Buy your children toy weapons for Christmas and you could face an armed raid, police warn parents

reply to post by NovusOrdoMundi


Something is driving these policemen into that - nothing like a shotgun wedding kind of thingie, right?

They are not charging, exposing themselves to the rain of bullets, are they?

I'll tell you what. I think they are pretty relaxed, because they have a license to kill and they can get away with it without any sweat. If not feeling threatened is the key phrase here, than this answers the riddle. They feel safe killing people without needing to do any better than that.

reply to post by DangerDeath


Any police shooting in the UK is immediately reffered to the IPCC for independant investigation and every round must be logged and justified.

There have been instances where the police were found to have been "overstepping" the mark, or plain right aggressive and have been punished.

In fact, not a month seems to go by without a Policeman being banged up for breaking the law, so there is a functioning system that keeps them in check.

on the other side....

this could all be easily avoided by simple gun education for all adults.

the average adult probably could describe to me the difference in a S&W 45 and a 22 Magnum revolver. to the average joe all they know is it is a hand gun, it kills people, and its scary... (then they go piss themselves and call the authorities...)

The WW2 and Vietnam and Korean era people are soon to be moving out so to speak, and that leaves us with a newer generation of people who know nothing about guns and fighting for thier own sovergn freedom.

Think about the US. It is not considered to be really important to know how to clear, clean and prepare a weapon for use. How many of yo uknow what a stovepipe jam is and how to clear it?

even yet, how many of you driving on the road are gonna see a couple of kids running around the yard with what looks like guns and call the cops because you arent "sure" and it "may be" a real one...

information is the key to human success, and the laziness plague and the puss plague that has spread through most of the globe will be the end of all humanity.

Oh, yes, sure. How often does that happen? If policemen are under stress, and I know they are, what exactly causes that stress? I'd say the first on the list is the training, and this training is pretty ambivalent, because they need to be extremely safe in dangerous situation and at the same time follow the precise protocol. The trick is, they cannot follow the protocol because the other side doesn't - the result: policemen snap. They are intentionally put between the hammer and anvil. The system needs this kind of difference in potential in order to suck in people into itself, because people are just fuel for it. So all sides, police, criminals and including innocent citizens, are the victims - collateral damage - cannon fodder.

reply to post by wx4caster


Incidents with people who are familiar with weapons are numerous. There is no ideal weapon handling situation. Soldiers get ammo immediately before the battle.

Originally posted by wx4caster
How many of yo uknow what a stovepipe jam is and how to clear it?

Apply SPORTS?


Seriously though, it seems the Brits are doing something silly like this near every day. I have to admit that I see this sort of thing and cant help but laugh.

A country so neutered as this cannot expect to last in a world so ruthless. Come on guys! Send the sharia courts packing, tear down the cameras, and legalize firearms ownership and I will be the first one to donate a free handgun to a random Brit.

And I will teach them to apply SPORTS over my web cam.

Edit for better deal: outlaw the cameras and legalize firearms then we can trade. 3 security cameras (for my home, not the street!) for one medium grade handgun or riffle.

[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]

Originally posted by DangerDeath
If policemen are under stress, and I know they are, what exactly causes that stress?

Growing up neutered by a nanny state? Not being allowed to play with toy guns when they were children?

I met Police Recruits in Las Vegas who had never handled a weapon before the academy and probably would never handle a weapon other than their service pistol again. I can only how bad it is in "gun free" nations.

For real, stop raising little pansies! Someone needs to protect the little boys in Western society from the Nanny states and their neutering schools.

We have become so PC that little boys are expected to act like little girls and little girls are encouraged to be cops. Then we wonder why the 120 lb. woman cop has to taser EVERYONE when they don’t respect her 120lb authority. We wonder why the 200 lb male cop is afraid to go hands on with a criminal without first shocking the crap out of him.

I welcome our new Mexican and Muslim overlords! Family values will rise like the phoenix from the ashes (dirt) of third world countries. Being a man, I look forward to the work ethic (male laziness) inherent in both cultures.

[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]

reply to post by Regenstorm


They can just try, I can guarantee if they come to my house they'll get some Nerf darts to the face

This is outrageous, I used to LOVE playing with toy guns (swords, axes, knives, grenades), shooting invisible dinosaurs, ninjas, and running around with the neighbor kids in disputes about who shot who and who has to fall down. I had the most and best toy guns in the neighborhood and was always the resource for the kids who didn't have any or whose parents didn't want to buy them violent themed toys.

I always thought the glorification of violence in media was something TPTB wanted, this just sends a very mixed message. Thing is though, they can't stop little boys from wanting to play guns, kids will make ANYTHING into a gun and even use their fingers when they can't find a suitable stick or other object. It's in our nature to pretend to destroy each other, I always though TPTB were all for that... Weird...

[edit on 5-12-2009 by Titen-Sxull]

Originally posted by cavscout

Originally posted by wx4caster
How many of yo uknow what a stovepipe jam is and how to clear it?

Apply SPORTS?

Seriously though, it seems the Brits are doing something silly like this near every day. I have to admit that I see this sort of thing and cant help but laugh.

A country so neutered as this cannot expect to last in a world so ruthless. Come on guys! Send the sharia courts packing, tear down the cameras, and legalize firearms ownership and I will be the first one to donate a free handgun to a random Brit.

And I will teach them to apply SPORTS over my web cam.

Edit for better deal: outlaw the cameras and legalize firearms then we can trade. 3 security cameras (for my home, not the street!) for one medium grade handgun or riffle.

[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]

No doubt! I am shocked by the total lack of freedom in the UK. Any police try to raid my home without a warrant is going to be an issue.

Originally posted by NightoftheComet
No doubt! I am shocked by the total lack of freedom in the UK. Any police try to raid my home without a warrant is going to be an issue.

HAHAHA! Oh, the irony....

You say "I am amazed at the lack of freedom in the UK", then go on to state a complete untruth showing the world you actually don't know anything about which your apparently amazed by..

They need warrants here too you know....

Have you actually ever visited the UK? What is it that makes you think we have a total lack of freedom?

Aside from being able to shoot each other all day and night, what is it you can do that I cannot?

In fact, I can pretty much gurantee that there are things both of us can do that other cannot, for example, if I was caught with some cannabis in the UK, I'd get a slapped wrist and be sent on my merry way, in the US it seems to land you hard time inside...

I know you werent talking to me but I couldnt resist.

Originally posted by stumason
Have you actually ever visited the UK? What is it that makes you think we have a total lack of freedom?

Cameras? Your police deciding what toys you can buy your children?

Aside from being able to shoot each other all day and night, what is it you can do that I cannot?

Walk around without Big Brother watching us? Recieve quality health care (for now.)

In fact, I can pretty much gurantee that there are things both of us can do that other cannot, for example, if I was caught with some cannabis in the UK, I'd get a slapped wrist and be sent on my merry way, in the US it seems to land you hard time inside...

In some states you can be jailed for a small amount of weed. In MOST places in the US you will not even be cited. In some places (see: Alaska) personal use is not illegal at all and the police cant even confiscate. I think its 14 states that have medical marijuana now, and over 30 that have decriminalized it.

Trust me, our cops aren’t bending over backwards to bust anyone for a joint. In Vegas Metro PD, even small amounts of crack aren’t likely to get you cited. The cop says "I’m gonna put this on the ground and if it is still there when I turn around you are going to jail." Crack head then stomps on rock with shoe, comes back an hour later and licks the asphalt.

Really, they are too busy to care about the individual user.

Dont be mad at us for calling it like we see it, be mad at your media for airing your dirty laundry


[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]

reply to post by NovusOrdoMundi


Common sense dictates asking you what you would do if someone walked into your home and pointed a gun at you? Are we supposed to believe you would just calmly and reasonably dial the police? Assuming you were able to dial the police if someone walked into your home and pointed a gun at you, common sense then dictates asking why you would believe your life was in danger if a person pointing a gun at you would allow you to calmly and reasonably dial the police?

Common sense dictates that if someone walks into your home and points a gun at you they are doing so to threaten your life and it is unreasonable to expect anyone to believe you would have the opportunity to call the police. If, at some point you did get that opportunity to call the police it is reasonable to assume at that point that your life is indeed in danger and calling the police merited. That is, assuming you don't have a weapon yourself which could be used as lawful self defense.

Common sense dictates that people have the right to defend their lives and property and such an action is lawful and even expected under to rules of survival. Common sense dictates that any organization of law enforcement officers would be done so to uphold your lawful right to defend yourself and/or defend your right to life, liberty and property in the event you were unable to defend yourself.

Common sense also dictates that if a strange child walked into your home pointing a gun at you it would be prudent to assume that strange child is threatening your life and any actions to defend yourself would be merited. Conversely, common sense dictates that if that child was one of your own or even a neighbor that you knew and walked into your home and pointed a gun at you, that it might possibly be the foolish action of a child with a toy gun, or God forbid the unstable actions of a mentally troubled child. Either way, if that child you know is pointing an actual gun capable of causing you harm, common sense dictates you act in a way to defend your right to life, liberty and property. If it turns out this gun is just a toy gun, common sense dictates you take the toy gun away from the child and explain to them the very real consequences that come with pointing a gun at someone, real or not.

~IF~this story is real...Why don't the UK police raid the toy stores and shops selling the toy weapons instead?
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Originally posted by Signals
~IF~this story is real...Why don't the UK police raid the toy stores and shops selling the toy weapons instead?
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This is an excellent point and it is unclear to me if the story being reported is real or not, and is even more unclear to me how law is legislated and enforced and adjudicated in the United Kingdom. However, in the U.S., judges are continually dismissing charges of illegal behavior for possessing items that were lawfully bought in stores and market places. Police officers in the U.S. are often inclined to arrest people or ticket them for possessing rolling paper and the charge brought against them is "illegal paraphernalia". Charges such as these are often dismissed by prudent judges because rolling papers are clearly a product sold legally in the U.S. The same legal reasoning would apply to toy guns, and given that much of the U.S. jurisprudence is based on British jurisprudence it would not be unreasonable to assume that this legal reasoning holds true in the U.K. as well.

So is this their approach to taking weapons? Scaring people with raids?

Originally posted by SeeingBlue
So is this their approach to taking weapons? Scaring people with raids?

No, because toys are not weapons.

This is their way of enforcing their preferred social order, that is to say the pansification of the Western world. Funny thing, that pansification only seems to apply to guns.

They aren’t worried about violence, the UK is a brutal and dangerous place. They are only worried about honest people defending themselves with guns. Surprising from the nation that gives us video footage of people dying and being beaten on the streets while bystanders do nothing to help.

Course, that is what the cameras are for, right? Because they need to be able to respond quickly due to the fact that they have disarmed their victims. I would hate to be a victim of random crime in the UK, and from what I understand there are many such victims.

I certainly wouldn’t live in the UK without a gun to protect myself, and I don’t even go armed in the US anymore; its safe enough here because criminals never know who is going to pull out a gun and protect themselves or others from violence.

[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]

Originally posted by cavscout
Cameras? Your police deciding what toys you can buy your children?

What, you don't have CCTV in the US? How silly of me....

Oh, the Police aren't doing any deciding about anything. Not sure where you've got that from...

Originally posted by cavscout
Walk around without Big Brother watching us? Recieve quality health care (for now.)

Our healthcare system is one of the best in the world, don't go falling for the very lame attempts in your extremely shallow media to say otherwise.

What Big Brother is watching me? Again, not sure where you pulling this from and not sure why you think you're unique.

In fact, I can pretty much gurantee that there are things both of us can do that other cannot, for example, if I was caught with some cannabis in the UK, I'd get a slapped wrist and be sent on my merry way, in the US it seems to land you hard time inside...

Originally posted by cavscout
In some states you can be jailed for a small amount of weed. In MOST places in the US you will not even be cited. In some places (see: Alaska) personal use is not illegal at all and the police cant even confiscate. I think its 14 states that have medical marijuana now, and over 30 that have decriminalized it.

Really? Sorry, I find that extremely hard to believe given the extreme efforts the US goes to to stop drugs. Your story about crack is amusing but equally as hard to believe.

Originally posted by cavscout
Dont be mad at us for calling it like we see it, be mad at your media for airing your dirty laundry

Where did this story come from? Oh, that's right, the Daily Mail. Shame on you for falling for sensationalist clap-trap that this newspaper makes it's money on peddling.

Next week, the headline will be "Black People Spread AIDS thorugh sneezing out of their ears!" and last week it was "12 Billion Immigrants living in the UK given 10 bedroom houses while White person is shot by Police!". It's a joke of a rag.

reply to post by cavscout


What an enormously huge, steaming pile of Bovine turd.

The UK is a violent and dangerous place? And worse than the US?

Pull the other one. Where are you pulling this little load of dangly gonad from? We have a much lower rate of violent crime than the US, period. Lower gun crime, lower knife crime, lower rates of almost every violent crime recordable.

You really do like to peddle rubbish, don't you?

Originally posted by cavscout
Walk around without Big Brother watching us? Recieve quality health care (for now.)

Err the UK has a higher life expectancy than the USA and we pay less per capita to achieve it, so how exactly are we not receiving quality care? You may want to check my thread history and find one where i talk about the absolutely superb treatment my teminally ill father has received at the hands of what you very wrongly think is an inferior health care system. In the same thread my mothers battle with breast cancer and the utterly superb treatment she had. The facts don't back up your claims.

You are basically another indoctrinated fool when it comes to the haelthcare issue, oooo socialised healthcare, first it's that and then everyone is taxed 100% and all the wealth shared out. Again i say we pay less per person for our healthcare and get treatment that means our countries life expectancy is slightly higher than yours.

Learn the facts before commenting.

As for this toy gun thing, it's really very stupid. I remember when i was a kid, me and some friends had cap guns. These were the kind that didn't fire anything they just made a small bang when you pulled the trigger. Once we were playing and a police car turned up, i suppose someone thought we had real guns or something. Anyway we pointed them at the police car and shot them several times (hey we were kids!). The police then used some kind of speaker and shouted "bang bang" back at us lol. They drove off and left us to it.

It does seem things have changed.

Originally posted by stumason
What, you don't have CCTV in the US? How silly of me....

Yes we do, on private property. We respect the rights of private property owners to film their goings on. My government does not have cctv outside of government offices.

Our healthcare system is one of the best in the world, don't go falling for the very lame attempts in your extremely shallow media to say otherwise.

I have two friends who have experienced your sub-standard health care system. One of them had to quit his job and move back to the states because his wife couldnt recieve the care she needed promptly.

I should state, however, that I have no personal experience with your health care system.

Really? Sorry, I find that extremely hard to believe given the extreme efforts the US goes to to stop drugs. Your story about crack is amusing but equally as hard to believe.

The marijuana laws in the US are not hard to find, just Google "marijuana laws by state." NORML: US and UK drug laws
From above source:

In the United Kingdom, use of drugs, other than opium, is not an offense. Possession and acquisition of drugs is an offense, and the UK divides drugs into three categories for the purpose of law enforcement. There are no special provisions exempting drug addicts from criminal responsibility.

Cannabis and cannabis resin are grouped into Category B. The penalty for possession and/or acquisition of a Category B substance is a summary offense of six months' imprisonment and/or a fine of L400, or upon indictment up to five years in prison. In practice, the courts usually impose a fine in cases involving cannabis products. Trafficking (also to include personal cultivation) carries a possible twelve months in prison and/or L400 fine.

From same source (covers Alaska only, the most pot friendly state):

Possession of one ounce or less of marijuana in the privacy of the home is legal. The status of possessing an amount between one ounce and four ounces is unclear, pending clarification by the courts. Possession of 4 ounces or more of marijuana is a felony punishable by up to five years in prison and a fine of up to $50,000.

So far as the crack, I have nothing but anecdotal evidence from my own personal experience working with Las Vegas Metro Police Department. But thanks for calling me a liar, glad we can keep things civil after all these years.

Where did this story come from? Oh, that's right, the Daily Mail. Shame on you for falling for sensationalist clap-trap that this newspaper makes it's money on peddling.

Sorry, I didnt know about this source.

Does this mean the story is not true?

[edit on 5-12-2009 by cavscout]