Is teaching religion child abuse?

Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by sirnex

 

That is your choice to make and a
decision that you have to live with.
Your shunning of religion doesn't
save you,it blinds you.

Blinds in what way? By teaching my children that love is love and that love no matter what form it takes is still love? By teaching my children that all people are equal to one another, that all life is equally sacred?

Should I instead teach them that various cultures should be abolished in an act of "saving" their "souls"? Should I teach them to hate gays? Should I teach them that there is only one true path to happiness in life thus limiting their full potential?

Please, tell me more about being blind.

Originally posted by nicolee123nd
reply to post by dalan.

 

Thanks for sharing your story, I can see exactly where you're coming from. I'm 13 and see why you would think such things as a child.

edit on 16-10-2010 by nicolee123nd because: spelling

Thank you. Although I am 25 now and have had ample opportunity to reflect on my experiences when I was younger.

This is the only thing worth teaching any child:

Introduction to Objectivist Epistemology by Ayn Rand

I believe teaching the religion of evolution at the tax payer's expense is abuse to the American public.

Lying at the expense of my dollar is abusive and wrong. Stop now please.

IMHO,teaching religion is abuse before the child can understand the concepts of the teachings.

It removes choice,it's brainwashing.

reply to post by ACTS 2:38


I think all 'beliefs' should be taught in the schools, maybe in the senior year. This would allow those children that have only been allowed to see 'one view' to see them all and weigh it for themselves.

Even if evolution is true, that still doesnt mean there is not a 'god' or 'higher self' to us.

I believe in evolution as well as god, and I think that evolution is how the cycles occur for us to become what we have become. I see 'god' working through order and cycles, instead of just 'poof' suddenly there stands a full grown being that was not before there.

I dont think we should raise children saying we know something, without facts to back it up. So offer them all perspectives, and allow them to weigh for themselves when they are old enough.

I have no desire to push any one thought on my children, the Holy Spirit gave them their own mind and logic and reason and I have faith that when they decide to seek, they will find the truth that is needed for them. One of them might choose a religion, one may choose to just be spiritual without a certain belief, one may choose to follow the understanding of emanation of energy in matter....one form of energy always flowing into another....and I will allow them to follow their own hearts and think for themselves, what ever suits them to grow as a mature human.

reply to post by sirnex


Exactly, its more important that we teach them to accept others even for the things they know not....accept others on their own path of learning. Love them, with their faults and greatness. Try to understand, why their ways of flesh causes them to do certain things and then maybe they can use their own minds in finding the right path for them.

We have taken the birth right to things of Spiritual paths away from children. Its not our right to tell them what is in things of Spirit....we can offer them what we think or believe....but they come with a spiritual birth right to seek for themselves.

Kids are very impressionable and do not have the right mind set to 'seek' with true intent.

Often, they join a church for their parents....or get saved, to fit in with the group that grow up with. Many get 'saved' without even reading the entire Bible and having a mature mind to weight what it all means.

I have witnessed this from my own childhood as well as through my daughter who attended bible school during a summer and felt the need to become baptized to fit in with the group there. She felt pressured and felt she didnt fit in unless she did, what they had all done. Her intent was not true.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


I had gotten baptized when I was 10 years old.
I didn't really understand what I was doing,I just
knew that I needed baptized.
When I got away from church,it was years before I
went back to serving the Lord.I was baptized again
and now I serve Him.

Originally posted by ACTS 2:38
I believe teaching the religion of evolution at the tax payer's expense is abuse to the American public.

Lying at the expense of my dollar is abusive and wrong. Stop now please.

What do you have against teaching children facts?

reply to post by mamabeth


no way, it's not, unless it is forced on them, you could argue that not teaching them about it is a form of child abuse. there is nothing wrong with teaching them about it as long as they have a choice. if you do not believe in religion and you do not teach your child what religion is and why people believe it, and inform them on how to practice it, then you are enforcing your view on your child just as much as somebody who is religious and dose not give the child a choice about if they want to believe it or practice it or not.

my view is they need to know about it, so they can make their own choice about it at a later date or whenever.

it is wrong to enforce a religious belief on anyone, but it is equally wrong to enforce non belief on somebody also.

Originally posted by ACTS 2:38
I believe teaching the religion of evolution at the tax payer's expense is abuse to the American public.

Lying at the expense of my dollar is abusive and wrong. Stop now please.

Actually, evolutionary theory has very strong evidence for it's natural occurrence. Not just in biological entities, but also cultural and societal evolution, economic evolution as well as religious evolution. Damn near everything eventually changes from one form into another form. In the beginning, there was only one monotheistic God, now there are over a dozen worshiped from different denominations all derived from that first singular deity instituted waaaay back in Egypt.

What I find odd... How is the truth of reality considered abusive? Does learning thing's that cause you to take a new updated look at life really cause you harm?

reply to post by LeoVirgo

I think all 'beliefs' should be taught in the schools, maybe in the senior year.

Funny... Religion is taught in college's across the world. I would hazard a guess that even senior grade students are still not mature enough to make such a decision as to blindly follow a belief system based on lack of understanding or willingness to understand the world around them. Perhaps after college, after learning about various beliefs systems, how they arose, why they arose and most importantly, why the most popular is the most popular today, maybe then they can make that choice.

It's easier to convert a child who has yet to learn of the religions horror's than it is to convert an adult who knows the whole story.

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by sirnex

 

Exactly, its more important that we teach them to accept others even for the things they know not....accept others on their own path of learning. Love them, with their faults and greatness. Try to understand, why their ways of flesh causes them to do certain things and then maybe they can use their own minds in finding the right path for them.

We have taken the birth right to things of Spiritual paths away from children. Its not our right to tell them what is in things of Spirit....we can offer them what we think or believe....but they come with a spiritual birth right to seek for themselves.

Yet, what is the spirit? Science nor religion has been able to conclusively point at anything as being the "spirit" or "soul". Without a clear concise definition and object in which to believe is a spirit or soul, there is simply no reason to assume there to be one.

One must remember that such ideas were first determined by our primitive ancestors whom at the time used religion as a form of primitive science to explain the many questions of life itself and the world around them. We've grown as a species since then and we've been able to accurately answer many of those questions now. The simple act of hanging on to what few proto-scientific conclusions derived back then is just... simple. Perhaps life is grander and more amazing than what primitive religious scientific thinking is able to provide?

Originally posted by mamabeth
reply to post by LeoVirgo

 

I had gotten baptized when I was 10 years old.
I didn't really understand what I was doing,I just
knew that I needed baptized.
When I got away from church,it was years before I
went back to serving the Lord.I was baptized again
and now I serve Him.

My mom used to take me to church up until I was eight years old. She was never a strong believer herself, but she wanted me to learn good morals and to be raised a "good christian". Unfortunately for her plans, at eight I knew then that the whole preachy thing was simply BS garbage. There is no such thing as magic or miracles. There are only things we either understand or don't understand. If we are told that such actions that occur in a movie or good fantasy book can't happen in real life, then who am I to believe that they actually did happen in real life thousands of years ago just because someone created a new religion?

After I mulled that over in my head for a good two weeks, I told her I don't believe in fantasies and that I did not wish to attend church anymore. I've never been back since then. Thank God!

Originally posted by lifeform11
reply to post by mamabeth

 

no way, it's not, unless it is forced on them, you could argue that not teaching them about it is a form of child abuse. there is nothing wrong with teaching them about it as long as they have a choice. if you do not believe in religion and you do not teach your child what religion is and why people believe it, and inform them on how to practice it, then you are enforcing your view on your child just as much as somebody who is religious and dose not give the child a choice about if they want to believe it or practice it or not.

my view is they need to know about it, so they can make their own choice about it at a later date or whenever.

it is wrong to enforce a religious belief on anyone, but it is equally wrong to enforce non belief on somebody also.

I would tend to agree with you except for the small issue that there are literally hundreds upon thousands of individual unique religious belief systems practiced around the world today and throughout history. There is simply no way a parent would have the time nor knowledge in which to properly expose a child to all the various religious created on this planet alone.

What we can do is teach our children to look at and approach each subject of interest with objectivity in which to determine it's truth and validity before blindly jumping on the bandwagon of blind belief. Without teaching a child that very important first step to gaining knowledge, you are failing as a parent.

reply to post by sirnex


well there is no one rule, everybody parents children differently, but if it were me, i would make them aware of the religion that is most common around them or in their country, at the very least it will help them to be more understanding of other peoples cultures and beliefs.

i would tell them why i don't believe it and then let them make their own choice, my beliefs are not their beliefs, so telling them its all false as though there is no doubt would be enforcing my view upon them.

they would need to work that out for themselves, rather than have other people telling them what is real or not real where belief of religion/non belief is concerned.

Originally posted by lifeform11
reply to post by sirnex

 

well there is no one rule, everybody parents children differently, but if it were me, i would make them aware of the religion that is most common around them or in their country, at the very least it will help them to be more understanding of other peoples cultures and beliefs.

i would tell them why i don't believe it and then let them make their own choice, my beliefs are not their beliefs, so telling them its all false as though there is no doubt would be enforcing my view upon them.

they would need to work that out for themselves, rather than have other people telling them what is real or not real where belief of religion/non belief is concerned.

I have done similar with my two oldest. My wife and I have told them of the most popular monotheistic religion that is prevalent in our area, but I've also informed my children the reason why that religion is the most popular, not through being truth, but through violent bloodshed. I see no reason to lie or sugar coat the reasons as to why most people practice Christianity today rather than worshiping Osiris or practicing animism. Truth is truth no matter how harsh that truth may be, and the truth of the matter is that Christianity is a violent terrorist religion that has killed countless lives in the name of it's lord.

And people pick on Islam today, and for what? Because Islam is taking the place of what early Christians have done? I find that very comical because Islam is the reason science has advanced during Christianities dark ages. While the Christians were waring with everyone, especially the Muslims, and burning everyone, the Muslims were busy recording scientific knowledge and advancing that knowledge to great extremes. The Muslim community get's frowned upon these days when they should be praised! We would not be where we are in scientific knowledge if it weren't for them!

Originally posted by sirnex

Originally posted by LeoVirgo
reply to post by sirnex

 

Exactly, its more important that we teach them to accept others even for the things they know not....accept others on their own path of learning. Love them, with their faults and greatness. Try to understand, why their ways of flesh causes them to do certain things and then maybe they can use their own minds in finding the right path for them.

We have taken the birth right to things of Spiritual paths away from children. Its not our right to tell them what is in things of Spirit....we can offer them what we think or believe....but they come with a spiritual birth right to seek for themselves.

Yet, what is the spirit? Science nor religion has been able to conclusively point at anything as being the "spirit" or "soul". Without a clear concise definition and object in which to believe is a spirit or soul, there is simply no reason to assume there to be one.

One must remember that such ideas were first determined by our primitive ancestors whom at the time used religion as a form of primitive science to explain the many questions of life itself and the world around them. We've grown as a species since then and we've been able to accurately answer many of those questions now. The simple act of hanging on to what few proto-scientific conclusions derived back then is just... simple. Perhaps life is grander and more amazing than what primitive religious scientific thinking is able to provide?

Of course...

But for me, my path, has offered me more then just the ancient past telling me of things. I have experienced things, my family has had many strange experiences. I cant say I know what these things are for sure, I am limited to our language to use words like 'spirit' and 'soul'. But I do know there is more to it then just what we see here and our laws of nature that we think we know and think we are bounded to. The experiences are actually what allowed me to brake our of the religious box, so Im thankful either way or what ever it all means and is. All I can do is share my experiences, which I have at several forums. I dont claim such as a truth for others...but it is a truth for me, now.

All my best
LV

reply to post by LeoVirgo

But for me, my path, has offered me more then just the ancient past telling me of things. I have experienced things, my family has had many strange experiences. I cant say I know what these things are for sure, I am limited to our language to use words like 'spirit' and 'soul'. But I do know there is more to it then just what we see here and our laws of nature that we think we know and think we are bounded to. The experiences are actually what allowed me to brake our of the religious box, so Im thankful either way or what ever it all means and is. All I can do is share my experiences, which I have at several forums. I dont claim such as a truth for others...but it is a truth for me, now.

Lot's of people claim they've experienced lot's of things and in some instances for lack of proper explanation for an unexplainable occurrence, and explanation is either made up and rationalized for oneself or an inaccurate explanation is adopted for lack of a better explanation. All religious or spiritual creeds claim to be true and yet all disagree with one another and yet not all can be the only true explanation, the most logical and accurate outcome is that none are true and are simply what they are, a primitive form of science developed thousands of years ago in an attempt to explain the natural world around them. It's the only thing, the only explanation that makes any logical sense.

Raising children child abuse????


leading them to Sjeool is abuse.