AREA 51/Groom Lake ILS Approaches?

Hi,

I know that at AREA-51 runway 32 uses ILS via the SMOKY approach for all JANET flight for landing runway 32

But what about runway 14?? (the opposite side of runway 32 near the salt lake bed)
Does that have an ILS or is it just runway 32 that has it?

Here the info I got from the Dreamlandresort website.

Janet Routes to Area 51
Route: LAS -> Groom

Filed Flight Plan FIDOE SHOWW BTY060030
Normal Route LAS - FIDOE - MCY - Pyramid - Visual Approach Groom Rwy.32
Keyhole (Direct) LAS - FIDOE - MCY (Planet) - TEDDY - Visual Approach Groom Rwy.32
Red Flag LAS - FIDOE - MCY (Planet) - ABBIE - Visual Approach Groom Rwy.32
ILS Yankee Appr. LAS - FIDOE - MCY (Planet) - SMOKY - ILS Rwy.32

And...

Groom typically uses Rwy 32 for arriving Janet 737's, and Rwy 14 for departures. The smaller Beechliners often use the shorter Rwy 30 for arrival and Rwy 12 for departure. The old Rwy 14R/32L is no longer used. Rwy 32 is equipped with an ILS.

But what about runway 14?
Is that ILS equipped as well, or only runway 32?





thx



[edit on 23-10-2009 by darpa999]

[edit on 23-10-2009 by darpa999]

[edit on 23-10-2009 by darpa999]

Umm, probably a stupid question but...
Could you clarify what an ILS is for those of us that aren't familiar with the terminology.

Ok, fine. ILS (Instrument Landing System) which automatically guides an aircraft in the intended runway using whats called an ILS frequency.

This is used in low visibilty conditions such as heavy fog in which you cannot see the runway....Therefore, pilots really need to rely on their instruments using the term ILS, which guides the airplane to its intended runway.

Hope this helped. Also, you can Google it.

Now, does runway 14 on the opposite side of runway 32 at Groom Lake is ILS equipped or only runway 32?

[edit on 23-10-2009 by darpa999]

[edit on 23-10-2009 by darpa999]

Thank you for clarifying that.

In answer to you question: I don't know.
Not to give you a hard time but what is the difference if the other runway is ILS equipped or not.

I imagine if weather is poor they would just use the ILS equipped runway.

Ive documented all the ILS gear I could find around the Nellis range here:
nav aids

I haven't found any gear for the approach to 14.

Having monitored Groom Lake air traffic over the years, I've rarely heard instrument approaches. I suspect they like to fly in lower than the glideslope allows.

I have considerable Janet recordings here:
Janet audio

reply to post by ShadowLink


They pick the direction to land due to wind conditions, so there could be a situation where they needed a landing on 14 under ILS.

My guess is that in order to intercept a glideslope for a 14 landing, the plane would be visible from the ET Highway. [A 737 driver would have to verify this.] Thus they decided never to land ILS on 14. If push came to shove and an ILS landing on 14 was the only possibility, they would just divert to the TTR or McCarran.

Every landing I've seen from Tikaboo for 737s has been from the south. I'm pretty sure this has been the case for the Beech Janets too. I can't say for sure that military aircraft haven't landed on 14.

I suppose a review of all the Janet scanner audio would show if their evern was a landing on 14, even if visual. Obviously I've listened to more landings than I have witnessed.

Originally posted by gariac
Having monitored Groom Lake air traffic over the years, I've rarely heard instrument approaches. I suspect they like to fly in lower than the glideslope allows.

Since it's in the middle of the desert I'm betting the weather has more to do with it than trying to avoid surveillance. How many days a year do they get clouds, let alone fog or a low ceiling? Frankly I'm surprised they even have an ILS.

Historically, there has been an ILS system for Runway 14. The old airstrip (Runway 14R) that is now closed had an ILS glide slope system (Building 905) and power shed (Building 906). Presumably it was moved for use with the new Runway 14L.

reply to post by mtmaraca


It is high desert, so the weather can be quite nasty. I've had snow flakes fall on me in April.

Often when you are in Vegas, the weather is calm and dry, but you can look to the north and see precipitation. There is a 3000ft altitude difference.

reply to post by Shadowhawk


The glideslope is tough to spot on Google Earth, though I'm pretty sure I know where they are for Groom and the TTR. [I strive for accuracy, which is why I haven't posted their locations.] But the localizer is hard to hide. I don't see the antenna array for the localizer on Google Earth.

The localizer for 32 is in a funny place if you checked my other post. Presumably they wanted it off the dry lake since sometimes the lake isn't dry. ;-)

Flight that might have done a 14 landing

I'm not sure if this is the flight that got the original poster interested in instrument landings on 14. The flightaware tracking is odd in that it looks like the flight was going to land on 32, but at the last minute decided to gain some altitude and land towards the south.

Most internet tracking is filtered over Groom Lake these days, though this one slipped through the filter. Usually when they switch from commercial callsign to military callsign, the tracking stops. I assume it is based on the squawk code, which is always of the form 033x for Groom Lake, which X is any digit. I don't recall codes higher than say 0334 since they normally don't control more than 4 Janets in military airspace at one time.