An Orlando McDonalds Manager To A Trans Applicant: "We Do Not Hire F**gots"

Right premice...wrong way to go about it. Show him/her/it the door and keep your mouth shut. But since he didn't McDonalds needs to pay for their stupidity.

reply to post by Carseller4


I think you may be confused as to what it means to be "transgender":

Transgender (pronounced /trænzˈdʒɛndər/) is a general term applied to a variety of individuals, behaviors, and groups involving tendencies to diverge from the normative gender roles.

Transgender is the state of one's "gender identity" (self-identification as woman, man, or neither) not matching one's "assigned sex" (identification by others as male or female based on physical/genetic sex). "Transgender" does not imply any specific form of sexual orientation; transgender people may identify as heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, polysexual, or asexual; some may consider conventional sexual orientation labels inadequate or inapplicable to them. The precise definition for transgender remains in flux, but includes:

* "Of, relating to, or designating a person whose identity does not conform unambiguously to conventional notions of male or female gender roles, but combines or moves between these."[1]

* "People who were assigned a sex, usually at birth and based on their genitals, but who feel that this is a false or incomplete description of themselves."[2]

* "Non-identification with, or non-presentation as, the sex (and assumed gender) one was assigned at birth."

en.wikipedia.org...

It has to do with one's sex, not one's sexuality.

Yeah, it's a sad day in the land of the (so-called) free when a business entrepreneur isn't allowed to personally decide who they would like to hire and not hire.

Think about this for a minute. Suppose you were just starting up a business or franchise, and you were now able to hire your first employee/slave, a sales person to go out and sell your products for you on the road. Now, would you want someone like THAT showing up around the country representing your business and product?

Say what you will about all this in a hypothetical situation, but one day you might find yourself in such a situation and end up being forced to hire someone that you know is not a good fit with YOUR business and image and you will loose everything, either due to a failed business, or due to some confused individual that feels it was YOUR responsibility to create and provide them a job and then they sue you because you didn't want to associate your business with THAT kind of personal advertising.

Originally posted by Divinorumus
Think about this for a minute. Suppose you were just starting up a business or franchise, and you were now able to hire your first employee/slave, a sales person to go out and sell your products for you on the road. Now, would you want someone like THAT showing up around the country representing your business and product?

Do a Google image search on "transgender". They look perfectly normal. Aside from the hate sites that is. I can provide pics if you like.

Originally posted by Divinorumus
Yeah, it's a sad day in the land of the (so-called) free when a business entrepreneur isn't allowed to personally decide who they would like to hire and not hire.

Think about this for a minute. Suppose you were just starting up a business or franchise, and you were now able to hire your first employee/slave, a sales person to go out and sell your products for you on the road. Now, would you want someone like THAT showing up around the country representing your business and product?

Say what you will about all this in a hypothetical situation, but one day you might find yourself in such a situation and end up being forced to hire someone that you know is not a good fit with YOUR business and image and you will loose everything, either due to a failed business, or due to some confused individual that feels it was YOUR responsibility to create and provide them a job and then they sue you because you didn't want to associate your business with THAT kind of personal advertising.

Any non biggoted and respectful human being is able to look past simple appearcenes, gender and sexuality. So if your business suffered because of this so called hypothetical person, your clientel are morons and you should find a better avenue of work.

It's not a matter of being able to hire who you want, it's about not being discriminatory against people you choose not to hire.

The problem wasn't that they wouln't hire him, the problem is that they disrespected and abused this kid verbally. That's the problem.

The fact that he's a transgender is beyond the point.

People are so silly, they think that something like sex or sexal orientation can affect their job skills....silly.

~Keeper

Originally posted by Divinorumus
Yeah, it's a sad day in the land of the (so-called) free when a business entrepreneur isn't allowed to personally decide who they would like to hire and not hire.

You can hire or NOT hire someone for just about anything but you cannot discrimnate based on race, religion, sexual preference etc.

IMHO this manager was simply stupid. He could have made up any reason and not hired the person, instead he chose to surface his bigotry and hopefully it costs him.

Substitute 'trangender" for Asian, Hispanic, Black, White, Catholic, Jewish, Muslim, etc etc How is that ANY Different?

[edit on 12/7/09 by FredT]

reply to post by Divinorumus


Of course you can choose not to hire someone, but not for any reason. It is against the law to discriminate and use discriminatory hiring practices. "Any reason" does not mean refusing to hire someone based on those kinds of factors. Would it be alright with you if your boss fired you for being whatever religion you are? No, it wouldn't, because that factors has nothing to do with your job, does it? That manager crosses the line leaving that derogatory message.

The right way to have gone about it would have been to suck it up and hire the person if that person was right for the job. Being transgender does not make anyone ineligible for hiring anywhere, you cant discriminate like that, unless you want to be sued.

He should have at least just kept his prejudices to himself and just said they were not hiring anymore, or something of that nature.

reply to post by Divinorumus

Originally posted by intrepid
Do a Google image search on "transgender". They look perfectly normal.

Some do, I suppose. I've known others though that seem to find it necessary to ADVERTISE their sexual preference 24x7.

Bottom line is, we've arrived at a sad point in history when it seems some individuals believe that it is another individuals responsibility to create and offer another a job, as if a job is a right.

A job is NOT a right, and therefore there should be no laws dictating an employers hiring practices. To tell an individual, a business owner, who they can or can't hire, is as repulsive an idea as telling someone who they can or can't marry (that was something once practiced too, i.e. a white could not marry a black).

This crazy commie-like infringement upon our freedom to live our life as we choose is what will ultimately bring civilization to its knees, when everyone finally has had enough of this in-your-face and monkey-on-your-back socialist new world order that's being shoved down our throats. Pretty soon you may no longer even be able to pick and choose your own friends.

People that would want to give away our freedom to choose for an ideal that THEY are beholding to are the enemy!

OK, here's the conspiracy theorist in me. I blame you guys.

Maybe this was a set up. Big legal payoff and they split the money. I just can't see anyone being this stupid. Leave a hard copy of bigotry? From a manager?

reply to post by intrepid

reply to post by OzWeatherman

Yes, you should be allowed to hire whoever you want, but why does the manager have to ring up and abuse the poor kid? That was totally uncalled for. A simple "you're not the kind iof person we are looking for" wouldve sufficed, but instead the moron decided that abuse was the way to go....how can someone think that is ok?

All these angry thoughts running through my head, and then I read your reply. I can't say it any better than you did, OZ; you hit the nail on the head perfectly. and THAT'S WHY this whackamole should go down, get fired, whatever punishment for his unnecessary insults warrants.

I'm a little surprised (okay, I've been out of the loop for 15 years) that a 17-year-old could pass the psychological screening and such to get the operation, however, I have known teenagers that were wiser than their years would imply. I hope she is able to find a job where people will respect her for her work and not judge her for her biology.

edit to add: apparently I have mistaken the term "transgender" for "transsexual". Okay. My bad, but what I said still stands for me, minus the pre/post-op screening. BAD argentus. smack! smack!



[edit on 7/12/09 by argentus]

Originally posted by Divinorumus

Originally posted by intrepid
Do a Google image search on "transgender". They look perfectly normal.

Some do, I suppose. I've known others though that seem to find it necessary to ADVERTISE their sexual preference 24x7.

How does this affect job performance exactly? Are you selling Fundamentalist bibles or something, because other than being a priest, that the only job I can see where a persons sex would seriously hurt their business

Bottom line is, we've arrived at a sad point in history when it seems some individuals believe that it is another individuals responsibility to create and offer another a job, as if a job is a right.

Well, its also sad to still seee hatred and ignorance of a persons sex, religion, ethnicity or sexual orientation

A job is NOT a right, and therefore there should be no laws dictating an employers hiring practices. To tell an individual, a business owner, who they can or can't hire, is as repulsive an idea as telling someone who they can or can't marry (that was something once practiced too, i.e. a white could not marry a black).

Its not saying anything like that. Its only the ignorant that think along these lines. You seem to think its ok to section off society and only hire those who you find personally appealing, rather than job performance, and thats where the issue lies

This crazy commie-like infringement upon our freedom to live our life as we choose is what will ultimately bring civilization to its knees, when everyone finally has had enough of this in-your-face and monkey-on-your-back socialist new world order that's being shoved down our throats. Pretty soon you may no longer even be able to pick and choose your own friends.

Again, another comment from someone who is ignorant. I dont understand how equal opportunity employement will "bring civilisation to its knees"

People that would want to give away our freedom to choose for an ideal that THEY are beholding to are the enemy!

Freedom does not include hatred, racism and bigtry. What about the other persons freedom? I guess, judging by your answers, that your view of freedom only applies to white, Christian, straight Americans.



[edit on 7/12/2009 by OzWeatherman]

Once again people, its not the fact that he was not hired. It is easy to find a reason to not hire just about anyone for any job. You simply don't call them back after the interview.

The only reason there needs to be is that you felt there were better candidates for the position.

The problem is that he called this person and left a slur on his answering machine in relation to the job.

Originally posted by OzWeatherman
Its not saying anything like that. Its only the ignorant that think along these lines. You seem to think its ok to section off society and only hire those who you find personally appealing, rather than job performance, and thats where the issue lies

What I'm saying is that IF THAT is what an individual prefers to believe, do, act, etc., that should be their right to believe and do so. What I'm saying is that if someone doesn't want to hire someone because of even something so trivial as their skin color or physical appearance, that should be their RIGHT to CHOOSE as they please. An individual should be able to choose their friends, their spouse, and their employees based upon ANY preferences THEY so PERSONALLY desire or not desire.

Now, I don't like racists or bigots any more than anyone else, but I do believe a human should have a right to be a racist or bigot if that is what they choose and how they want to live their life. THAT is what I'm saying. If someone wants to discriminate, that should be their right. They can do so when selecting their friends and spouse. Why should it be any different when selecting business associates and employees?

It's all about the right to decide for yourself who you would like to associate yourself with or not. I mean, would you like the government coming into your business one day and mandating that you will replace 1/3rd of your current christian staff with muslims? Where does one draw the line on this infringement into our own lives and how we would like to live them and among those we would like to decide for ourselves?

What if it IS your religious belief that you should only associate with like minds and beliefs? What if your religion prohibits you from hiring those that don't share your faith. Would you like some government telling you that you must hire those your religion proclaims are the infidels? Ha, this can get pretty messy.

The world certainly can do without racists and bigots, but when you start imposing rules and laws governing who we can or can not choose or reject as those we prefer or not to associate with, you really are giving up a freedom.

reply to post by Divinorumus


You seemed to have missed the issue though.....the main problem in this situation is the managers phone call to the transgendered youth. Do you think it was necessary to have called him/her back and hurled abuse?

Originally posted by OzWeatherman
reply to post by Divinorumus

 

You seemed to have missed the issue though.....the main problem in this situation is the managers phone call to the transgendered youth. Do you think it was necessary to have called him/her back and hurled abuse?

I have never even been called back to be told I didn't get a job, I just never heard anything out of company again. Sometimes even after a second or third interview.

reply to post by Divinorumus


I agree, on a personal level -- we all have a right to be as unpleasant as we want, as long as it doesn't impair or endanger anyone else's freedoms.

Where this person went widely astray was in making such a judgement professionally. He had no right to take his personal beliefs into the professional arena, and then to further his error by leaving a derogatory statement on her phone? I hope that manager -- or former-manager -- is representative of a femto-demographic.

Originally posted by gluetrap
I have never even been called back to be told I didn't get a job, I just never heard anything out of company again. Sometimes even after a second or third interview.

The only time Ive been called back is for the job I currently have. The first tinme I applied they told me I had just missed out but asked me to reapply the next year, which I did and ended up getting.

But I dont think any employer that I know of would call someone back and abuse them...its just idiotic

There's a huge difference between being a general business owner and being the owner of a McDonald's franchise. You have to play by their rules if you want a piece of their profit.

When you open a franchise under the golden arches you are representing the McDonald's corporation and not yourself. If you do something as dumb as this, you are doing it as a representative of McDonald's and you are subjecting them to the the liability.

It's not a case of "oh it's a sad day when people can't be entrepreneurs and decide who they hire etc." It's a case of "I just told someone's voicemail that they were a faggot and I did it under the banner of the McDonald's corporation."

Ronald ain't gonna be happy.