ATS Haitian Conspiracies?

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
Jefferson being a large slave owner himself actually feared the rebellion in Haiti would eventually lead to a slave rebellion here in America. At one point he floated a proposal before Congress trying to pass a law that every Black born in America would be shipped to Haiti after birth to phase out slavery and blacks in America through attrition and deportation to homogenize it entirely into a White nation.

Star for the trip down memory lane.
However this never came to pass now did it?

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
Jefferson being a large slave owner himself actually feared the rebellion in Haiti would eventually lead to a slave rebellion here in America. At one point he floated a proposal before Congress trying to pass a law that every Black born in America would be shipped to Haiti after birth to phase out slavery and blacks in America through attrition and deportation to homogenize it entirely into a White nation.

Star for the trip down memory lane.
However this never came to pass now did it?

No the idea was pretty much rejected by Jefferson's peers, and most people of the day. Much the way Lincoln's idea of founding the nation of Liberia in Africa to repriate all the freed slaves to after the Civil War.

One thing is certain Haiti becoming only the second nation at the time of it's independence to free itself from Monarchal rule in the Western Hemiphsere and being a black led and black free nation frightened a lot of people not just in America but around the world.

Haiti really had been up against a stacked playing field against it for almost its entire existence and one could very well succesfully argue its not going to get easier for them any time soon and they may in fact because of recent developments be worse off than ever before.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
No the idea was pretty much rejected by Jefferson's peers, and most people of the day. Much the way Lincoln's idea of founding the nation of Liberia in Africa to repriate all the freed slaves to after the Civil War.

Some how I knew somebody would bring up America and Liberia sooner or later. That never happened either. As far as the French/Haitian history goes. That's water under the bridge.

I agree Haiti hasn't had the easiest history. But like many things in the world THESE days one needs to stop living in the past and do away with blaming everything on others.

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
No the idea was pretty much rejected by Jefferson's peers, and most people of the day. Much the way Lincoln's idea of founding the nation of Liberia in Africa to repriate all the freed slaves to after the Civil War.

Some how I knew somebody would bring up America and Liberia sooner or later. That never happened either. As far as the French/Haitian history goes. That's water under the bridge.

I agree Haiti hasn't had the easiest history. But like many things in the world THESE days one needs to stop living in the past and do away with blaming everything on others.

Clearly what has ever happened in Haiti is George Bush's and Newt Gingrich's fault!

Hi all,

Does anyone have any objective sources to read about Haiti?

I'm going to suggest the best seller "Collapse" by Dimond (2005). "How societies choose to fail or survive" in which one of the chapters is (from Wiki):

The failure of Haiti compared with the relative success of its neighbor on Hispaniola, the Dominican Republic

I spent over a year in a black, poor, French speaking African nation that reminded me a lot of Haiti, even got to meet several Haitians there. One of the reasons my African country was so poor was its relative lack of resources and poor resource utilization. Haiti shares that problem. The only resource left today in Haiti is a potentially rich gold mine and Haitians have succeeded in scaring the developers away so far.

So any redevelopment and investment will have to take this into account.

I think that the Haitian Earthquake is too convient for the PTB's. Tons of relief money and supplies to back an invasion after a nice culling of the populace and incurrence of terror and Chaos to bring change. And, Now with new fron USGS reports that Venezuela may have the biggest oil reserve in the world it is a perfect waypoint for operations against Venezuela if necessary. If USGS knows it the US Government has known it a long time. Also don;t think this doesn't make a perfect study in case for subduing Armed Americans in the Future.

[edit on 23-1-2010 by Barkster]

reply to post by SLAYER69

I can see potential for large public works projects. New Hospitals Schools and "other" "infrastructure" programs. Yet after it is all said and done there will be again not enough "Jobs" to raise taxes to pay for the maintenance in their future. In ten years they could be right back where they were before the Earthquake

I watched Zeitgeist addendum again the other night and what you say seems to eerily ring the same bells as the part where they talk about Economic Hitmen.

Schooling, Infrastructure, etc is exactly what's mentioned too.

Whether the Earthquake was caused by some kind of U.S. Machine, who knows, but now there is a situation that presents itself for Haiti to be in debt by a massive amount to the U.S. for a very long time. Big business.

reply to post by grantbeed


That's my point.

Never let a good disaster go to waste.
But who will gain from it as we feel sorrow and open our wallets.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I try and Watch things like Zeitgeist with an open mind, as it's easy to be led astray with clever BS, but I was blown away with this part.

It's a ruthless World we live in, and Greed, Power and Money rule. even though there's a very sincere help for the Haitians, i'm sure some will be thinking $$$ behind the scenes.

reply to post by SLAYER69


I keep wondering why anyone looks at Haiti as a source of wealth. Its GDP is about 14 billion, average income $1400/ person. Haiti wasn't able to pay off its debt to France for some 150 years, not until 1947. In the process it pretty well extracted all the wealth and resources from Haiti.

I mentioned the gold mines at La Miel with only some potential, no proven reserves.

Then there is the earthquake donations! That may be their greatest hope.

For an economic historical perspective:

The Faultline In Haiti Leads Straight To France

Weighed down by this financial burden, Haiti was born almost bankrupt. In 1900 some 80 per cent of the national budget was still being swallowed up by debt repayments. Money that might have been spent on building a stable economy went to foreign bankers. To keep workers on the land and extract maximum crop yields to pay the indemnity, Haiti brought in the Rural Code, instituting a division between town and country, between a light-skinned elite and the dark-skinned majority, that still persists.

The debt was not finally paid off until 1947. By then, Haiti’s economy was hopelessly distorted, its land deforested, mired in poverty, politically and economically unstable, prey equally to the caprice of nature and the depredations of autocrats. Seven year ago, the Haitian Government demanded restitution from Paris to the tune of nearly $22 billion (including interest) for the gunboat diplomacy that had helped to make it the poorest country in the western hemisphere.

This article I found leads me to believe the average person in Haiti will be hard pressed to find any sort of relief because of the deep rooted coruption that is still very much a part of the country. Some of the news comming out of there is appaling. Here is one article for example:



"Claire Fondnancy said she woke up at 4 in the morning to make her way up to Delmas to wait in line for three hours for her bag of rice. But it's not the wait that bothers her but the 250 Gourdes (or about $6) she had to pay for a carte or coupon. "We're obliged to buy the coupons because we can't find food," says the mother of a three-year old son."

"The coupons are a part of the World Food Program distribution plan aimed at women and children. Theoretically, the program disseminates coupons to Haitian community leaders who then are supposed to give them out to the women of that community. But they are quickly becoming a commodity. The women tell me of places where I can go to find the men selling the cartes: the stadium, the gas station on the corner, all places where you go to meet the right people. It's clear relief has come hand in hand with Haiti's age-old, seemingly death-defying corruption. "Let the white people give out the coupons. The Haitians will just take them and sell them,"..."

"Haitians who've had to deal with the loss of their family members and their homes, now find fellow citizens profiting from their pain. But the hunger on the streets is growing. In the suburban city of Petion-ville, protesters wove in between cars chanting against the mayor Claire Lydia Parent. The demonstrators allege that Parent too is charging them 250 Gourdes for coupons for bags of rice. "She's keeping it in the depot so when elections come around she'll give the rice away. Then people will vote for her," says Danka Tranzil, 17. (Mayor Parent has said that food is constantly being distributed and that what people in the street may perceive as supplies being kept from them is actually being taken to other parts of the city in need.)"



Ok, I'm in need, my child hasn't eaten yet today, but if you say so...

www.time.com...

After i watched this video on the history of Haiti's politics and mistreatment by the police and UN forces, i can understand how the conspiracies all collide together.

www.brasschecktv.com...

They really do hold some water when you get raw, eyewitness accounts; not the media's watered down bull# to hide the facts from the government's fiction.