Ahmadinejad's quote

بايد از صفحه روزگار محو شود

This was the phrase Ahmadinejad said and the meaning is all the time exagerated and manipulated infront of our own eyes just to get the right excuse to destroy Iran as to gain complete control of the Middle East by Israel after the fall of Iraq which was again wanted by the Zionist Regime.

We must take this seriously since its the main motive used to get an excuse for an attack another nation in front of the World...remember..we mostly agree that 9/11 was used to attack Iraq and Afghanistan we must not let them do this again

Ahmadinejad was quoting the Ayatollah Khomeini in the specific speech under discussion: what he said was that "the occupation regime over Jerusalem should vanish from the page of time." No state action is envisaged in this lament; it denotes a spiritual wish, whereas the erroneous translation—"wipe Israel off the map"—suggests a military threat. There is a huge chasm between the correct and the incorrect translations. The notion that Iran can "wipe out" U.S.-backed, nuclear-armed Israel is ludicrous

Speaking at a D-8 summit meeting in July 2008, when asked to comment on whether he has called for the destruction of Israel he denied that his country would ever instigate military action, there being "no need for any measures by the Iranian people". Instead he claimed that "the Zionist regime" in Israel would eventually collapse on its own. "I assure you... there won't be any war in the future," both the BBC and AP quoted him as saying

On May 8 2006, Israel's Second Vice Prime Minister Shimon Peres said in an interview with Reuters that "the president of Iran should remember that Iran can also be wiped off the map," Army Radio reported.[45] In 1981, Israeli fighter jets bombed Osirak, Iraq’s nuclear reactor, severely damaging that country's nuclear weapons program. Today, however, experts state that a similar attack on Iran's nuclear facilities is unlikely, given that Iran's nuclear program is spread out across numerous locations, including some sites that are buried deep enough underground that they are thought to be safe from aerial strikes

Ahmadinejad's statement by the United States and other Western countries is an attempt to divert attention from "the ever-increasing crimes the Zionists are committing against the innocent Palestinians."

Mahmoud Ahmadinejad and Israel

What Ahmadinejad really said and why this broken record is just another ad slogan for war

Ahmadinejad Did Not Say - "Wipe Israel Off The Map"

Why people just cant live in peace, we are very close of a Global Conflict never seen before, many will parish, our families will suffer, our lands are going to be destroyed, why all this seem inevitable? Why World Peace is so difficult to obtain...i dont want things to change...we thank you Scientists for inventing such bombs instead of inventing new propultion systems etc.....i wish something new in life too...but an Alien contact is much nicer than WW3

Mod Edit: Changed thread title to English.

[edit on 16-9-2009 by Gemwolf]

Important that this has been marked out. it is common known that this was a miss interpretation. It has been used by everyone to make a claim that Iran wants to nuke Israel off the map.

In the cold war, did the west not want to wipe Communism off the map? It didn't mean the west wanted to destroy every communist country.

Not sure what to say or think but the wayback machine has this archived page from the official, state-operated news agency of Iran, www.iribnews.ir:

Tehran, Oct 26 - Iran's President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad on Wednesday called for Israel to be "wiped off the map".

"The establishment of the Zionist regime was a move by the world oppressor against the Islamic world," the President told a conference in Tehran entitled 'the world without Zionism'.

If the Iran's own news service says he said it, what does that imply?

Wikipedia footnotes
Sorry, but you'll have to scroll up to the References section, then click on link in #1 to view the archive.org page.

sorry for all the edits.
[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]

[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]

[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]

[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]

Depending on the interpretation, he either said that "Israel should be wiped from the map" or that the "Zionists should be wiped from the pages of history".

The fact that you find EITHER interpretation acceptable is astonishing.

The implication is the same. He's threatening war. He's threatening invasion. However you dress it up or excuse it. That is NOT acceptable rhetoric from the leader of a supposedly civilized country and a member of the UN.

Your own choice of the words "Zionist Regime" to describe Israel also gives a big clue to your own agenda. In those two words you seek to de-legitimize and demonize an elected Western government, much as Ahmadinejad does. So who is really banging on the war drums here?

reply to post by mattpryor


I used "Zionist Regime" since I dont beleive that the Israelis are evil persons...the civilians are just like us..they got families, work etc...the regime wants destruction and war thats why I pointed out like that...i got nothing againt the Israeli people..i got everything against though those people with only one purpose in mid...war

reply to post by heineken


Israel is a democracy. The "civilians" elected the government.

The "civilians" serve in the IDF and IAF (they have national service).

The civilians live in Israel, which I suppose makes them Zionists does it not?

The word "regime" infers illegitimacy. The Israeli government and military has a popular mandate.

He's talking about the Israeli people. He's talking about Jews.

Originally posted by mattpryor
Depending on the interpretation, he either said that "Israel should be wiped from the map" or that the "Zionists should be wiped from the pages of history".

The fact that you find EITHER interpretation acceptable is astonishing.

The implication is the same. He's threatening war. He's threatening invasion. However you dress it up or excuse it. That is NOT acceptable rhetoric from the leader of a supposedly civilized country and a member of the UN.

Your own choice of the words "Zionist Regime" to describe Israel also gives a big clue to your own agenda. In those two words you seek to de-legitimize and demonize an elected Western government, much as Ahmadinejad does. So who is really banging on the war drums here?

I hope you're not confusing me with the article I quoted. If so, I am going to clarify that what I did was quote the opening and first paragraph of a news report from Iran's official news agency. Beyond that, I see a lot of creative interpretation including this from the wikipedia page the OP quoted from:

All official translations of Mr. Ahmadinejad's statement, including a description of it on his website, refer to wiping Israel away. Sohrab Mahdavi, one of Iran’s most prominent translators, and Siamak Namazi, managing director of a Tehran consulting firm, who is bilingual, both say “wipe off” or “wipe away” is more accurate than "vanish" because the Persian verb is active and transitive.

Given that, I think it is more likely he said it than not but... I don't speak the language so I think all eyes are deserving to watch this situation and should be prepared for all potential outcomes while trying to prevent the undesirable ones.

reply to post by abecedarian


No, my comments were directed to the OP. I gave your post a star.

Apologies for the confusion.

Originally posted by mattpryor
reply to post by abecedarian

 

No, my comments were directed to the OP. I gave your post a star.

Apologies for the confusion.

All's good.
line 2

reply to post by mattpryor


you dont even realized this thread is a cry for peace...but you know what..the world is starting to ask questions..is starting to ask why you commited war crimes against innocent palestinian people...the world knows the dromes used are so technologically advanced that they cant go wrong and you targeted civilians by purpose...the world also knows how you used children as human shields...the world also knows you are behind th e9/11 attacks...the world also knows you are the only country with nuclear weapons in the middle east after you tried to hide it for 20 years..the world also knows what your religion states on your faith and global domniation...you dont even try to hear the word peace but peace will prevail my friend...if not..i hope i will have the chance to fight against you because i will not go down without a fight...i will give my blood to my country and i shall be on the front line thinking of my loved ones whilst rejecting your politics

Originally posted by heineken
reply to post by mattpryor

 

I used "Zionist Regime" since I dont beleive that the Israelis are evil persons...the civilians are just like us..they got families, work etc...the regime wants destruction and war thats why I pointed out like that...i got nothing againt the Israeli people..i got everything against though those people with only one purpose in mid...war

uhh...when israel is left alone, they do not start a war...all 4 wars against israel were started by islamic countries attacking israel...it's that simple.

israel doesn't want to take over syria, and hasn't...israel doesn't want to take over jordan, and hasn't...israel doesn't want to take over lebanon and hasn't...israel doesn't want to take over egypt, and hasn't

all four of those countries at some time, HAS WANTED to take over israel and have tried...

this is not hard to understand.

Originally posted by heineken
reply to post by mattpryor

 

...you dont even try to hear the word peace but peace will prevail my friend...if not..i hope i will have the chance to fight against you because i will not go down without a fight...i will give my blood to my country and i shall be on the front line thinking of my loved ones whilst rejecting your politics

That's not really very peaceful talk is it Heineken? Step down a little bit my fellow beer lover.

I want peace too. The thought of war is horrific to me. I like a cushy life. And if war comes, there's no guarantees that my country will be on the same side as I am.

But I don't want Iran to have nukes. Ever. Because when despots, Jew haters and religious control-freaks like the Iranian Mullahs have nukes the West (including Malta) will lose the balance of power for a long, long time and many dark days will follow for all of us.

Although I am well aware of the rules on ATS regarding English being used, I felt that the Arabic title of this thread was actually appropriate - I know it certainly made me look at the thread. Perhaps the mods might be nice enough to allow it and change it back.....

Its happening;
the web bot predictions are comming true

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by Kryties
Although I am well aware of the rules on ATS regarding English being used, I felt that the Arabic title of this thread was actually appropriate - I know it certainly made me look at the thread. Perhaps the mods might be nice enough to allow it and change it back.....

LOL...it was good until it lasted

I agree with original poster

There are NO words in the Iranian language for "wiping Israel off the map" - instead it was very poetic wording as is common to the language.

Hoping that Israel will "disappear with the sands of time"

.....is surely better than Israel's implied:

"we will launch tactical nuclear warheads upon thee"?

Copy and paste the original language and head down to your nearest Mosque and ask.

BTW do we have source for these quotes by Israel's Ariel Sharon held on Rense.com:

"Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001

Thanks

Bravo

Originally posted by Bravo111
I agree with original poster

There are NO words in the Iranian language for "wiping Israel off the map" - instead it was very poetic wording as is common to the language.

Hoping that Israel will "disappear with the sands of time"

.....is surely better than Israel's implied:

"we will launch tactical nuclear warheads upon thee"?

Copy and paste the original language and head down to your nearest Mosque and ask.

BTW do we have source for these quotes by Israel's Ariel Sharon held on Rense.com:

"Every time we do something you tell me America will do this and will do that . . . I want to tell you something very clear: Don't worry about American pressure on Israel. We, the Jewish people, control America, and the Americans know it." - Israeli Prime Minister, Ariel Sharon, October 3, 2001

Thanks

Bravo

now thats a cool statement..bravo bravo111..i will search for it

Originally posted by heinekennow thats a cool statement..bravo bravo111..i will search for it

Did you find it?

I Googled and found Stormfront as the first result. Dated Oct 4, 2001. The starter of the thread does not list a source for his information. The next day he/she posts www.iap.org (Islamic Association for Palestine) as the source of his posting and the another poster suggests the source appears to be yahoo groups address here posted on Oct. 3, 2001 which itself quotes no sources. An attempt to access the www.iap.org site this morning returned a 'parked' domain offering links Russian and Jewish women and such. Looking over at web.archive.org, there are no archives of the site between July 10 and October 12, and since the IAP site is now offline, no way to search that site. BUT, if you take the October 12 site, click on the link to the right under the "other news stories" header, the one that states "Oct. 10th Headlines", you get to another web.archive.org page that has a link on it to "Earlier news archives" which takes you to... groups.yahoo.com and sure enough, in the list on Oct 3, is the groups.yahoo.com post mentioned above.

But let's go to another site for a moment.... Camera (Committee for Accurate Middle East Reporting in America) says the following:

Syndicated Columnist Georgie Anne Geyer Uses Fabricated Sharon Quote



In a May 10, 2002 column (“Now Isn’t the Time for Bush League Moves”), nationally-syndicated columnist Georgie Anne Geyer included bogus and inflammatory allegations against Prime Minister Sharon and Israel’s supporters in America.

First, she wrote:

In fact, it [American support for Israel’s actions] led Prime Minister Sharon to tell his Cabinet recently, “I control America.”

CAMERA conducted extensive Nexis and Internet searches, and found that no mainstream news organization reported as true the fabricated quotation.

The hoax originated with an October 3, 2001 press release from the pro-Hamas group, the Islamic Association for Palestine.

and

According to the IAP press release, the statement was reported on Kol Yisrael. However, CAMERA’s calls to Kol Yisrael confirmed that no such broadcast occurred.

and

UPDATE (June 15, 2002): Geyer Expresses "Regrets"
CAMERA notified Geyer’s editors that the Sharon “quote” originated on a pro-Hamas website (the Islamic Association for Palestine), and that it had not been corroborated by any reputable media organization. CAMERA also pointed out that IAP’s alleged source, a report on Israel radio, is apparently fictional – Kol Yisrael denied to CAMERA that it had ever broadcast any such report.

When CAMERA requested substantiation from Geyer, the columnist first asserted that she was abroad and would have to check her notes when she got back home in June. After CAMERA contacted editor Bruce Dold of the Chicago Tribune (which ran the Geyer column), he replied:

Ms. Geyer does indeed cite the same sources you note [an Islamic Association for Palestine press release that claimed Kol Yisrael radio reported the Sharon statement] on the Sharon quote. If you have a statement or confirmation from Kol Yisrael, I’d like to see it. As for the second point [concerning the alleged television ads], that is not a direct quote from an ad, but Geyer’s own interpretation of the nature of the content.

Informed that the Kol Yisrael reporter assigned to cover the Israeli Cabinet [where the Sharon statement was alleged to have been made] denied Sharon had made the attributed comment, Dold responded with a different story from Geyer. She now claimed that her sources were two anonymous Israelis.

Finally, Geyer’s syndicate disseminated the following Editor’s Note which appeared on June 14 in the Chicago Tribune and Sarasota Herald Tribune and will likely be published by other papers that ran Geyer’s May 10 column.

Editor’s note: Georgie Anne Geyer’s May 10 column included a quote from Ariel Sharon, 'I control America.’ This quote was widely reported in the Palestinian press but cannot be confirmed in independent sources. Geyer and Universal Press Syndicate regret not having attributed the quote more specifically.

While the syndicate thus admitted that “This quote...cannot be confirmed in independent sources,” it failed to state unambiguously that Sharon never uttered the words and that the alleged quotation first appeared in a press release from the pro-Hamas IAP. Since IAP said that Kol Yisrael was their source and Kol Yisrael denies broadcasting any such report, there should be no question that IAP was attempting to perpetrate a hoax. The syndicate also should have written “alleged quote” whenever referring to the supposed statement by Sharon.

Furthermore, the Editor’s Note implies that the problem was one merely of mistaken attribution – that it would have been acceptable for Geyer to use the bogus quotation had she cited “Palestinian sources.” Obviously, since these sources have been proven false, the quote should not have been published at all.

Additionally, the Editor’s Note fails entirely to address the other baseless assertion in Geyer’s May 10 column, her outrageous statement: “Look at U.S. television: One minute, you see pro-Israeli ads saying the Arabs are all dogs...”

Repeated CAMERA requests for Geyer to identify the specific ad that led to her “interpretation” have gone unanswered. Clearly there is no way that her readers could have understood that she was “interpreting” rather than paraphrasing or quoting from a supposed ad. Since it is extremely unlikely that any “U.S. television” station would have broadcast any such ad, Geyer and her syndicate owe her readers another “Editor’s Note” or apology.

It appears the comment on Rense on other sites is a fabrication that has pepetuated through some channels of the media and is being presented as fact. Therefore, if one contends that Ahmadinejad didn't say what Iran's news said he said, one must also admit that the alleged statement by Sharon is untrue because the Kol Yisrael reporter quoted in the IAP (yahoo group) article has said Sharon didn't say that.

But who would you believe first- Iran's own news agency or a biased yahoo! group?

[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]

Would F&S if I could. The smoke clears whilst getting cloudier at the same time.

Would be interested to see the Rense.com response if you were to formally send rense.com your research and outline the implications (implying you would post the rense response or lack thereof via associated press) - this would surely flush some more facts out and a case for or against Yahoo Forum vs IAP (or others for that matter).

I spent time in the middle east, have many arab and israeli friends and colleagues. The average Iranian wakes every morning, scoffs his cornflakes and worries how to make ends meet at the end of every month just as many of us do and has little if any appetite for war.

Thanks

Bravo



[edit on 16-9-2009 by Bravo111]

reply to post by Bravo111
You're more than welcome to start your own thread or such. And nothing stopped you from 'star'ing my post so it seems a half-hearted gesture, maybe some concession to get me to shut up?

It's so easy for someone on the Internet to say something and have it go viral. Once it goes viral, seems too many people mis-take it for truth without question. Oddly, it's those pre-disposed to that point of view that do the most mis-taking.

I'm not going to submit it to Rense. For some reason, I feel that others will point it out. After all, ATS is on the Internet and I found it... there should be at least someone who listens to Rense that is smart enough to question what they hear / read and will take it and run. After all, when I listen(ed) to C2C and Dreamland, I never assumed what I heard was the truth and always did my own investigations when something I heard went a little out-of-bounds... so why should I be the only one?

Here's the ball- going to run with it?



[edit on 9/16/2009 by abecedarian]