"Free Polanski" = Liberals gone crazy

Originally posted by Freeborn
He deserves to be punished.

Pretty simple really.

Everything else is merely smoke in mirrors.

So how do you justify this simple punishment of him when it also punishes the victim and her family? She gets victimized again and her kids and husband get to enjoy it to. Is that what she deserves for getting raped?

Once again huh? Please explain what you mean by the quote:

Originally posted by Lillydale
and no accounting for justice for the victim.

Thanks for ignoring all the rest of my post, I feel so unworthy........... not that you would insult someone, ya know.

Very nice.

Originally posted by pavil


Once again huh? Please explain what you mean by the quote:

Originally posted by Lillydale
and no accounting for justice for the victim.

Thanks for ignoring all the rest of my post, I feel so unworthy........... not that you would insult someone, ya know.

Very nice.

OK, let me see if the tenth time is a charm.

The victim has had 30 years to run away from this and keep her family from having to deal with it. Now, regardless of her wishes, she has to appear at his dismissal hearing and the press is all over her and her family. Where exactly is this justice for the victim that you are talking about?

reply to post by Lillydale


You haven't had a close family memeber who has been abused like that, have you? They don't "run away" from it or block it out, it is always there for them to be haunted by. You have it all backwards IMO. So now the punishment of the perpatrator of the crime is somehow more hurtful than the rape he inflicted on the then 13 year old girl? Wow. Better to let him get away with it, right?

The victim's lot in these kind of events is never a pleasant one, but not punishing Polanski for this is the worse scenario. I understand it's not a pleasant ordeal for her, but it's all Polanski's fault for being a creep and a coward. He hasn't paid the price for his actions.

Originally posted by pavil
reply to post by Lillydale

 

You haven't had a close family memeber who has been abused like that, have you? They don't "run away" from it or block it out, it is always there for them to be haunted by.

Do not dare to pretend to know about me or my life. All you can do is assume and based on so little. Of course it always stays with her but not rubbbed in her face all over TV and papers and magazines. Her children have not had to live with it until now either.

You have it all backwards IMO. So now the punishment of the perpatrator of the crime is somehow more hurtful than the rape he inflicted on the then 13 year old girl? Wow. Better to let him get away with it, right?

Yes the punishment of the perpetrator is greater now because that is what the victim feels. Why do you presume to know better than this woman what is justice for her? You just want justice for you.

The victim's lot in these kind of events is never a pleasant one, but not punishing Polanski for this is the worse scenario. I understand it's not a pleasant ordeal for her, but it's all Polanski's fault for being a creep and a coward. He hasn't paid the price for his actions.

Exactly, it is all his fault, and her mother's, and apparently hers for lying about her age as well but anyway. All his fault and here she has to suffer again because of his actions and to you, that is justice? Are you willing to call her and explain it to her? I offered to get anyone in touch with her that is willing to explain to her why she and her family must suffer so that people like you can feel better about themselves.

People who have been programmed/indoctrinated to be either left-wing or right-wing are severly reality impaired. In this particular thread the results of left-wing-programming are painfully obvious and even shocking to the few citizens left who still have some sanity.

In this thread we have heard how

"it was not actually rape"
"it was consensual"
"arresting Polanski is not good for the victim"
"Punishing the child-rapist = Punishing the victim"
"it is shocking that Polanski was arrested"
"whether child abuse is bad is a matter of opinion"

and other psychopathic voicings.

_______________________________________________

Apart from that there were many wishy-washy "its not about left/right" statements.

Such statements obviously derive from the understanding that left/right is an artificial dichotomy that has no basis in reality. However, billions of people still define themselves as either left or right, and for them it is a reality. And they are programmed to think in certain ways. And this programming can lead to stuff like championing a child-rapist as a hero (left-wing) or championing islamic jihad (those are extreme right-wingers) as a path to peace.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by Skyfloating]

I almost don't want to watch another movie again and support these selfless people. Protecting your own has to end somewhere. I mean really, where do you draw the line?

reply to post by Lillydale


I agree with your premise that the system and most who work in it don't really care about the victims. Just the same as the people commenting here that believe it's more important to punish the perp than healing the victim even if that means hurting the victim more. That's why allot of rapes are probably not reported, because often having to deal with the courts and the police is more traumatizing than the actual event or at least it's just pro-longing the pain. Yes, women are stoned in some countries for being raped, but we don't seem to be much better here except we do put the perps in jail.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by verylowfrequency]

There's no such thing as right wing or left wing.

They are both one and the same.

As long as the world is in the hands of single-narrow path minded people, then acceleration of our consciousness is not possible.

You can't paddle against the stream, and soon we will all realize the truth, which is that we are all One in this Infinite.

For pity's sake, how simple is it.

He drugged her, her raped her, including anally.

He pleaded guilty then fled the US before sentencing.

Why should he escape punishment?

The only people who support this evil scumbag paedophile are arty farty, intellectual elitists who have an over inflated opinion of their own self importance or PC driven do-gooders.

A message has to sent out to everyone that no-one is above the law when it comes to sex crimes and paedophilia.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
People who have been programmed/indoctrinated to be either left-wing or right-wing are severly reality impaired. In this particular thread the results of left-wing-programming are painfully obvious and even shocking to the few citizens left who still have some sanity.

In this thread we have heard how

"it was not actually rape"
"it was consensual"
"arresting Polanski is not good for the victim"
"Punishing the child-rapist = Punishing the victim"
"it is shocking that Polanski was arrested"
"whether child abuse is bad is a matter of opinion"

and other psychopathic voicings.

_______________________________________________

Apart from that there were many wishy-washy "its not about left/right" statements.

Such statements obviously derive from the understanding that left/right is an artificial dichotomy that has no basis in reality. However, billions of people still define themselves as either left or right, and for them it is a reality. And they are programmed to think in certain ways. And this programming can lead to stuff like championing a child-rapist as a hero (left-wing)or championing islamic jihad (those are extreme right-wingers) as a path to peace.
[edit on 1-10-2009 by Skyfloating]

On the other side of the coin we have heard…

He should be executed

He should be executed in an incredibly cruel and painful manner

He should be taken outside into the public and be beaten bloody by an angry mob

No extenuating circumstances should ever be taken into account when such a crime occurs

All rapists should be executed (despite the fact many are exonerated with DNA testing)

…Your over simplification in a questionable attempt to play moral authority and the supreme consciousness of a society by in essence condoning, encouraging, even rewarding people for not questioning and simply obeying and encouraging mindless and total compliance is a dangerous thing.

Usually you state your agenda up front Skyfloating when it comes to your threads which are always about events or elements introduced into society for the purpose of social engineering and bending thought, usually you insist on drawing an absolute conclusion as to the motive and purpose of the intent to do so.

My suspicions have now been confirmed as to why you would be so keen to encourage mindless and unthinking compliance with authority and no questioning of judgment rendered and no further review or thought to the circumstances, subtleties or facts, you have confirmed it yourself as I imagined you would by saving that seed for last….

or championing islamic jihad (those are extreme right-wingers) as a path to peace.

Your opinion of the human intellect is shockingly low my friend. Shockingly low indeed as is using such a case as this to champion your ultimate and primary cause. Had I not known where you were going I would have not endured the long tedious day of listening to the programmed closed minded circular logic drilled into people in such similar not always so subtle, yet equally nefarious and disingenuous ways which are not just an insult to the intelligence of the American people but a means to continually erode and degrade it.

Just so you know my friend, you aren’t fooling anyone of intellect and ultimately the strategy similar thinking people pursue towards the erosion and negation of intelligent thought and freewill will only serve to backfire on them when that mindless homogenous mass they have gone to such great lengths to stupefy, minimize and tyrannize turns on their tormentor in similar mindless union. This thread was never about Polanksi it was never about the left/right paradigm it was simply about further indoctrinating people to reacting without questioning through emotional manipulation. As a person of intellect, reason and compassion I find the notions you are putting forward to be repugnant and inherently dangerous and to be purposefully so friend.

Tricks are for kids and anyone who would attempt to trick a mass of human beings into abandoning rational and logical pursuits of questioning and examining facts and considering extenuating circumstances with compassion and wisdom is doing humanity no favor.

If Polanski a Holocaust survivor was the State of Israel the sworn enemy of the Jihadists, you would enslave a whole generation of the world to mindless stupidity to eliminate, you would justify his crimes on that simple fact alone and twist it to being justified based on the Holocaust alone.

Ultimately from a Justice standpoint unbeknownst to you your argument in fact favors the Jihadists who would like to eliminate that excuse for the crimes of the nation of Israel.

The subtle and blatant attempts to turn America into an unthinking conformist homogenous mass lacking any desire to question the most criminal entity on the planet (the State of Israel) and to simply always agree with the propagandized version of justice put forth by it and through it’s agents is a game that will ultimately backfire upon it friend.

This is not per me; this is per Rome, per Rome’s plan for implementing a one world government. The best way to ensure Israel’s survival is for fools to stop trying to see to it’s survival at any and all costs including but not limited too the mass brainwashing and stupefying of the American people.

Thanks for finally revealing your hand and true purpose in the thread, now is when you can tell me not to believe my lying eyes.

Thankfully I don’t believe some people’s manipulative words and actions!

Ultimately the truth can never be murdered in this fashion, and as I have cautioned others on this thread, blind and swift justice based on retribution and elimination is a two edged sword my friend. It can, will and does cut both ways.

Word from the wise!

Busted!



[edit on 1/10/09 by ProtoplasmicTraveler]

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler

The parents should be convicted also, if they set up their daughter to be raped.

Originally posted by Lillydale

Exactly, it is all his fault, and her mother's, and apparently hers for lying about her age as well but anyway.

So it's all his fault, except for the part that it's her fault and her mother's fault too?

Even if the girl was 19, what he did was still rape. I'm sorry, I guess I just don't get your viewpoint. Her age or her lying about it are immaterial to the act of him plying her with drugs and alcholol prior to raping her.

She was probably wearing a short dress too........she had it coming to her..........

This thread is a huge troll-bomb. The title is nothing but an attempt to discredit anyone left-leaning by using primitive demagoguery (not everyone trying to exonerate Polanski is left and vice versa). I have no idea why you guys are still banging on it.

Have you seen the movie "Monsoon Wedding?" A friend of mine, while watching it, commented that the family should not have been so harsh on the villain, and all of a sudden it dawned on me that I didn't know this person too well. Could he have raped anyone? Could he have sexually abused children? Could he have abused MY children. All these hollywood types, why are they supporting this guy? Maybe they don't think what he did was evil because they practice it themselves.

I submit that the extremes of either side - left or right are complete crack-pots.

Originally posted by ProtoplasmicTraveler
He should be executed in an incredibly cruel and painful manner

^ That would be me, i said that.

I always have, and always will feel that way, here's a quote from me in a thread i started in regards to the rape and murder of Jessica Lunsford, nearly 5 years ago, involving another one of your buddies you probably feel was just misunderstood, and mentally enlightened above the rest of us...

My feelings are that our current quick death penalty is not suitable for this crime or any like it. This monster should die slowly and extremely painfully as soon as he is determined guilty, and all others like him should be made well aware of it. Perhaps a slow Iraq style beheading with a dull knife would serve justice, and all others who prey on helpless children would face the same punishment. Perhaps that would deter these sick animals.
www.belowtopsecret.com...

The piece of s**t that raped and murdered that little girl, a convicted sex offender who was freed, and instead of seeking help, was emboldened to take the life of a child, died yesterday of cancer in a comfy hospital bed. Probably under hospice care, at all of our expense, 2 years after being sentenced to death...

He died two years after a Citrus County judge gave him the death penalty, following the recommendation of a Miami jury, which voted 10-2 in favor of death by lethal injection.

In the emotional sentencing, the judge recounted how Jessica, a third-grader from Homosassa, disappeared from her room in the middle of the night in February 2005. Couey, a sex offender living across the street, kidnapped and raped her, then buried her alive in a plastic garbage bag outside his home.

"This was a determined, albeit savage, murder," Circuit Judge Ric Howard said at the August 2007 hearing. "She was alive when he put her in the hole. She was alive when he began to shovel the dirt over her body. Her last thoughts ... cannot be fathomed."
www.tampabay.com...

Anybody feel that justice was served? I don't...only those who believe there's a hell can take any comfort that it might be served now. 2 years after he was convicted without ANY reasonable doubt and sentenced to death, he was still alive to die of natural causes on tons of pain meds. Sick.

I very much think that monsters who prey on children should face unimaginable pain before their deaths when proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

The universe, this world, and our very existence is about balance, IMO. I have ALOT of compassion for, and wish to protect those that cannot protect themselves and mean no harm to anybody else. And i very strongly love my family and true friends. But i HATE, in the strongest sense of the word, ANYBODY who takes pleasure in, and seeks out to harm the innocent.

Our current system, hoping to rehabilitate and give 2nd chances to demons that almost ALWAYS offend again, is a failed one. I believe that they need to live in fear, not fear of a possible lethal injection 15 years down the road when most of them wont live that long anyway, but fear of a death that nightmares are made of. I strongly believe that would only need to happen a couple times, and the numbers of children being preyed on afterward would drop significantly. I know the chomos here are going to say it wouldn't work like they always do, and that they can't "starve" themselves, but that's because at this point they rest comfy it won't happen (unless they happen to touch one my children, and i get to them before the police do).

Anyway, an interesting twist relating to the OP....

(CNN) -- While several high-profile actors and directors have rallied around Roman Polanski, not everyone in Hollywood believes he should be freed and forgiven.

*snip*

On Wednesday, the BBC reported that the French government had dropped its public support for the release of Polanski stating that the director "is neither above nor beneath the law."
www.cnn.com...

[edit on 1-10-2009 by 27jd]

reply to post by 27jd


My friend please don't take this personally but not for a million dollars would I argue these morals and suppositions with you.

In case you haven't figured it out by now because you are so unballanced with the emotion that infects and effects your argument my main purpose for participating continually in these banal and rather offensive and closed minded arguments you continually put forth like a broken record was simply to wait for SkyFloating to reveal the hand I suspected he would ultimately be revealing and was playing for the beginning.

Sooner or later he had to connect the dots for the emotionally wound up hordes he planted a seed of a manipulation for to take advantage of thier emotionally wound state to indoctrinate them and or reinforce an agenda he champions at the expense of so many things we all hold near and dear.

Free will, curiousity, free speech, and a genuine desire to self determine for ourselves that which each individual believes to be right for themselves.

You have zero chance of ever effecting the argument you put forth about rapists or even this particular case.

You might want to give that a rest friend, as my contention has been from the git go that emotionally charged thinking is detrimental to a person's own best interest.

Simply put if someone knows how to push your emotional buttons you can be manipulated to act in a manner that is not benificial to your own best interests.

That little warn sticker on your Avatar is proof positive of that, as you found it nearly impossible to even contain your emotions to stay within the Terms and Conditions of ATS you became so intent on making your own personal views universally accepted.

Some people would, and some people have been able to manipulate you to their own purposes because of that inability to seperate your emotions from not only your arguments but ultimately the course of action you choose to take.

To make that very simple for you to understand, the thread was never about Roman Polanski, the thread was never about a left is more inclined to think one way than the right disengenous supposition that was used to entitle the thread.

The thread was about teaching people it is wrong to question somethings which ultimately what Skyfloating is trying to teach you not to question is the desire most championed and favored by Islamist extremists to limit Israel's power, stature, and influence over other nations, including our own here in the United States as a path towards a wider and stable peace in the world.

You would have had to be suspicious by nature to pick up on that, familiar with his typical agenda to pick up on that, and have been on guard to not let people push your buttons and manipulate you through your emotions to pick up on that.

Any reasonable person already understands justice has been served many times over in this case, and all the thread was about is trying to convince people that a vague notion of society should be able to demand and recieve a precise absolute unquestioning compliance and submission via what authority stipulates always.

That desired state of compliance and thought is not being sought for the sake of the victim or this crime or the protection of our society but the protection of the nation of Israel to continually evade and violate every International standard of human rights, nuclear regulation, and adherence to the United Nations and other International bodies.

I have absolutely no interest what so ever in debating this issue with you and never, ever did, and absolutely no desire to entertain your thoughts on the issue that go well and beyond any standard ever set down in the penal code or even human decency.

I simply wanted to illustrate why Skyfloating would post this thread and incite people to unthinking emotional reactions for the sake of manipulating them and planting a political seed that has nothing to do with Roman Polanski, the victim, rape, the left wing, the right wing, or even Justice, or even the United States of America.

It is what it is, and you my friend have been played in so many ways as to be too numerous to mention.

You might want to start learning how to love instead of trying to teach people how to hate, because some very insincere and evil people would love to take advantage of your propensity to do that, and well that's not in your advantage.

Peace friend.

reply to post by ProtoplasmicTraveler


Well, I would like to hear how skyfloating comes back to what You said. From reading both his post, and Yours, again I'd like his rebuttal. The logic behind Yours is straight forward, and there was no need to resort into quantifying, or guilt by association as in skyfloating(no offense mate), but I would like to read a response.

I've stayed out of this thread, I do apologize, but I knew from the start what I thought, or felt was a "thought trap". However, I have been reading.

There are multiple arenas here with multiple lines of thought that haven't even begun to be explored. Modern People want to call themselves super advanced, in contrast I would call all of us for the most part super "retarded" in comparison to Our ancestors.

The point I am making is that modern day religions have roots in ancient lore. All the Abrahamic root religions at describe the time of "adulthood", or coming of age as being around the time of puberty. Jew, Christian, and Muslim alike....................... So from that stand point the argument of religious viewpoints is mute/void, and showing of an uneducated, ignorant Person, or of a Person with a decidedly crafted direction of thought; also of persuasion.

Now, also to be judgmental; by demanding absolute punishment is another. As Proto laid out, Our society is trained to react beyond PREJUDICE in regards to some People, and act in absolute acceptance of others. The simple aforementioned sentence is enough reason to reserve judgment of others without ABSOLUTE complete facts.

Had the thread not gone to ABSOLUTES based off of frivolous bull sheeeet, then I would have stayed out. Had it simply stayed in vague ideological debate, then fine, but it didn't. Now We have been given an ideological profile of who to hate, and why by skyfloating; Why?

Also, lets start discussing Our advanced modern civilization. You know shopping with my wife not to long ago; she showed me thong panties from a bin, and they couldn't have been for anyone taller, or with a larger frame than a child.......no older my wife thought than 5 to 6.........Thong panties.

Our society is teaching 5 year olds in schools not how to have critical thinking skills, or about their Natural Rights, but about *******Sexual Relations********* Go look at social sites, go look at myspace; sexuality for many girls, or young men is occurring at ages never before seen. It is society who is pushing this through many many avenues.

Why is it that girls as young as 12 are dawning the drab of 20 year olds??? With the hormone, and steroidal laced food products they are now hitting puberty at again never before seen ages............The point I am making is to definitively damn someone to hell(so to speak) is not correct because of extenuating circumstance.

Also, If We are going to take skyfloatings hardline approach in a skewed manner, which would include more than Muslims, then almost everyone in Hollywood, and many People on the streets are guilty.

Have ya'll ever seen a Hollywood 15 year old female??? I'll tell ya' what break out the ID professional who can spot fakes a mile off, and cancel the porn shoot that thought she was 30..........

So, sky not to my ramble, but I would like to see a rebuttal to proto.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
People who have been programmed/indoctrinated to be either left-wing or right-wing are severly reality impaired. In this particular thread the results of left-wing-programming are painfully obvious and even shocking to the few citizens left who still have some sanity.

In this thread we have heard how

"it was not actually rape"
"it was consensual"
"arresting Polanski is not good for the victim"
"Punishing the child-rapist = Punishing the victim"
"it is shocking that Polanski was arrested"
"whether child abuse is bad is a matter of opinion"

and other psychopathic voicings.

_______________________________________________

Apart from that there were many wishy-washy "its not about left/right" statements.

Such statements obviously derive from the understanding that left/right is an artificial dichotomy that has no basis in reality. However, billions of people still define themselves as either left or right, and for them it is a reality. And they are programmed to think in certain ways. And this programming can lead to stuff like championing a child-rapist as a hero (left-wing) or championing islamic jihad (those are extreme right-wingers) as a path to peace.

[edit on 1-10-2009 by Skyfloating]

hey, on the other thread about this there is a guy who is a straight up wants to have sex with minors advocate.

You missed the "children are sexual luring predators of poor adults" theme.

One of my favourites.