In Christianity, Why is Satan Evil, and God Good? What is Evil?

There is no good without evil. A human cannot know good without evil.
So, are you saying that GOD is evil? Just think what kind of world it would be if no one ever suffered or died while still multiplying. A bit crowded don't you think? All death and suffering must be random in nature. Again, what would it be like if we all knew that only the evil or the old suffered and died and that all the rest of us were immune? Do you really not see this? It's called population control and He designed it to be 100% random, as it should be.

No one gives GOD the respect He deserves for this amazing existence.


[edit on 21-10-2009 by sickofitall2012]

reply to post by CHA0S


I think the Bible is the perfect book for us to learn how to discern natures.....to be able to 'know a vine from its seed'.

I dont think God ever left a book for us. I dont think Satan ever left a book for us. I think many men have searched for what God is and what the oppostie of God would be, and we have BOTH natures in the Bible as result.

There is great history in the book. There is assumptions made though as to God being responsible for certain things and then an Adversary being responsible for certain things. Do we take the words as written, and rewritten, from the carnal men, from the scribes, from the powers...as they have been passed down....as being a perfect fact of truth?? Wow...that is a wide road to bank one's soul on.

When one looks deeper, it is a perfect book. It offers all the empathetic vibes of both doing for others and doing for self....for us to discern what we need to be and what we are. The largest problem with the Bible is that people are told they have to read it a certain way.

The Bible offer's Earthly Natures and Spiritual Natures.....it is the person that must discern with their own reasoning what is what....leading them to be a certain nature themselves.

[edit on 21-10-2009 by LeoVirgo]

Originally posted by CHA0S
Through careful study of texts in the bible, or at least major one’s (and one‘s often told to children at Sunday school), you can see a definite trend to people claiming God is good, Satan is Evil, but why is that?

In Moses and the Red Sea the Pharaoh (in Exodus) had Moses and “his people” as slaves. God told Moses to go to Pharaoh to request for Moses’ people to be set free. The Pharaoh refused of course and thus God was angered. He sent a set of punishments to the Pharaoh because of this. Among one of the punishments he gave the Pharaoh was that every first born Egyptian child dies. This of course punishes the innocent too does it not, killing countless children for what someone else did. However, this is often told to kids in Sunday school as God doing good work. How is him killing a bunch of innocents good?

Noah’s Ark, another famous story told to children, in which God washes away the mistakes of the world by having it rain for days. Of course the story goes that Noah was told by god to make an Ark and that when it was made 2 of every animal boarded (This is not based on whether this is plausible to do such a thing so please do not bring it up) and the world was then flooded. Of course apart from the 2 of every animal on the Ark would have drowned and those that were left, they would have returned to a home which was greatly damaged by all the gushing water of the flood, and some wouldn’t have been able to have survived in the new environment and died anyway. (Once again, please don’t get into the fact that they’d have to inbreed and that at one point the bible counted this as ok but God changed his mind, this is not part of this) Our point here, is how is killing 99%+ of animals and humans good?

However, I haven’t heard much of Satan going out and mass murdering innocents or killing 99%+ of the animals, and yet God has, and God is considered all good, correct?

It has been written that “Thou Shalt Not Kill”, as one of the commandments, but at points the bible states that "If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them" (Leviticus 20:13) (I’m not getting into the point that technically it says nothing about female homosexuals exactly and thus God is a sexual bigot) as well as other parts inciting killing, or murdering someone, for what they’ve done wrong in God’s eyes. Yet I’ve never heard of Satan saying that someone should die, just because of who that person falls in love with and has sexual relations with. No offence but isn’t saying someone should die because of who they love?

Talking about killing in God’s name, many years ago I believe Christians burnt many people alive, claiming they were practising magic. However, in Jesus’ case, who supposedly performed miracles like turning water into wine, healing the wounded miraculously and so on and so forth, and yet he himself is considered good and blessed and somewhat idolized and worshipped. Why is this? Just cause of who his father was?

Based on what the bible says you should not think for yourself and to blindly obey, is that not the thinking of a slave driver, to have you do their bidding unquestioningly and not thinking for yourself? By the way, I am referring to; Proverbs 3:5 “Trust in the lord with all your heart; and lean not unto your own understanding.” Is being a slave driver then counted as good? Or only if you are God? Why does God get away with the very acts he himself supposedly has punished?

I’ve also read about a man named Job’s. Supposedly Satan challenged God to prove that he has followers who would believe unquestioningly, even without all he has. God agreed and had most, if not all, of Jobs animals were killed or stolen, had his servants slaughtered, killed his children in a storm and had him fall ill, and as Job stilled turned to God, Satan was wrong… but in this case can you really attribute it to LOVE OF GOD. He believed God had just killed a bunch of his stuff and done all this horrible stuff to him, he could be fearing God that much that he felt that he had to appease him. He’d already lost his family, and his livelihood. And whose hand played this foul trick? God. He agreed to having Job lose everything, and he would thus as much be to blame as Satan, would he not? He ruined someone’s life out of pride. Why did he need to prove this point to anyone, especially Satan? (Look in the bible under; Job) [I have read the ending too where God BLESSES Job, but what about the kids of Job’s who died out of God’s arrogance?] Where is the goodness there?

It is stated that God’s only agreement to the use of blood is as a worship sacrifice to atone for sins (Leviticus 17:11) and thus blood transfusions are against the teachings of God, meaning that if you NEED a blood transfusion, God would rather have you die. As one’s blood is only meant to be used for worship. So, God telling you to choose death instead of life is good too then I presume?

I must ask now, what has Satan done wrong to be labelled as evil?


// This has been a joint effort by CHA0S and Neo-Dark //

First off these laws are for people, God does not have to stand by them, we only do so we don't wipe each other out and his overal plan for the earth.

If God wants to kill you he can, he does not have to abide to the 10 commandments, God does not need say believe in God to himself.

Most of what you said are before the 10 commandments, God has a relationship with mankind or his chosen to do his work, if someone or something gets in the way then he will have to punish or do something about it.

Noah's ark was because Angels mixed genes with creation and mankind and giants were born, Nephilim which currupted human DNA and other animals which was illegal and still is. They were again spawned in the southern Israel region before Moses overcame them.

As for the Pharaoh, he was standing in the way of God's plan for saving mankind, like many others have that have perished because of it.
If God killed the Egyptians children then it was for two things, to stop the next generation from doing it again and to send a message only they would undertand. They tried to stop the coming of the overal plan which was Christ his Son and many times that had occured.

The Devil won't tell you how many times he tried to do that, at least God says what he does.

(Leviticus 20:13) Again it was tribal law for that generation, they had to be like Priests like how a priest has his own standards. As man became aquanted and made new covenants with God the laws become less strict, hence why in the New Testament it is leaniant and Christ died for us.

Man was more perfect in those times, we had a set standard built in us, but slowly that eroded and the knowlede of sin currupted us, but God chose a few important people who were to carry the purest line of Adam and make compromises with him.

Each event was unique, you can not apply the same themes of the past with now and then or in between. But if God want's to send his final judgements it is because man will try and stop his plan, mankind will once again try and stop the Jewish promise God has with them, they will even try and stop God, that means God and his Angels will fight back, call it Armageddon, Gog and Magog and the Apocalypse, it will be happen because man and the fallen ones want to stop his plans which are for the greater good. He created earth and yet we want to destroy it, he won't allow it.

As for blood transfusions, did not Jesus say this is my blood and this is my body, so eat.

It does not say anything about transfusions, it was for people drinking animal blood not human blood, since when did they use human blood? Also it was medically bad for them and it is proven to be and could prove a decline in their populations.

It sounds like someone or something is making out to you Satan is Good or something, if so why did he try and tempt Jesus out of his fate? How many times has he and his Godless faithless armies tried to kill off the Adam pure bloodlines so Jesus could never be born. How many times today in the news have they wanted to destroy Israel and stop the final days of Satan's doom. One sign of the end of the Age is when Israel is a nation again and they have Enemies in the Middle East. The Devil does not have a book about what he has done right, well there might be one book that looks suspicious it could be inspired by him, that is another story.

Are you sure you are not listening to Johavah Witnesses, the witnesses who refuse to witness the testamony of Christ?
[edit on 21-10-2009 by The time lord]

[edit on 21-10-2009 by The time lord]

reply to post by CHA0S


reply to post by CHA0S


Your confusion is because evil means something different in the Bible than what we call evil today. In the Bible sin and evil, is simply to disobey God.

He's the creator, he can destroy it and can recreate it if he wants. Take it to Heaven or do whatever he wants with it. The earth, an animal, you, me.

If he tells you to do something and you don't, that's evil. Doesn't matter what you did or didn't do. All that matters is if you obeyed the command. If he tells you to kill someone and you don't, that's evil. If he tells you not to kill someone and you do, that's still evil.

It's not the act that's important. What's important is what the Bible told you to do. Doesn't mean the same thing as what we think of evil today.

Also, try to remember religious people believe in an afterlife. Try not to mix the atheist's views of eternal death into the equation. You'll confuse yourself. When Jesus died for our sins, he died for all past sin as well. Anybody that died before Jesus came in the OT would have basically went right to Heaven where they'd most likely rather be and if not that's where they were gonna end up anyway.

Try to remember that religious people don't want to be stuck here. We believe in eternal life. When it is our time we believe we're going someplace better. This death thing that you speak of we do not believe in.

Maybe you should examine your own beliefs if you think death is unfair and that's it wrong for people to die. In my religion we don't believe in death. Remember, when talking about the Bible, just remove the thought of death completely from your mind. Doesn't exist in our system.

OF course, you might not believe in Heaven. That's fine, but if Heaven ain't real then neither is God and if he ain't real he sure didn't kill anybody did he?

So you got to pick one belief system or the other. You can't mix them just to make God look bad. Believers will see right through the trick as soon as you say the word death because we don't believe in death.

Which system you believe though, I leave up to you. I'm not saying you have to believe in him, I'm just saying don't mix the two belief systems of Christianity or Judaism along with the Atheist's belief of eternal death because the two systems don't go together like that. You'll just confuse yourself.

Satan can be described as evil because he doesn't do what God says. That's all you need to know. Doesn't matter what he does. It's as simple as that.

reply to post by atlasastro


What if it was anyone else committing the murder? Why, when God does it, is it automatically perceived as good, not evil? I don't care what his excuse was...he's almighty and powerful...there is no need to wipe out 99%+ of humans and animals...I'm sure he could have came up with a better way of going about things...it's just plain evil however you look at it...I couldn't give a rats $@# if it was God...big freakin deal...he still has no right...

reply to post by sickofitall2012

So, are you saying that GOD is evil? Just think what kind of world it would be if no one ever suffered or died while still multiplying.

Uhhh...what does suffering have to do with dying? Who says dying is even a bad thing at all...I look forward to it...it's when the real fun begins my friend...

reply to post by CHA0S


You are right....just because 'God' has the power to do something....does not mean we should be fooled in thinking Thee does.

Always discern.....what is Holy and what is not. In an ultimate way, all things are allowed and serve a purpose, but its man leading these ways and its men that will learn from them....God is the by stander sustaining us, with love and only love.

Before man could explain why storms happened, why the Earth shook, why there was drought in certain lands....it was easy to blame a 'good' and 'bad' power for such things.

We are evolving away from this. We are using our past to learn from our past selves, about our present selves, for a future selves. Its all good....IMPO. We will use the past, for our present, to form a future.

I think you should read my post and stop arguing also read the post below it it makes sense.

reply to post by tinfoilman


Just a fast note on something you said about 'religious people wanting to leave here...wanting to gain eternal life'.

All I can say friend, will you be surprised when you find out that an atheist with a good heart is receiving rest beside you one day?

This goes back to the idea that God is expecting all of us to just 'believe' in something we cant see, shackling our minds from logic and reasoning which is a part of our makeup.

Your most inner nature will be weighed, the sooner you begin to find the light in the darkest of people, the sooner you will have your rest. God is not waiting on all people to 'believe'.....but yet to find their inner nature and be right, do right, because it is the purest form of their highest self....they dont have to know this higher self, pure self -is God. They just need to react to this knowing that its better to live for others then your self, its better to live humbly instead of prideful, its better to give then to take....

There are many others (well everyone eventually) that will have their rest...and they dont even have to 'believe'.

Originally posted by CHA0S
reply to post by atlasastro

 

What if it was anyone else committing the murder?

In what context. In the bible or in general?

Why, when God does it, is it automatically perceived as good, not evil?

It is not automatically perceived as Good. You don't perceive it as Good do You. Other perceive it as Good by choosing to, by being indoctrinated or by basing the way they perceive good and evil by the dichotomy of God equaling good and the Devil equaling Evil.

I don't care what his excuse was...he's almighty and powerful...there is no need to wipe out 99%+ of humans and animals

Are you now accepting the Bible as being literal in the parts that support your criticisms and questions?
What 99%+ of humans and animals are you talking about?

...I'm sure he could have came up with a better way of going about things

Really? Are you saying that you understand the rationale of "god" yet wonder why God is deemed Good and the Devil evil!

...it's just plain evil however you look at it...I couldn't give a rats $@# if it was God...big freakin deal...he still has no right...

Listen to yourself. "It is just plain evil". Which reference or definition of "Evil" are you using, and why is your definition of evil defined as such.
As you are discussing the bible, we need to use the dichotomy of the Bible in relation to Good and Evil of God. God in the Bible is Good. You asked Why. I discussed why.

Someone sounds like they need a Rant T/O from "bible bashing".

reply to post by CHA0S


God committing mass murder has nothing to do with suffering or death? That was your point, no? You said that He is evil and Satan wasn't because God killed. Your response only tells me that you really don't understand. I will agree, death is just the beginning, but for some will not be fun, I guarantee you that, and no I am not referring to hell.

reply to post by tinfoilman

He's the creator, he can destroy it and can recreate it if he wants. Take it to Heaven or do whatever he wants with it. The earth, an animal, you, me.

If he tells you to do something and you don't, that's evil. Doesn't matter what you did or didn't do. All that matters is if you obeyed the command. If he tells you to kill someone and you don't, that's evil. If he tells you not to kill someone and you do, that's still evil.

I can't help but feel sorry for you...if you can believe it's not evil to kill a little girl because God told you to...you need to wake up...refer to a post I made on the first page to see what I think about God being able to take our life, because he gave it...

Try not to mix the atheist's views of eternal death into the equation

I am Atheist, well agnostic really, but I believe in an after life...but murder is still murder...sadness still comes from death...whatever happens...we only get a short time here on this physical plane...I believe after that, we can't come back...make the most of it...

[edit on 21/10/09 by CHA0S]

reply to post by CHA0S


Well you're free to think he's evil all you want.

Just know that I was answering your question. The reason God is good and the Satan is evil is because evil meant to disobey God and good meant whatever God did.

Now when people say evil, they mean anything they disagree with. So, it has a different meaning today. Anything you don't like or understand is evil. Yes, we know.

But I don't really give a crap if you think it's evil or not. I was trying to explain how the word has taken on a different meaning.

Anyway Jesus says not to kill anyone. So, we should still be good there when it comes to killing little girls.

reply to post by LeoVirgo


If God wants to let the atheists in then he can let the atheist in. It's his house. Not mine. He's welcome to let whoever he wants in.

reply to post by sickofitall2012


I don't say killing someone = evil.

However, many people would claim Hitler is evil for commiting mass genocide, the same as what God has supposedly done, but Hitler gets bad mouthed, God gets a book praising him.

Where in that logic lies good and evil?

Perception? Perception of a school of christians worshipping a mass murderer whilst being taught about the "evil" mass murderers of the world

reply to post by The time lord


So, one set of rules per person is ok... or if you're told to do something by that special "exception"...

Noah's ark was because Angels mixed genes with creation and mankind and giants were born, Nephilim which currupted human DNA and other animals which was illegal and still is. They were again spawned in the southern Israel region before Moses overcame them.

So God messed up, and wanted to kill everything... ok... seems fair... ABORTION IS NOW OK Y'ALL... no offense but that's what you're saying, God created the Angels and in effect the giants and since he felt he messed up he wanted to fix it up by killing what he in turn created.

If God killed the Egyptians children then it was for two things, to stop the next generation from doing it again and to send a message only they would undertand.

And, what had the children done to deserve to die? Had they... enslaved people?!? Why didn't the pharaohs just start dying, until the slaves were freed?!?

He created earth and yet we want to destroy it, he won't allow it.

God created us and now wants to kill us in various ways, should we not allow him. (Take up your arms, we're bringing down a God)

As for blood transfusions, did not Jesus say this is my blood and this is my body, so eat.

So Jesus was there to tempt people to sin... great.

The Devil does not have a book about what he has done right, well there might be one book that looks suspicious it could be inspired by him, that is another story.

And the bible doesn't quite say what he's done WRONG... Which is what this is about.

reply to post by atlasastro


I was referring to Noah's ark...how he killed 99%+ of the population because apparently there were a few demon things running around...if he has the power to do that...why not just devise a way to kill those things, and leave the innocent people be? I know what's right and wrong deep down in my soul...I can feel it...and I know, if that story is true...God's evil...it's that simple...

reply to post by tinfoilman


What you are missing is the understanding.

Sure who are we to say what God allows....but are you saying that we are not to understand what is right or wrong? Our past gives us natures...Earthly ways and Spiritual ways. The only thing that we are to do is discern these two things....how long will it take, is up to us.

Are you wiling to accept a Earthly nature just because someone told you it is God?

Originally posted by tinfoilman
So you got to pick one belief system or the other. You can't mix them just to make God look bad. Believers will see right through the trick as soon as you say the word death because we don't believe in death.

Then let's just say God, since the other people weren't believers, unjustifiably damned them to hell. Sounds good...

reply to post by Neo-Dark


Trolls that don't read the whole post, like the parts where it explains anybody that died before Jesus came automatically go to Heaven, just aren't fun. I mean, if you're gonna troll do it right and real the whole thing.

reply to post by CHA0S


Dont forget about the flood that the creatures that 'god' intended to destroy was 'still on the Earth' in those days 'after' the flood.

I say ???what???