Insurers Dropping Chinese Drywall Policies

reply to post by Taikonaut

Thanks for your comments.

That seems to be one reason why the home owners' insurers are passing on this problem. Now we have to see what the builders' or architects' liability insurers are going to do.

I don't know if there is a Federal law in the US that would cover this or if it will have to proceed state by state. However it's safe to assume that it'll take years in any case.

[edit on 18/10/09 by JustMike]

Originally posted by Lichter daraus
To me it all boils down to greed, but it might not be. Ill come up with more as i ponder this.
Deep down i think I'm a bit of a conspiracy theorist...

You know, there’s an excellent website for people who are conspiracy theorists…

Yep, that's why I'm here.

Well looks like a lot of others came in with some good explanations. I couldn't come up with anything else, i have inattentive-adhd and my mind was racing all night couldn't think very clearly at all, And not to mention i was bouncing of the walls(ran outta meds, oops)

reply to post by Lichter daraus

Hey, you're doing great so don't worry. I understand the problem as I also need meds every day (but for a pretty boring neurological problem). If I miss them I don't feel at all well.

It was your earlier comments that really got me thinking along "conspiracy" lines and led me to find that info about the cover-up.

This toxic Chinese waste drywall problem is likely to get worse before it gets better, but at least now more and more people are finding out about it.





[edit on 18/10/09 by JustMike]

Originally posted by JustMike
reply to post by Lichter daraus

 

Hey, you're doing great so don't worry. I understand the problem as I also need meds every day (but for a pretty boring neurological problem). If I miss them I don't feel at all well.

It was your earlier comments that really got me thinking along "conspiracy" lines and led me to find that info about the cover-up.

This toxic Chinese waste drywall problem is likely to get worse before it gets better, but at least now more and more people are finding out about it.





[edit on 18/10/09 by JustMike]

I hear ya on the boring neurological stuff, i got that too.


Anyway, yeah I'm sure it is gonna get hella bad. I just don't understand how or why the insurance companies wont do anything about it.

The construction industry probably has more scammers and schemers than any industry other than law. That being said, I'd have to say I feel that some of the culpability lies with the US government for continually allowing products to come in from China that are obviously dangerous without any sort of testing what so ever.

Every few months it's something else, lead painted toys, poisonous cat food, now deadly walls. It is quite obvious to anyone who has even read a paragraph on modern China that the government there cares little for product safety or for the well being of their people.

People like to complain that when we made stuff here in America it was too expensive and not as good as some foreign stuff. Well, when we made things here we had jobs, we had money that went back into our economy and we had someone to go after if they did produce a seriously defective product.

Look at it this way, you can buy a steak that can cost you over $100 and it'll probably be really good. On the other hand, you could buy two $50 steaks that might not be as good but are cheaper. You could also buy four $25 steaks, ten $10 steaks, twenty $5 steaks etc. My point is that eventually you're probably buying rotten, poisonous steaks that you can't even serve to prisoners.

People begin to realize that these steaks may be cheap but they're nasty and a few people have died. This not only hurts your company but the entire steak industry as people no longer trust steaks.

What I'm trying to say it that, due to this endless quest for less and less overhead, we've gotten to the point where no one can really trust that a given product is safe or that it even does what it's supposed to. That goes doubly so for products from places like China, were safety isn't even a remote concern in certain industries.

I don't understand why we put our safety in the hands of a country who thinks it's cheaper to just let coal miners die, en mass, in a mine explosion than to take even the slightest of safety precautions.

Is completely removing the drywall and replacing it the only way to fix the problem? Has anyone actually done that yet? If your entire house was made with it, that would be a TOTAL NIGHTMARE! I don't think it could be done with you and your family living in it.

You would probably have to move your family and your stuff out while the work is being done. A crew would come in and tear out ALL the drywall in the house and then re-hang, mud, tape texture, re-trim and re-paint the entire interior. That would cost a fortune! The builder and the insurance company will definitely weasel out of footing that bill!

The people who bought these homes are quite screwed...

Originally posted by JustMike
reply to post by endisnighe

That is, if the insurers or a liable party can be made to pay anything at all.

I do know that home owners are being warned not attempt to remedy the problem themselves before they have had an inspection done so that evidence can be obtained (for future legal action/claims). Also, home owners who are not experts in construction might only replace the drywall and then find that the corrosion of pipes and wiring continues -- along with their health problems -- because the gases released have contaminated other materials in the home. In fact, this is already reported.

My home being one that was built in 1967, if I suspected that this contaminated drywall was used in a subsequent alteration, then to be honest, I think I would attempt to remedy the problem myself.

The reason being, I would not want my insurance company to know anything about it being in my home to begin with (in case they were to use it against any subsequent claims I might have). In fact, I think that a lot of people will not report it for this reason, thus the problem will be greatly under-reported.

Originally posted by kardenal

You would probably have to move your family and your stuff out while the work is being done. A crew would come in and tear out ALL the drywall in the house and then re-hang, mud, tape texture, re-trim and re-paint the entire interior. That would cost a fortune! The builder and the insurance company will definitely weasel out of footing that bill!

The people who bought these homes are quite screwed...

Yes they are.

Not only would you have to replace the drywall itself but all electrical, plumbing, etc.. in the house.

Quite screwed... for sure!

reply to post by Iamonlyhuman


So you basically have to GUT the interior and start over?! The vast majority of folks obviously won't be able to afford to do that. So the remaining options would be:

1. Continue living in the home and pretend the problem doesn't exist.
2. Try to sell the home. Good luck with that.
3. Try to rent out the home. Again, good luck.
4. Abandon the home.

Wow...

reply to post by Taikonaut


No! You are wrong! The Architect will specify a product, or equivalent. It is the CONTRACTOR who stands to reap a huge profit on the use of cheaper materials. The ARCHITECT is paid the same regardless of how much the building costs to erect.

reply to post by kardenal

Thank you to everyone who has commented. Some have answered others' queries or statements very effectively already, but I'd like like to add a comment on the matter of how to "remedy" the problem if the home was all done inside with drywall.

We had some expert opinion from "endisnighe" a page back. He said that yes, the whole house would need to be gutted -- plus there would be the need to remove anything else that's damaged or contaminated (like wiring and plumbing, air-conditioning and so on).

As he pointed out, it will be very hard to find companies that are willing to take on this work unless their own liability insurers will keep them covered.

That is looking doubtful.

It will be virtually impossible to sell or rent out a home in the affected areas unless the owner can give a guarantee that the building does not contain any toxic Chinese drywall. ("TCD") The problem is that some owners will try to cover up or not disclose the presence of TCD for fear of losing their own insurance or even having the value of their property shot to ribbons.

This quarter-million tons of imported TCD is a much more complex and damaging problem than it first seems -- especially as an official report (cited earlier) says that as of June this year it was still in use -- so I thank everyone who's taken note and I hope that you'll contact people you know who might potentially be affected.

Mike



[edit on 18/10/09 by JustMike]

reply to post by Iamonlyhuman

From what you've said earlier I guess there's a fair chance you'd know what you're doing, so if you had this stuff in your home you could remedy the problem yourself. And I can understand why you'd want to keep quiet about it. People claim on their insurance, they get their claims denied and then their policies are canceled!

Great state of affairs.

So yeah, I think you're dead right on this. Lots of people won't report it, and would even be wary of going to the local Dr and reporting their health symptoms. But what a heck of a bind! If someone gets sick and wants to perhaps claim damages in the future, they need some kind of evidence that the drywall was the problem. But if they mention the drywall even in passing, but don't inform their insurance company, then their insurance can be void in the event of any future claim!

Originally posted by Shadowflux
...Every few months it's something else, lead painted toys, poisonous cat food, now deadly walls. It is quite obvious to anyone who has even read a paragraph on modern China that the government there cares little for product safety or for the well being of their people.

...What I'm trying to say it that, due to this endless quest for less and less overhead, we've gotten to the point where no one can really trust that a given product is safe or that it even does what it's supposed to. That goes doubly so for products from places like China, were safety isn't even a remote concern in certain industries.

I don't understand why we put our safety in the hands of a country who thinks it's cheaper to just let coal miners die, en mass, in a mine explosion than to take even the slightest of safety precautions.

All of your post was valid (starred ) but I'd like to comment especially on what I've quoted above.

All I can say is you are so very right. If they don't seem to care too much about their own workers, how can we expect them to give a rodent's rear end for us who import their products by the shipload?

Tell you something: I had some workers here at home the other day, fitting new windows in the whole place. (Not ones made in China, either!) One of them was interested in an old-style pedal car I have stored on top of a wardrobe. I told him I build them myself, just for a hobby. Made them for my wife's grandsons. All steel, and they'll support the weight of an adult no problem. He said his sister bought a plastic-bodied ride-on tractor for her little daughter. Sure, it looked great but it basically fell apart in a few weeks. They can't claim a refund or even repairs because the shop says it was "used beyond its designed limits". Yep, demolished by a four-year-old girl...

Guess where it was made? Yep. Toxic Product Land, aka China.

So he's asked me to build a car for his little boy. He knows it'll cost a bit more but it'll last for 20 years, easy.

Whatever happened to building things so that they'll last?

Gee I'm ranting now! But just to finish, my wife has a "Singer" sewing machine, the old treadle type. It was made in New York in about 1920 and it was passed down to her from her grandmother and mother. It works perfectly and has never needed any repairs. Not even a new drive belt. (We still have the spare they supplied with it nearly 90 years ago!) And she uses it every week.

That's what we need to see these days. If people can make stuff that is good and does the job well, I think there are plenty of people who'll buy it. Okay, so a house of good-quality drywall will cost more, but at least it won't need to be ripped out and replaced.

Maybe a lot of businesses need to re-learn the lesson.

EDIT: I just checked with my wife and I goofed. Her Singer is from around 1910 -- and the drive belt finally broke last year so she replaced it with the spare. But that belt lasted for around 100 years so I guess we can't complain. In those days when they said "lifetime guarantee" they were not kidding!

[edit on 18/10/09 by JustMike]

Don't buy anything from China. I avoid their products like the plague.

Just imagine the poisons we have not discovered yet.

reply to post by Grumble


That's tough to do seeing as most crap comes from china.

@ Grumble and Lichtus -- this is the hole we've been put into by "big business". (And the banks that finance them.) It's just incredible how much is made in China. True, some of it is okay but the stuff that isn't is like a plague.

I'm sure there are plenty of toxic or dangerous products that have gone all over the world that are yet to be discovered or at least revealed to us "consumers". (I hate that word! )

Originally posted by JustMike
@ Grumble and Lichtus -- this is the hole we've been put into by "big business". (And the banks that finance them.) It's just incredible how much is made in China. True, some of it is okay but the stuff that isn't is like a plague.

I'm sure there are plenty of toxic or dangerous products that have gone all over the world that are yet to be discovered or at least revealed to us "consumers". (I hate that word!

)

Yep, my step-father works for a large corporation, and he does most of his work in china.

I buy local, local, local. It takes commitment and time, and a willingness to say no to some things you really want. And sometimes you have no choice, but I am surprised how much I find is available.

The internet is your friend. There is much to find if you take the time to look.

reply to post by Grumble

I also do my best to buy local -- though here where I am the choices are less limited. But for example when we needed a new fridge, we bought one made here. Not the cheapest, but at least we know they'll fix it if there's a problem -- and it puts some money into the pockets of workers here where we live!

Hello Justmike,

Very good thread.

I know when I buy a home I take the structure as safe because I have depended on the Home Inspectors expertise and when I am given Home Owners Insurance I just have always assumed things were okay or they would not insure it in the first place.

I believe our government isn't doing there job inspecting products coming in country.

Isn't it funny we send out all the good stuff and they send us poison/harmful products.

China doesn't have to be a super power and destroy us with weapons and war they just kill us off with there products.

I went to Walmarts and I had to buy socks for the kids, I'm raising five grandkids. I was shocked to see that not only socks but just about everything is made in China and many other countries that produce cheap products. I remember long ago when you bought something stamped on the bottom that said made in China you thought it was okay..... but was it really?

As I said I had to look hard to find socks made in America but when I did find them I paid the higher price it was well worth it.

I now always look and buy American it's worth the extra money.

What is upsetting is when dealing with buying certain things we don't know where the products came from such as in houses and if our government allowes this stuff in and it is inspected then there are problems then they should be held accountable to repair it.

We know that will never happen.

Check the products you buy and try to buy American whenever you can. Sadly it seems that Americans are getting totally screwed and our government is still allowing it.