Saudi court upholds child rapist crucifixion ruling

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


"Punish if you must but do it humanely and with dignity people. "

The same way this monster killed those children? With dignity?

I think not. Perhaps it's easy for me to imagine what I would do to a man like this as I was a victim once myself. You say you also have kids, 5 wasn't it? If a monster like this man had hurt or worse one of your kids, can you not say your rage would boil over and consume you? Forgive someone like that? Never. Like I said, I would have no problem "stooping" to this monsters level to exact justice. If he took my only child away, what else would I have to lose?

This thread is yet another example of the wide divide between those who would meter out justice using the same tactics and techniques as the accused, and those who would seek to find a better, more deterring and morally right way of punishing those who murder and rape.

For me it is as simple as this: Many countries have the Death Penalty and yet still see just as many murders and rapes, if not more, than countries that do not. Where is the deterrent? There is none obviously, as people are still being killed and raped.

No, I think this is more about the bloodlust and the "eye for an eye" attitude by people who secretly wish they could perform these tasks themselves on someone but do not want to be punished for it. Therefore it is easier to get behind the bandwgon of morally corrupt bloodlust and perform the same heinous deed on the accused as the accussed did to the victim and label it as "Just Punishment" - therefore getting their share of bloodlust and hatred without the accompanying punishment. Sickening really.....

Oh and ProtoPlasmic While I see what you meant by the comment about Australia being a penal colony, you must understand that to an Aussie that is rather insulting as we have that thrown at us constantly by foreigners who seek to make us seem like a giant island full of convicts. Just letting you know is all (Oh and Zazz I'm related to one of the guards too! Those pesky foreigners seem to forget that where there are prisoners there are also guards.....)

Originally posted by Kryties
For me it is as simple as this: Many countries have the Death Penalty and yet still see just as many murders and rapes, if not more, than countries that do not. Where is the deterrent? There is none obviously, as people are still being killed and raped.

Baloney


Saudi Arabia is just a hot bed of Rape and murder.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Ha, is that all you have? This, of course, coming from the man who lives in a country in which many states still support the death penalty - yet still has equal amounts of murder and rape than those states (and other countries) that don't.

Try a little harder mate, you really should come up with a better argument than to just label it as "Baloney".

reply to post by Kryties


Give it a rest and park that holier than thou attitude.
The guy was a child rapists. He will receive what he deserves. No need to drag out the soap box and spew your version of morality.

Anyone who abuses children in this way does not deserve to live.

Simple as that.

Anyone who takes someone else's life deliberately and in cold blood does not deserve to live.

reply to post by SLAYER69


This whole thread is about the morality of murdering someone, as punishment, for the crime of rape and murder. I will NOT shut up about my point of view, and NOTHING you can say will silence me.

You have proven that you would rather display bloodlust and murder the accused rather than find a different, effective and moral way of doing it. I am showing that there is another way of going about it. What is your problem? Last time I checked this is a board for EVERYONE not just those who agree with your opinion.

Try harder mate......

[edit on 4/11/2009 by Kryties]

Originally posted by spellbound
Anyone who abuses children in this way does not deserve to live.

Simple as that.

Anyone who takes someone else's life deliberately and in cold blood does not deserve to live.

But crucifying is a bit too far, right? I mean at the most lethal injection.

reply to post by Kryties


Here's the difference between you and I.

You sit in judgment of that countries laws and apparently judge me and mine. By your outburst. I wont judge you and yours. Where does this higher opinion of self come from where you can sit in judgment of others?

That was their laws not yours or mine. By the way I never said to shut up.

reply to post by SLAYER69


Yes, I do sit in judgement of your countries', and Saudi Arabias', laws as they are morally wrong, filled with bloodlust and quite frankly backward.

My country voted away the death penalty years ago, because WE THE PEOPLE decided it was morally wrong. Whats wrong with urging other countries to do the same? And don't give me that crap about "each to his own" and "respect other countries" as the United States has a foreign policy of interfering with just about every other nation on Earth, trying to inject "democracy" into even those countries that don't want to know about it.

[edit on 4/11/2009 by Kryties]

Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Yes, I do sit in judgement of your countries, and Saudi Arabia's laws as they are morally wrong, filled with bloodlust and quite frankly backward.

This part here just demonstrates your arrogance.
I didn't bother quoting the rest. Irrelevant.

reply to post by SLAYER69


You label it arrogance, I label it as a moral awakening.

Is the rest on my post actually "irrelevant" or is it more that you just don't know how to respond to it?

Got any more?

[edit on 4/11/2009 by Kryties]

Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

You label it arrogance, I label it as a moral awakening.

Got any more?

Moral awakening?
By whose standard?
Yours?

I ignored your obvious attempt to drag the US into this."irrelevant" The thread was about Saudi Arabia. Sad really. Classic deflection.





[edit on 4-11-2009 by SLAYER69]

Originally posted by SLAYER69
Moral awakening?
By whose standard?
Yours?

....and that of most of my entire country, and all those MANY other countries who have abolished the death penalty.....this isn't just my opinion you know

I ignored your obvious attempt to drag the US into this. The thread was about Saudi Arabia. Sad really. Classic deflection.

No deflection intended, the statement was made to pre-empt any argument from your side that I should leave other countries to do their own thing - I was merely pointing out that since the US doesn't do this it would be rather hypocritical of you to mention it.

But I do see what you have done here by attempting to deflect the topic onto something I wrote that you have misconstrued either ignorantly or deliberately. Nice try mate


[edit on 4/11/2009 by Kryties]

reply to post by Kryties


On the contrary.

You set out right from the start to judge another country's laws according to YOUR version of morality then ASSUmed what my stance would be.

EPIC FAIL.

Again that is their laws and even with my supposedly huge American Ego, I refuse to judge them for their laws. It apparently works for them. There doesn't appear to be a giant problem in Arabia.

Again the topic was Saudi Arabia not the US.


[edit on 4-11-2009 by SLAYER69]

Originally posted by SLAYER69

Again the topic was Saudi Arabia not the US.

To which I came in here and remarked about the swarm of people coming in here, pitchforks raised ready to behead and crucify someone who raped a child. Yes, the raping of the child was wrong on every level concievable (make sure you read this several times and stick it in your head as I will not be accused of having no empathy for the victim again, as I have been in other threads) and the accused should be punished - but beheading and crucifying the dead body is morally wrong, a little sick and definately backward.

Oh, and in order to make a full case for or against the death penalty, one must look at ALL countries who still perform executions to get a complete picture - focusing on just one country narrows the field and does not give a whole picture of the situation. So, by telling me not to bring the US into this, you are suggesting I limit my research and only talk about that which suits you?

[edit on 4/11/2009 by Kryties]

The sad irony here is the very same Americans applauding this mans beheading and crucifixion are the same ones who, when it suits their viewpoint, berate the Muslims as "savage barbarians" etc....

Pathetic...

It must also be noted that the man was convicted on the evidence of the 3 year old victim....

Many an adult jury has sent an innocent man to his death...ask anyone from Texas.....

Could it be possible he may be innocent, and it is your innocent son(hypothetically ) who is to be executed????

Not trying to downplay the severity of the crime, not at all, but, playing devils advocate, it wouldnt surprise me if he was innocent....which, to me, just highlights once again why the abolition of the death penalty is a must for any country believing itself to be civilised....


"In 2008 China, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and the United States of America were the five states with the highest rate of executions. Together they carried out (93%) of all executions worldwide.
Europe and Central Asia is now virtually a death penalty free zone following the abolition of the death penalty in Uzbekistan for all crimes. There is just one country left — Belarus — that still carries out executions.

In the Americas, only one state — the United States — consistently executes. However, even the USA moved away from the death penalty in 2008. This year, the smallest number of executions since 1995 was reported in the USA.

The majority of countries now refrain from using the death penalty. Furthermore, in 2008 Amnesty International recorded only 25 out of 59 countries that retain the death penalty actually carried out executions. The practice of states indicates that there is increasing consolidation of majority international consensus that the death penalty cannot be reconciled with respect for human rights.

Despite positive developments a number of tough challenges remain. Countries in Asia carried out more executions in 2008 than the rest of the world put together. The region with the second highest number of reported executions was the Middle East."


From Amnesty USA

Originally posted by Kryties
(make sure you read this several times and stick it in your head as I will not be accused of having no empathy for the victim again, as I have been in other threads)

More assumptions?

the accused should be punished - but beheading and crucifying the dead body is morally wrong, a little sick and definately backward.

You left out the part about that being your opinion.
Get it yet?

So, by telling me not to bring the US into this, you are suggesting I limit my research and only talk about that which suits you?

Nope, It's just staying on topic is all.


[edit on 4-11-2009 by SLAYER69]

I cannot believe so many people support such a barbaric sentence. That sort of thing makes us no better than the ones who commit those heinous crimes. It's not "justice", it's brutality.

"Justice" would be putting this guy into a prison where he would himself get raped. That, I could see as "justice", though I don't approve of that either. But to crucify someone? Barbaric.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
More assumptions?

Being accused of having no empathy for the victim in other threads is NOT an assumption mate, it is FACT.

You left out the part about that being your opinion.
Get it yet?

Yes, it is my opinion, but I will not be silenced for having it - as you have tried to do not only by telling me to "get off my soapbox" but also by attempting to make it look like I am deflecting the topic - when in fact what I discussed has EXTREME relevance to the topic at hand - being the DEATH PENALTY.

Nope, It's just staying on topic is all.

Which I have also done, and your continual assertions that I have not are only making your argument weaker by the minute.