Global Warming so you think its fake?

reply to post by C0bzz


Its just like people in groups like PETA. PETA: www.petakillsanimals.com...

Originally posted by endisnighe
reply to post by john124

 

It's not news to me, in fact if it turns out to be mostly natural, then we may not be able to prevent climate change.

Aha. Caught you, you said climate change not climate warming.

Line two

Sorry, but climate change was meant as interchangable with "warming" in this context. Although climate change can be any change of the environment, I was specifically referring to "warming". Anyway with that context, my comment should make sense.

reply to post by pavil


err and thats just what "Climate Change" people have done ... tweak the numbers... in todays society numbers = fact... this is not the case it is easier and more practical and probably more truthful to say that no one knows wtf is going on.
Purely a scam plain and simple ... please, do you really believe Al "I invented the Internet" Gore? and even past that theres theories to suggest that the planet was on average 30 degrees warmer in earlier periods.... Global Warming is a fad

[edit on 21-9-2009 by conspiracyrus]

Originally posted by network dude
I have never seen global warming discussed with a religeous point. I don't think science and religion have met in the middle as of yet. But to make sure you understand what is happening, it a cycle. yes it did get warmer. Just as it did in the past. And guess what? I will make a prediction that I assure you will come true. It will get cooler again, and then one day, it will get warmer again. Does that mean we get a free pass to polute the earth? no. that would be stupid to think that. But some real dumb people are making global warming a political issue when it's not. It's just a cycle. A hint of where to look for evidence would be climatic charts over the past 100,000 years. If I gave them to you, it would seem biased. But if you find them on your own, you might actually believe them.

EXhaling the damn air we breath is NOT pollution! It may offend some but that probably has more to do with ones breath. If you want to talk about pollution then make the dialogue ABOUT THAT and quit using global warming as a context for dealing with pollution when it is NOT pollution.

pollution is not exhaling, farting, burping C02. Also, when anyone offers the "big solution" to this myth of man made global warming, the more they try to scare people with it the more they keep saying time is running out the more they think people will act. THEY WON'T! It only makes people angry ESPECIALLY when the solutions these green buffs offer has NOTHING to do with the problem they are trying to fix but to finance pet political projects they have attached to this. So who is really making it a political football. Hell the whole idea is political and why Al Gore is behind much of it.

Global warming is as real as the world ending in 2012,

So if the world is ending in 2012 why worry about global warming.


i have spent the last week going over the temputure records from the navy base at china lake calif for the last 60 years.

The summer temps use to hit 120+ degrees for about 10 to 15 days in the summer.
It has not hit 120 degrees for the last 8 years.

then add that the deserts of the great basin of the US were a lot wetter 5000+ years ago.
and the only way that could happen is that El Niño-Southern Oscillation (ENSO) events happened more offen or were a permanent effect.

Almost all of the heavy rains in the great basin are from the south and happen only in El Nino years.

there are two long term Climate Changes that happen in the great basin of the US.
one os warmer and wetter
and the other is colder and dryer.

12900+years and 5000 to 8000 years ago it was warmer and wetter. and the rain came into the great basin from the south. ("pineapple express" this only happens during El Nino years now.)

12,900 to about 8000 years ago (Younger - Dryas Event)and 5000 years ago to now the climate has been colder and dryer. during the colder and dryer times the storms come in from the gulf of alaska and are blocked by the Sierra Nevada mountains
leaving the great basin colder and dryer.

The 12900+ warmer period ended when researcher believe a Comet hit the earth over canada. this killed off the wooly mammoth and mastodon. and the Clovis people in the great basin and across the north america.

There is no way that mammoth and mastodon could survive in the great basin today it is to dry, but numerous bone sites of both are found in the great basin from before this event.
www.freerepublic.com...
www4.hmc.edu:8001...

Nothing wrong with being "green" although I hate that term, because its so popular. Not being wasteful is good practice, but ido believe global warming is a hoax, to try to get people to be more green. All those save the planet adds in the 80'sand early 90's didn't work so they had to scare the people into it.

reply to post by GenLo

Stereotyped? A little. But more important is this:

What do I do? Well I cannot say I do much.

Exactly my point. Here I am, continually trying to do much, and instead of receiving support in these endeavors I receive higher taxes and more regulation to stop me from them. And in the process I am labeled 'anti-green' because I speak the truth about CO2.

Historical CO2 levels spike after temperature rises, not before. If all of the solar energy received by the planet were reflected as heat, all of the heat absorbed and re-emitted by CO2 would provide enough energy to raise the amount of air above the Arctic Circle by one single degree in 3.5 billion years. The calculations to prove that are right here in another post. CO2 is necessary for plant growth, as another poster so aptly pointed out. And yet still we are continually beseiged by cries of CO2-induced warming!

I haved to go to work, but I will expound more this afternoon.

TheRedneck

reply to post by john124


All you did was repeat what the other person said and pass it off as your own idea... you should think about that.

Is it so hard to just say you agree without 3 paragraphs of selfcomforting babble?

reply to post by GenLo


Sounds like a new age argument to me.

Thats all folks.

Originally posted by GenLo
reply to post by the siren

 

And what of the heat trapped by the C02 in the atmosphere, is that not having an effect?

The below article answers your question far better than I could...
CO2 Absorption Spectrum

Again, if it is all a natural cycle, what is driving the natural cycle?

And for those who claim we are arrogant to think that we could not possibly effect the Earth, is like an alcoholic denying they have a problem.

I will paste the examples I have used from another thread on example of horrendous env. acts. What people fail to consider is, there is the pollution degradation that we can actually measure, that may actually be reported. Do you really think that all companies report everything they do? There is probably twice as much contamination of things we don't know about.

The Three Gorges Dam built in China has displaced so much water it actually added a second to the Earth's rotation every year.


The project will also cause devastating environmental damage, increasing the risk of earthquakes and landslides. It will also threaten the riverþs wildlife. In addition to massive fish species, it will also affect endangered species, including the Yangtze dolphin, the Chinese Sturgeon, the Chinese Tiger, the Chinese Alligator, the Siberian Crane, and the Giant Panda. Moreover, silt trapped behind the dam will not only deprive downstream regions, but also will impede power generation from the back-up. Construction of the dam would require extensive logging in the area. Finally, the dam and the reservoir will destroy some of Chinaþs finest scenery and an important source of tourism revenue.


Yea, a human project that adds a second to the Earth's rotation. And we couldn't possibly effect the Earth.



Ocean City inlet, MD, is one of the most striking examples of the unintended consequences of engineered inlets causing increased erosion of adjacent barrier islands downdrift from the jettied inlet. The Ocean City inlet opened during a 1933 hurricane, and soon after, the twin stone jetties were built by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers (USACE) to maintain the inlet for navigation. However, the jetties also severely disrupted littoral-inlet processes, trapped sand on the north side of Fenwick Island (site of the Ocean City amusement park and parking lot), and severely starved Assateague Island National Seashore to the south of sand. The result of almost 70 years of disrupted sand transport along the coast has been an offset in the two barrier islands—Fenwick and Assateague—by approximately 1 km, along with accelerated erosion, reduction and alteration in beach-berm heights, and loss of critical beach and dune habitats. The effects attributable to the jetties have extended about 15 km southward from the inlet.


If you ever visit beautiful Assateauge Island or National Seashore, at night you stand on the beach you see the blaring lights of OC which sit a km out into the ocean now because of erosion. It looks odd, considering they are supposed to be one 47 mile long island/peninsula till they get to Delaware.

link


Basically now the Mississippi, which worked fine on its own for who knows how long, is an artificially regulated river.
Levees were put in to control flooding, then they realized they needed the flooding, and more structures had to be created to control the flooding.

The mighty Mississippi is now controlled by humans.


In addition to the flooding problem, engineers now face problems caused by the lack of flooding. The channelization produced by the levees and control structures deprives natural wetlands of the sediments normally deposited during flooding. Wetlands rely on sediments from distributaries and flooding to counteract subsidence, the compaction of sediments under their own weight. Water flows faster in subsidized areas, and distributaries can rapidly expand into wide channels, causing wetlands to disappear under the influx of water. The coastal marshes of Louisiana provide a natural barrier against the erosion causes by the fierce storms which often come from the Gulf. Because of the loss of these wetlands, the Louisiana coast has receded several thousands of feet over the past few decades, and commercial fishermen have also been deprived of a ready source of income. Most of the problems resulting from the levee system, including wetland degradation, stem from channelization. While the levee system could not be scrapped without a large financial loss, the USACE realized that diversion structures could help alleviate some of the problems caused by channelization. Diversion structures diminish some of the force of flood waters and the likelihood of crevasses (breaks in the levee) by providing flood waters with established escape routes. The first diversion structure, the Bonnet Carre Spillway, was built in response to the great flood of 1927. It was designed to discharge excess flood waters into Lake Pontchartrain and thence into the Gulf of Mexico.


link

In the 1870s hunters managed to to kill 6 million buffalo, almost eradicating a species.

In ten years! With just guns.


buffaloes were so thick in western Kansas that an immense herd held up u Kansas Pacific train for nine hours while it crossed the track



By the way, all that prairie we hard about on Little House on the Prairie? And that all that buffalo ran across?

Only 1% of it remains.


That massive prairie ran from Texas through Canada.

There is a 17 mile ring around Chernobyl of land that can't even be touched by humans for 200 years. Animals died and stopped reproducing.

There are ten miles of the red forest of trees that dies shortly after the accident.

The radioactive fallout was found as far as Sweden.

I will leave you with the Great Sparrow campaign:


The campaign was initiated by Mao Zedong, the first President of the People's Republic of China. Sparrows were included on the list because they ate grain seeds, causing disruption to agriculture. It was decided that all the peasants in China should bang pots and pans and run around to make the sparrows fly away in fear. Sparrow nests were torn down, eggs were broken, and nestlings were killed.[1] Initially, the campaign did improve the harvest. By April 1960 the National Academy of Science found that sparrows ate insects more than seeds. Mao declared "forget it" (Chinese: 算了; pinyin: suàn le), and ordered the end of the campaign against sparrows.[1] By this time, however, it was too late. With no sparrows to eat them, locust populations ballooned, swarming the country and compounding the problems already caused by the Great Leap Forward and adverse weather conditions, leading to the Great Chinese Famine in which around 30 million people died of starvation

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Hi,

The last time we had a nice planet wide heat wave it was so good for Europe ( and India/China) that we can still visit the cathedrals and castle's they built during that great age. Needless to say we didn't cause that one and needless to say the historic evidence suggests very strongly that increase in temperature we are discussing is fantastic for crop production as well as general growth in biomass.

If we still feel the need to insist on blaming 'humanity' please remember that we never chose capitalism as global economic model and that average human beings do actually vote with their feet and money for protecting their environment to the best of their abilities. The fact that WE are being ignored and trampled under the profit motivated industrialist system is only being blame on 'US' because 'they' ( those who's banks we just bailed out, AGAIN!) refuse to give up their control mechanism called capitalism.

Stellar

reply to post by GenLo

OK, I am back from work. Now where were we? Oh, yes...

Once I get out of the military I don't really plan to do much else since I will be studying to learn a new language and hopefully within 6 months head out to Japan to backpack cross country from Tokyo to Kyoto.

Sounds like fun! I hope it goes well for you. I'll be conserving the planet while you play walkabout.

Maybe when I have settled down in a place where I can do some of the same things you are doing I can mention them in my egotistical repertoire...

Egotistical repertoire? Hmmm....

...however if I ever mention it in an argument to show that I am better than someone...

Hmmmmmmmm.................

...I'll make sure that they aren't someone whose life span is less than 30 years. Not saying a 22 y/o is incapable of doing things similar or better but its generally uncommon.

It appears a 22 y/o is very good at doing one thing: being hypocritical.

You started this thread with an absolute condemnation of anyone who wasn't being 'green' enough to suit your particular bent. You ranted about how we are destroying the planet and how Christians and Global Warming deniers in particular don't care about the planet. I then informed you of how I live, what I actually am physically doing to try and preserve one little spot on the planet. Now you insinuate that I am somehow trying to be better than you because I answered your OP?

The thing is, I wouldn't waste my energy trying to be better than you; I apparently already am. At least I am honest and take responsibility for what I say. You prefer to rant and rave against those who are doing what you cry about us needing, all the while dreaming of walking around the country doing absolutely nothing yourself. You hide behind your age; at 22 I was already setting my place up. You complain about me being 'egotistical'; apparently you need a dictionary. 'Egotistical' does not equal ' of a different belief or opinion'.

It is people like you who are directly responsible for much of the problems we face today. Grow up and start taking responsibility for your own problems.

TheRedneck

reply to post by nixie_nox


What drove climate change thousands of years past?
What is warming the other planets in the Solar System?

Our trees are not dieing because of more CO2. They “eat” that stuff for a living.
It is the nefarious chemicals we are spraying everywhere that are killing them. (and us)
If the Gov. or anyone is taking the CO2 matter seriously why isn’t there a huge effort to plant more trees?

I am a tree hugger. I weep for all the trees that die in the fires. It takes so long for them to grow.
I also love Rocks. Especially Red Granite Rocks. I have one that I brought from Wisconsin where I used to live, sitting on my table.

The tax is not meant to help the climate in any way. It is a punishment levied on consumers who are adding to the wealth of the oil Barons. Looks kind of self-defeating from their point of view, but then I guess they must get a cut of that "tax" money. You know, government subsidy.

Personally, I think it is just a gimmic to further destroy the American Middle Class.

Another thing that could prove that “they” are totally serious would be to have a massive propaganda campaign to curtail population increase, since more humans will only add to the perceived problem which supposedly was corrected by using less fossil fuels by those already here. It should have been in place for at least 10 years. You see, they are not serious. They seem to like the blood bath and attendant miseries that wars bring better.

The holes in the Ozone layer were caused from 2 things. One the aerial A-bomb “tests” done in the late 40’s and early 50’s; and two- Haarp burned and blew away a large section of the atmosphere in their “tests”. It looks to me like there is a concerted effort on the part of TPTB to destroy the Earth. And you wonder what happened to Mars?

Is there any proof that Carbon reaches that high into the atmosphere?
It is heavy and sinks. You can’t check for yourself, so you must believe what “they” tell you. Lies, more lies. Can you think of the last time the governments or its agencies told you the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

Tossing garbage in the back yard? Yes, absolutely. I have a compost container. I put all decayable matter on or in the ground to decompose. We don’t burn, so cartons and most papers go to trash pick-up. Some newspapers and paper towels go into the compost.

ok this has always bugged me about Global warming. I do not disagree with the process, but tell me if im incorrect, how can the ice melting cause flooding, when the ice already raised the sea level in just being there. To explain, if you put an ice cube in a glass of water, the level will raise, but the ice melts it will not raise no more. Surely this is the same scenario, on a much larger scale

GenLo
posted on 21-9-2009 @ 12:38 AM

To me though, this whole "going green" thing is more than just about reducing emmisions, its about our farming and agriculture, and how we use resources on the planet. Again reform needs to be made regardless of whether or not global warming is occuring because I am 100% sure that if in another 100 years our population were to grow in the exponetial rate that it did in these past 100 years without a shift in conciousness or environment supportive technologies our species would not last because our Earth would not last.

Ah, our farming and agriculture, do you mean the genetically modified foods the the big agro farms are spewing out? It seems that a Lot of the smaller farms and farmers are being forced off their land so that the Big Agro Businesses can come in and grow foods I wouldn't want to feed my dead dog.
I guess we should be like China? One child per family? How do you propose we limit our population?
I agree that we need to do something about the waste and trash we produce, so what is your solution?
What is an Environmental Support Technology?

I don't know why our Govt. is hawking this global warming, and yes they changed to "climate change" when it became obvious that the planet Was Not Warming.
I think this is just one more way the government(s) can controll us. And give their corporate buddies a Lot of Money! Well wind turbines and the converters are not cheep, neither are the Solar Panels and the converters for them. A heat pump is well out of my reach, I don't know about you. The Cap and Trade is a Joke on the people and just there to get more tax money and again the big Bucks for the Corporations.

Earth Changes that is just a fact.
Species come and go, they always have and they always will. There is nothing MAN can do to stop it.
Please go and research the "not Government Sponsered" climatologists and see what they are saying.
Also check Earth History go back thousands of years you will learn a lot that you apparently do not know.
Never take someones word as Truth, Investigate everything yourself and always make sure you look at different sources.

edit to ad who I was quoting

[edit on 21-9-2009 by Iseekthetruth!!!!!!!!]

Anyone that doesn't see that the planet is warming is simply uneducated or just doesn't care. there is way to much goin on globally to not understand. However I should also state that there are many out there that haven't been keepin up with the facts and can't see the truth.

reply to post by TheRedneck


Well you're a funny one. Interesting how you jump in to assume the type of situation I have been living in.

Ok so not so much egotistical, more of an arrogance. You propose that I have done nothing, I have not done nothing, but I have done considerably less than what you have done and I already honestly admitted that to which you recklessly took and pointed out. I am not going to spill my short life story about what I did in the past because frankly it doesn't matter, much of what I did in the past doesn't go much beyond high school level, and where is that an accomplishment? I already surmised that my age plays a large factor in what choices I have been making during my life time and that the same goes for others of such an early age, I hate repeating myself and sounding like I am making excuses, but my life situations have dictated where and what I am in life today.

NO, the main idea of this thread was that most conspiracy theorists don't believe in global warming. I clearly stated that I posted this topic to collect information on other people comments. If I have to edit the OP I will, making it clear that, (here I go repeating myself again ) the responses stated were from personal exchanges with friends and family members and guess what they were all xtian! So sorry about that!

I did put those remarks in there for a reason, to find out either if their were other xtians who thought the same way or not! It was something that I just thought was concerning and that there is apparently a population of xtians in the world who think that way, whats funny is that your name would probably apply to many of them, Redneck. Hey but lets not get personal mmk ?

You know if that's what you described as a hypocrite then it looks like you are also describing yourself, of course I could be wrong, I am only jumping to conclusions just like you did.

Originally posted by Iseekthetruth!!!!!!!!
GenLo
posted on 21-9-2009 @ 12:38 AM

Ah, our farming and agriculture, do you mean the genetically modified foods the the big agro farms are spewing out? It seems that a Lot of the smaller farms and farmers are being forced off their land so that the Big Agro Businesses can come in and grow foods I wouldn't want to feed my dead dog.
I guess we should be like China? One child per family? How do you propose we limit our population?
I agree that we need to do something about the waste and trash we produce, so what is your solution?
What is an Environmental Support Technology?

Indeed, its pretty sad what has been happening to our farmers across the nation being pushed out by corporations like Monsanto.

Like china, not to such an extreme, however I am not in favor of families with more than four children. What is the point of having such a large family anymore? We don't live in a time where half of them will die before they reach age 20 so to have such large families these days is just disgusting and I despise my moron mormon family members for having such large numbers.

What is my solution? That is quite a hefty question to ask because really there is so many waste problems to look at. Take the aircraft graveyard for example. All that tons of metal just sitting there to rust, while companies just go on gathering more. For me to come up with a single solution would be a ridiculous request, I don't have the background or the funding for it.

Environmental Support Technology, I am glad you asked, to go into more detail its all about the technology that allows energy to be made without producing waste or significantly improve methods like farming. For example one of the most awesome things I looked at was Vertical Farming set up in a sky scraper!

I am not going to respond to the rest of your post in the hopes that these answers will allow further responses to be more civil.

reply to post by Lil Drummerboy

^^^^^^^^^^

*Is about to be met with a tidal wave of angry posting.*

*ducks for cover*