being replaced with mediocrity. What is everybody so afraid of? That some bobblehead on Fox News will call them a name? Give me a break. Why don't you guys show some spine for a change?

HAD ENOUGH?

Hey, I'm not trying to be the voice of gloom and doom here. I'm trying to light a fire. I'm speaking out because I have hope. I believe in America. In my lifetime I've had the privilege of living through some of America's greatest moments. I've also experienced some of our worst crises -- the Great Depression, World War II, the Korean War, the Kennedy assassination, the Vietnam War, the 1970s oil crisis, and the struggles of recent years culminating with 9/11. If I've learned one thing, it's this: You don't get anywhere by standing on the sidelines waiting for somebody else to take action. Whether it's building a better car or building a better future for our children, we all have a role to play. That's the challenge I'm raising in this book. It's a call to action for people who, like me, believe in America. It's not too late, but it's getting pretty close. So let's shake off the horse# and go to work. Let's tell 'em all we've had enough.

The asylum has been run by the inmates for far too long.

[edit on 30-1-2010 by ofhumandescent]

There are too many blind idiots in the "real world" so I just stay on here and stuff.

Yeah, I'm really death metal.

reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky


Good post. Your observation about finances and people's desire for meaningless stuff are rught on. Bottom line is this...you are in control of you, when it comes to the accumulation of stuff. We make our lives more complicated when we have to worry over stuff and wheather it is going to work.

We need this: Food - Clothing - Shelter. Add to that medical care only to maintain health, a dependable (need not be fancy or new) car to get about. Everything else is added bagage.

If you have an excess of money after taking care of your needs, what then? Savings may not be as "sexy" as the latest whiz-bang from "Ya-gotta-havit Tech" but it will be less trouble and worrysome. Savings can take many forms. I just completed a two year project to stockpile a years supply (for two) of freeze-dried foods, with a 20 year shelf life, for emergency. That's food savings. Paying off your mortgage early. That's shelter savings.

Live simple, happy, worry free and long!
..........................

What a great post and set of answers so far.

I have to say for me I feel I have lost the struggle for life and its been replaced with the struggle to make ends meet.

I am not a materalistic person but my family needs a roof and heat which nowadays I can't go out and build myself or chop wood ect to make it warm. I do like to have nice things but really for me there not and never will be the be all and end all of my exsistance as my father told me "theres no pockets in a shroud"

All the stuff we have is meant to make life easier but it was corrupted into getting more and more from people for less and less, this I think transfered to people wanting more and more themselves.

I was about during the birth of the work computer and it was touted as the best labour saving device for the work place until someone relised that they could get 10 times the amount of work out of a person with it and still pay them the same wage.


If we actually used thechnology in our lifes to make it easier not produce more or get more work out of people I think we could be happer than we are.

In saying that I think we as a world have moved on quicker technologicaly than we have with say with social reform, or spritual growth.

Personally I would love to go back to living in a cave for a while each year living off of my wits and ingenuity but thats not gonna happen because my bills need paid for, landowners would never agree to it, I need to pay taxes ect and this greedy world will always want more and more from me for less and less in return.

reply to post by SpiritoftheNightSky


- Promoting women in the workforce instead of being homemakers

lead to

- Promoting womens independence of men

lead to

- Breaking up the home via divorce

lead to

- No one raising their kids because everyone is working

Throw in some tv and video game programming, sprinkle some Hollywood on top and remove God/basic morality from everything and this is what you get...I know there is more to it then this, but I think what I typed above is at the core of it all.

= "Destruction By Design"

reply to post by custom2006


There will certainly have to be another way other than putting women back in the kitchen all day, with a baby on one hip.

Not happening.

Everbody else has nailed it. It's our value system as a society. Success and happiness is bought by "stuff". "Whoever has the most toys, wins".

It's an unfulfilling little game/lifestyle. Completely empty, and getting emptier. Is hasn't alway been this way. Maybe it's just our time....the few decades of trying this materialistic valued-society on for size just happen to be the ones in which we exist.

Maybe our posterity will review the history books, and learn that people of our and surrounding generations, worked in whatever jobs paid the best so we could acquire more "stuff". Everybody was depressed, felt their lives were missing something and a high percentage of the population was on Prozac and Xanax.

Perhaps they will be enlightened enough to understand this cancer and find a cure for it. They will remember what we did, so they won't make the same mistakes.

Seventy-five years ago I wouldn't be sitting here reading and having my morning coffee. I'd be firing up the wood stove, and searching the chicken coops for breakfast, which I would then feed my family without the slightest concern for cholestrol.

No TV world news, and no reason for angst. Wouldn't have time for it if I did.

When did we get this way? Didn't it really hit hard and become our lifestyle in the eighties?

See future U.S. History books:

1980 -- 2010: The period of Useless Acquisitions, and the reasons behind it.

An excellent post. I share your exaspiration. I feel caged within myself, wanting to become what I saw in my father but somehow not knowing how to get there. I don't know where you are from but I feel that in America we have allowed ourselves to be dumbed down to the point of complete apathy except for that base desire of wanting more stuff and never being satisfied.
The older I get the more that I wish that I had never seen a TV, computer, or cell phone. If I spent the time reading or producing that I spend with these modern distractions I would be ten times the man I am today. Yes, I know all of the above has helped society in many ways, but too often they control us instead of the other way around. I hold out very little hope for the next generation of latch key, dependent, instant everything kids. What will they do in real hardship and times of difficult personal decisions?
I find it all very depressing.
Seeashrink

Yo man im like so in clue with you. This one time something bad happens, then im like talking about it for a paragraph, then im like a rocket ship and veer off in every other direction, leaving everyone that was reading thinking whats going on!?

Honestly your story confuses me, your talking about how you owned or made some guys life hell by talking to them, and suddenly your on about how this and that does have pretty colors or some junk. Honestly you confused me, I read it all but your post was like, 5 posts in one and you gave absolutely no information about this huge burn or whatever that caused some one elses life to be in chaos, but since your such a sensitive guy it got you too, like some big huge fireball that engulfed you both.