Parity Among Derogatory Slurs

reply to post by HotSauce


So in all of your posts and in everything you've said here so far, I'll ask the simple question...

"Should their be parity among derogatory slurs?"

I'm not saying what you should believe. But if you call someone a slur based on their gender, skin color or religion, it seems that a hierarchy exists based on what slur you use. Should this hierarchy exist?

Or is it more acceptable to insult someone for being gay, than it is for their skin color?

I'm merely stating that I believe it should be as equally wrong to insult someone for their sexuality as it is their skin color.

Do you agree or disagree?

reply to post by chissler


I think you should be free to call someone anything you like and they should be free to kick your ass if they don't like it. That is slur equality for you.

I don't think we should be forced to hold in our feelings for something we do not like or disagree with, because that is more dangerous and it is what leads to people building up feelings until they become violent.

I thnk we can learn to tolerate certain peoples behavior choices but it doesn't mean we have to accept them as being right.

I think if you are born black or jewish or handicappped etc there isn't much you can do about it, but if you are born gay you can choose not to have sex with someone of the same sex. This is just like if you are born an alcoholic you can choose not to drink no matter how good a bottle of Jack Daniels looks when it glimmers in the light.

reply to post by HotSauce


I hear you, but you're not answering my question. Within the long list of slurs that you could possibly throw at someone, do you believe some are worse than others? I'm not debating your right to say it or not to say it. I don't think you should say it, but that's for another topic. My question to you is are some worse than others? Is insulting someone on their race the same as insulting them on their religion? Is insulting someone on their gender the same as their sexual orientation?

You believe what you believe and this thread isn't going to change that. But my question is merely, are they all one in the same or are some worse than others?

Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
So what you are saying in a long winded speech there is that if you use a derogatory term, the police should get involved? Do you really want that type of retardation in this country? We have enough retards running it._)

I apologize for using more than three sentences which apparently exceeds the attention span or comprehension limit of some. Nice way to be derisively derogatory there!

We already have such Criminal Laws in all States of the Union. It is called Harassment. Any words or actions that can be construed as patently offensive by the victim can be considered a Misdemeanor.

However, that was *NOT* what I was suggesting in the least. As there is no need to change the various State Harassment laws as they already sufficiently address such an issue.

In the context of the OP of this thread, it was noting the disparity in specific examples of how one derogatory slur in sports is accepted, while the next is given a mild punishment, yet the next is given a severe punishment, when in fact all should be treated with the same stern severity, equally and without bias.

Ideally, derogatory slurs should be condemned equally across society. Let social stigma dictate such, just as it has for Racial slurs for the past decade or two. The threat of ostracization, public denouncement and humiliation has been enough to ensure proper behavior modification from all but the most extreme of racists. No judicial intervention has been needed.

However, this shouldn't be limited to just Racial slurs, as what is the difference between saying hurtful words based upon the color of one's skin compared to saying hurtful words based upon one's sexual preference? They are equally as harming, equally as insidious, and equally as offensive. They should be treated equally when authoritative agencies look to take punitive action. The NFL is not the Police...but they are authoritative for all the players on any NFL team. Within their jurisdiction, they should do as they see fit, so long as it is not disparate from the punitive measures they take against other players. If they decide X against a Player for making racist comments, then they should decide X against another Player for making sexist comments, just as they should decide X against a third Player for making homophobic comments. The punitive measures they choose to take should be equal and without bias across the board...That's a big difference than saying the NFL should always call the Police.

And, might it also be said that your use of the "R" word is patently offensive to those with physical, mental, or learning disabilities. You have successfully used a derogatory slur that subtly promulgates and condones further discrimination against those with Autism, Cerebral Palsy, Down Syndrome, and a myriad of other disabilities. The use of such a slur not only hurts those it slanders, but it displays one's lack of compassion, consideration, and overall lack of maturity.

Is it really too much to ask that people learn to think before they open their mouth (or use their fingers)?

Asking people to grow a thicker skin never excuses one's own lack of consideration and fore-thought into their choice of words. At some point a person has to grow up and take accountability for the words they recklessly and carelessly use, rather than expecting everyone else to just shrug them off.

reply to post by chissler


I believe they are all equal and none of them should be punishable by the government. I believe they all represent peoples opinions whether it be meant as a joke or a slur or whatever. I believe people should have a right to express their opinions freely. I believe some people like to scream racism or sexism as a way to get their way or to punish those that may or may not disagree with them. I believe people should quit being oversensitive and learn to let stuff slide of their backs, and I believe people should learn to take a joke and make a joke.

I also believe if gay people have the right to parade down the street half naked and even try to teach my kid how to perform gay sex acts then I shold have the right to say whatever I feel like saying about them without them screaming HOMOPHOBE!

Does that answer your question?

[edit on 2-11-2009 by HotSauce]

reply to post by HotSauce


So in quoting the example I used previously, can you at least see the discrepancy that exists in society? When we punish those that use racial slurs and ignore those that use homophobic slurs? Whether you believe they are right or not, do you think it is hypocritical that a system would punish one but not the other?

Societal norms tell us that are all wrong. Yet some are more acceptable than others.

Is this not hypocritical?

reply to post by chissler


I am not going to say it is hypocritical, because I don't think any of it should be punishable by the government. It is not their job to worry about some ones oversensitivities.

Now if you physically harm someone JUST for being gay or black or jewish or white or whatever then you should get punished for physically harming them, and you should go to jail fo rthe same amount of time regardless of the race, sexual orientation, etc of the person you harmed. You should not get extra time just because they are African American or gay or whatever.

Most of us on ATS believe it is wrong for Advertisers or Government to use Subliminal Messaging. Yet, how are slurs any different?

Most of us on ATS believe that it is wrong for Law Enforcement and Government Agencies to do Profiling. Yet how are slurs any different?

Yet somehow it is socially "acceptable" to do these things and shrug it off as harmless when anyone else does it? It is somehow justifiable as blowing off the responsibility unto the victim that is offended rather than taking personal accountability for one's own inconsideration?

There does indeed seem to be a lot of hypocrisy.

Originally posted by fraterormus
Yet, how are slurs any different?

Because the person spewing the slur defends the spreading of this hatred as some god given right through freedom of speech and conveniently denies the self-serving component that is associated with this sort of behavior. It forever goes unacknowledged that these slurs usually make the individual feel better about themselves in some twisted manner.

Stems from insecurities, in my opinion.

reply to post by chissler


Saying something is "so gay" is not being hateful. Only someone who is oversensitive to what other people think of them would even believe that.

reply to post by fraterormus


What does subliminal message have to do with alleged slurs? Also I am pro profiling by the police because it helps them focus their resources.

Originally posted by poedxsoldiervet
reply to post by chissler

 

What wars have been fought over sayings? Your trying to get PC there, PC is what has runied this country.

He never has given any examples of sayings like you are so gay starting wars, even though he keeps brining it up at least twice.

I dont know about Austrailia, but here in America we have a first amendment in the bill of rights. That first amendment says we can say whatever the hell we want. Racial slurs hurt feelings, but oh well.

reply to post by kingoftheworld


Thanks for reminding me of the old but true adage.. Sticks and Stones may break my bones, BUT NAMES CAN NEVER HURT ME.

I enjoy the use of derogatory slurs and racist jokes. To me, it's acceptable as long as the other party can find humour in it. If they're used with hate towards another person, then that's when there is no humour and there is ignorance and intolerance that I'd in no way condone.

Sure, calling someone or something "gay" is pretty juvenile but I do so often. I mean, I might have a rather childish sense of humour but if political jokes are seen as the most witty sense of humour call me a preadolescent schoolboy with a potty mouth.

[edit on 2-11-2009 by Whine Flu]

Personally, I don't have any problem with someone who's a bigot on his own time. Well, OK, I *do* have a problem with it, but I feel it's his right. Someone talking among friends, or at a private party, should be free to be as stupid as he wants.

On Twitter, things are a bit different. If this was an account with lots of followers, then this guy deserved a suspension for being offensive. He had to know that his comments would be widly publicized, and that some of the people who saw it would be offended. Now he's being public, and he has to behave himself. Or get spanked.

There's always going to be some knucklehead out there who has a problem with some group or another. There is really no way to stop it. Certainly laws don't stop it. They just make it less obvious, drive it underground. I think that's a start, but it's not enough. We won't be past this until people in general learn to respect others, period. It's coming. We're way better than we were 50 or even 20 years ago. But we still have a long way to go.

Want to get rid of derogatory slurs?

Then tell people to stop being offended over them.

When people stop being offended over these words then the power they wield is gone.

50% of the blame goes to those who use those words

50% of the blame goes to those who let those words offend them.

reply to post by chissler

Thank you for displaying the very ignorance that
I was hoping this thread would expose.

Personally, I'm to the point where every time I hear someone accuse someone of "ignorance" I conclude that they're an idiot.

But let's just turn this around on you: you're asking for parity in slurs, yes? And you apparently think a tennis player receiving a six month ban for using one is an appropriate punishment, right?

So since you've just used a slur yourself, and called someone "ignorant" wouldn't you agree that it's appropriate for you to be banned from ATS moderation for six months?

Originally posted by chissler

Australian tennis player banned for racial abuse

This guy got 6 months for using a racial slur.

Bloody hell, 19 year old and gets a total of $24,000 in fines for a word, yet we have seasons footballers who gang rape drunk women because their culture is to accept it and the woman is the victim an these lads get off pretty much scott free.. The sporting culture is completely effed up.

If we could take the penalty applied to things like this and apply it across society, for all sorts of crimes, god I'd think we'd be better off..

Noting suprises me anymore. To the point why bother even trying...

The topic of this thread keeps getting missed. I'm not asking if it is right or wrong. Personally, I've reached the point where I don't care if you think it is right or wrong. What I am asking is whether or not it is right that society views some as worse than others?

To the people speaking against what I am saying here, answer the following questions.

1. Would you comfortably use the "N" word in a public place surrounded by strangers?

2. Would you comfortably use homophobic slurs in a public place surrounded by strangers?

Answer honestly, if you will.

The simple fact is that there are a lot of people that are comfortable using some slurs in society, and not others. So whether the use of the slur is right or wrong, whether it's about people just being too sensitive. None of that is what we're talking about here. The issue is the lack of parity.